Is the XL2 really comig on end of the year? at DVinfo.net

DVSHOOTER · March 9th, 2003, 06:35 PM

In his www.Pixelmonger.com website, Scott Billups says:
"Canon will introduce the XL2 by the end of 2003 and even though the JVC will throw up more pixels, the new XL series will blow it away with its native 16 X 9, third generation chips, multiple frame rates (including 24P and more importantly 30P ) and most importantly ... the ability to use a manual lens. "

Scott is a very high end professional and is a beta tester for many companies and he's well known to be always inside the scoop of things. If it's true, I can barely wait for this camera. I hope they mention something on NAB 2003 already. Can you image this XL2 with a P+S mini35 and a set of Zeis? It will be insane.

Cheers

Jeff Donald · March 9th, 2003, 07:12 PM

If Scott Billups really knew what Canon is developing, he would be under a Nondisclosure Agreement. NDA's protect the companies trade secrets and are enforceable in court. Employees get fired and pay heavy civil penalties for violating the agreements and the awards have stood up under appeal.

Mr. Billups is just engaging in speculation like the rest of us. If he really knew, he wouldn't be saying. It sure would be nice if at least some of his wish list came true.

Chris Hurd · March 9th, 2003, 07:36 PM

Canon has an established track record of not mentioning new products until they're ready to ship. When you see big rebates on existing models, that's when you know something new is coming within 4 to 6 weeks from that announcement. Hope this helps,

Don Palomaki · March 10th, 2003, 04:54 AM

Late 2002 would make the XL1S about 2 yers old? Canon's track record is about 3 years with their top-of-the-line models, but 2 might fit given that the XL1s was an incremental change to the XL1.

Interesting to note that that Supervideo has nothing to say about an XL2 in the near future.

Frank Granovski · March 10th, 2003, 05:46 AM

DVShooter. Non of us know when the XL1S replacement will come. But when Canon drops the price or offers a huge rebate, you'll know it'll be coming within a month or so. Chris mentioned this, and from what I noticed over the years, this is exactly what Canan does. If you're worried that a new version is around the corner, don't buy anything new, and just wait. In fact, wait for the announcements at NAB.

Oh, and about Ken..., he's one smart fellow---a lot smarter than me; and a hell of a nice guy to boot.

Alex Dunn · March 11th, 2003, 11:51 AM

All that being said, I'm still drooling just a bit. A canon with native 16x9 AND 24 fps, man I really hope it's true.

Ken Tanaka · March 11th, 2003, 12:13 PM

I apologize for my strong remarks regarding Scott Billups. (I've removed them from this thread since they did not significantly add to its information content.) I have a strong aversion to Billups' style which I will keep to myself in the future.

My apologies.

Pete Balistrieri · March 18th, 2003, 08:03 PM

If this new camera would have 24p mode, and you shot something that was trasferred to 35mm. Would you not be better served to shoot in native NTSC 60i?

It is my understanding that the frame movie mode is great if you intend to watch it in on video playback and not transferred to film and projected.

Keep in mind I know nothing, but want to learn.

Robert Knecht Schmidt · March 18th, 2003, 08:07 PM

The reason why the current XL1's Frame Movie Mode is not suitable for footage meant for film transfer is precisely because it's 30P, not 24P. (Or more precisely, 29.98P vs. 23.976P.)

Temporal resampling postprocessing algorithms have more material to work with when the footage is 60i. But if the footage is native 24P to begin with, no such resampling is necessary.

Pete Balistrieri · March 19th, 2003, 11:33 AM

The only hurdle then would be to have a Final Cut Pro that would handle 24P, Correct?

For Editing on your computer.

Ken Tanaka · March 19th, 2003, 11:43 AM

FCP can already handle 24P. See Adam Wilt's presentation for detailed workflow information.

Peter Moore · March 23rd, 2003, 10:00 AM

I can't imagine Canon will not go HD at this point. JVC's camera is supposed to be about $3000 -

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=238461&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

If Canon is going to charge MORE for an XL2, then don't you think it needs to be HD? In any case, I'll wait for Canon's 3-chip HD cam rather than go with JVC's. I have not been hearing or seeing good things about the new JVC model.

Dylan Couper · March 23rd, 2003, 11:36 AM

I don't think it needs to be HD. I just think it needs to have a better picture than the other cameras.

Marcus Farrar · March 25th, 2003, 08:07 AM

I would love to see the XL2 come with a manual lens. When I get it I sure will not want to pay for that old stock lens. I could never get used to that focus ring on the standard lens. I guess the viewfinder could use a little work also. I really don't see them doing a flip out screen but I never really got into that anyway.

Marcus

John Threat · March 26th, 2003, 06:32 AM

yeah, i hope they avoid the flip out screen. it takes up resources needed for other things.

March 9th, 2003, 06:35 PM	#1
DVSHOOTER New Boot Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 9	Is the XL2 really comig on end of the year? In his www.Pixelmonger.com website, Scott Billups says: "Canon will introduce the XL2 by the end of 2003 and even though the JVC will throw up more pixels, the new XL series will blow it away with its native 16 X 9, third generation chips, multiple frame rates (including 24P and more importantly 30P ) and most importantly ... the ability to use a manual lens. " Scott is a very high end professional and is a beta tester for many companies and he's well known to be always inside the scoop of things. If it's true, I can barely wait for this camera. I hope they mention something on NAB 2003 already. Can you image this XL2 with a P+S mini35 and a set of Zeis? It will be insane. Cheers

March 9th, 2003, 07:12 PM	#2
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	If Scott Billups really knew what Canon is developing, he would be under a Nondisclosure Agreement. NDA's protect the companies trade secrets and are enforceable in court. Employees get fired and pay heavy civil penalties for violating the agreements and the awards have stood up under appeal. Mr. Billups is just engaging in speculation like the rest of us. If he really knew, he wouldn't be saying. It sure would be nice if at least some of his wish list came true. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

March 9th, 2003, 07:36 PM	#3
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,366 Images: 513	Canon has an established track record of not mentioning new products until they're ready to ship. When you see big rebates on existing models, that's when you know something new is coming within 4 to 6 weeks from that announcement. Hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

March 11th, 2003, 12:13 PM	#7
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Mea Culpa I apologize for my strong remarks regarding Scott Billups. (I've removed them from this thread since they did not significantly add to its information content.) I have a strong aversion to Billups' style which I will keep to myself in the future. My apologies. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

March 18th, 2003, 08:03 PM	#8
Pete Balistrieri Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 26	Tangent If this new camera would have 24p mode, and you shot something that was trasferred to 35mm. Would you not be better served to shoot in native NTSC 60i? It is my understanding that the frame movie mode is great if you intend to watch it in on video playback and not transferred to film and projected. Keep in mind I know nothing, but want to learn.

March 10th, 2003, 04:54 AM	#4
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,487	Late 2002 would make the XL1S about 2 yers old? Canon's track record is about 3 years with their top-of-the-line models, but 2 might fit given that the XL1s was an incremental change to the XL1. Interesting to note that that Supervideo has nothing to say about an XL2 in the near future.

March 10th, 2003, 05:46 AM	#5
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	DVShooter. Non of us know when the XL1S replacement will come. But when Canon drops the price or offers a huge rebate, you'll know it'll be coming within a month or so. Chris mentioned this, and from what I noticed over the years, this is exactly what Canan does. If you're worried that a new version is around the corner, don't buy anything new, and just wait. In fact, wait for the announcements at NAB. Oh, and about Ken..., he's one smart fellow---a lot smarter than me; and a hell of a nice guy to boot.

March 11th, 2003, 11:51 AM	#6
Alex Dunn Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 202	All that being said, I'm still drooling just a bit. A canon with native 16x9 AND 24 fps, man I really hope it's true.

March 18th, 2003, 08:07 PM	#9
Robert Knecht Schmidt Wrangler Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Cleveland, Ohio Posts: 1,933	The reason why the current XL1's Frame Movie Mode is not suitable for footage meant for film transfer is precisely because it's 30P, not 24P. (Or more precisely, 29.98P vs. 23.976P.) Temporal resampling postprocessing algorithms have more material to work with when the footage is 60i. But if the footage is native 24P to begin with, no such resampling is necessary. __________________ All the best, Robert K S Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| The best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

March 19th, 2003, 11:33 AM	#10
Pete Balistrieri Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 26	But... The only hurdle then would be to have a Final Cut Pro that would handle 24P, Correct? For Editing on your computer.

March 19th, 2003, 11:43 AM	#11
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	FCP can already handle 24P. See Adam Wilt's presentation for detailed workflow information. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

March 23rd, 2003, 10:00 AM	#12
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	I can't imagine Canon will not go HD at this point. JVC's camera is supposed to be about $3000 - http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=238461&perpage=20&pagenumber=1 If Canon is going to charge MORE for an XL2, then don't you think it needs to be HD? In any case, I'll wait for Canon's 3-chip HD cam rather than go with JVC's. I have not been hearing or seeing good things about the new JVC model.

March 23rd, 2003, 11:36 AM	#13
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	I don't think it needs to be HD. I just think it needs to have a better picture than the other cameras. __________________ Need to rent camera gear in Vancouver BC? Check me out at camerarentalsvancouver.com

March 25th, 2003, 08:07 AM	#14
Marcus Farrar Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Raleigh, NC USA Posts: 110	I would love to see the XL2 come with a manual lens. When I get it I sure will not want to pay for that old stock lens. I could never get used to that focus ring on the standard lens. I guess the viewfinder could use a little work also. I really don't see them doing a flip out screen but I never really got into that anyway. Marcus __________________ Marcus Farrar Production Director Katana Productions www.katanapro.com

March 26th, 2003, 06:32 AM	#15
John Threat Major Player Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New York Posts: 322	yeah, i hope they avoid the flip out screen. it takes up resources needed for other things.