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Old November 26th, 2003, 10:24 PM   #1
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anyone who has bought the aspect Hd...

anyone who has bought the aspect Hd could just e-mail me
for private talk about the software.

anyone who has it have MSN to talk about it?

i just need a man to man talk live before buying this expensive soft.

my e-mail adress is danielmoloko@hotmail.com

if you have MSN, just add me. please.

thanks

ciao
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Old November 27th, 2003, 10:57 AM   #2
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Maybe you contact this guy.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthrea...threadid=17363

I noticed that several DVinfo.net users who brought Aspect HD have stopped posting here -- maybe because they are no longer looking of an editing solution. ;) I do wish more would come back and post publicly as word of mouth is so valuable to a young company like CineForm.
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Old November 28th, 2003, 08:04 AM   #3
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Daniel, let's keep this on the boards, so others can benefit as well. That's why it's a community!

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Old November 28th, 2003, 09:19 AM   #4
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Although i just bought Aspect and am not an experienced editor, i can say that, so far, working with Aspect is pretty sweet. There's not much to write about on a forum like this - it just plain works. It's like editing with DV. And no demuxing, etc. The low storage reuqire (30 GB per hour, Carlsburg codec) means i have enough hard drive space to edit 20 hours of raw material easily. I'm quite convinced that wavelet compression is the way to go. That there's not more "talk" about the program means, to me, that people are busy getting their work done. i could be wrong.

i would have loved to have stayed with Mac, but the PC solution is already here. Adobe seems to be moving toward PC only anyway. All things considered, the price is not that high considering what it allows me to do - edit in HD easily on this PC.

Am hoping Cineform can keep delivering - support Premiere pro, provide more options in Premiere, and improve Aspect for After effects, etc.

congrats on your company, David.
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Old November 28th, 2003, 11:59 PM   #5
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Opinions of Aspect HD.

Iím also fairly new to NLE editing. Iíve done some DV editing with Premiere 6.0, 6.5 and 7.0. Iíve now entered into editing HD editing using Aspect with Premiere 6.5 and have to say that probably the reason you donít hear more about the product is that it just plan works as advertised. No fuss no muss. Editing HD with Aspect and Premiere is like editing DV with Premiere Pro as far as speed and realtime effects go. In fact the realtime pagepeels that come with Aspect are even better than the stock adobe page peels. Everything works just like itís supposed to. I havenít taken it back out to DVHS or back to HDV to comment on the codec quality at that stage. But from what I can tell on the computer monitor is that I cannot detect and visual loss so far.

I also hope that support will continue with an upgrade to Premiere Pro and After Effects. I would also like to see more realtime transitions offered.
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Old November 29th, 2003, 11:53 PM   #6
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Daniel,

Two words: Get Aspect

As David mentions in another post, there is a post I made last week and you can see some of my reasons for writing these two words.

Two More words: Need Now?

Do you need to edit HD right now? One thing I've learned over the years: Get something that works (in your budget of course) only when you need it today. I'll elaborate...

(The rest of this is related but is more of a global message to folks in general.)

I started using DV as a tool about seven years ago and have wasted a lot of time trying to save money and getting something almost right rather than just getting the best solution I could afford or scrape up. One thing I've learned over the years: technology is a big hole one throws money into. And Aspect is relatively cheap in the big picture...it's a bargain considering the alternatives...editing HD uncompressed even if it's no better image wise, even if you have the hard drive space and a PA to make coffee and the patience to wait for all of that data to go in and out, especially when creating those multi-layered composites...or trying to get a frame accurate cut with "native" mpeg2...which is like telling a drummer that he should hit the snare about..oh..maybe a little earlier or later or earlier depending on how complicated the guitar player's hair color is...or just because. (for all of my dear drummer friends out there...I apologize: "What do you call a drummer without a girlfirend? .....Homeless." : )

The key is: ya gotta throw "it" in if you want anything out. And two "things" you may want "out" is: "Does a thing help me create what I'm creating at the moment? And do I enjoy creating with this thing?"

Also, in the subtext of what I'm saying is: be wary of the trap of fanaticism. One well-supported brand against the "cool" brand against the other "traditionally-entrenched" brand is often about the cycle of marketing and manufacturing and not about the work we need to get done right now. (On another side note: when I was working with "Standard Definition Video" and using a mathematically lossless codec, I lost clients because the guy down the street had an "uncompressed" system even though he used compression anyway. I'm not saying you lie...just say something like, "Um...Ours is much better than uncompressed...I mean, look how good those breasts look...they're enhanced with our system." The "suits" like stuff like that. I'm sure that's why the term "Broadcast Quality" became a buzzword even though we all know that you certainly can broadcast almost anything these days. In the "real" world...well..the place where you find the people with the cash...the "suits"...if you start mentioning codecs or compression or bus speed...they get headaches. Instead tell them "nice suit" or "great shoes." Works every time...but only if you really think their suit or shoes are nice or great. )

Okay back on track here:

We are users of disposable tools. Our cameras, computers and the software we run on them are really just expensive razor blades. Expenses are not investments.

The real investment is in your talent. Invest in that and you'll be able to afford the tools you need for the work you do. I personally don't believe that artists need to starve to be credible. Even though, sometimes the starving part happens whether you want it to or not.

Be wary if you are waiting for something for your "whatever" cutting-edge computer or editing system because you have so much "invested in it." You can think for yourself. In my attic, I've got a DEC Rainbow 8mhz 286 with 256K of memory that can do CPM/86 and MS-DOS...make me an offer? ; )

Get Aspect HD if you've got projects to do. Support Cineform because with their software you can support YOUR work. They are a small company with an elegant technology that works right now. I don't want to get into trouble with David. He showed us an amazing demo of what they have in store for the future...nah, doesn't relate right now.

Cineform is doing the same thing that indie filmmakers and garage bands have done, although their art is hidden in algorithms expressed in code. (They could use some more artful marketing, however..along with JVC). And we can be sure that Cineform doesn't have a lot invested in making sure their "hardware" sells...hardware has a long R & D to manufacturing timeline...that's why HD took some time to get to us "regular" folks...um...us on the "bleeding" edge...um...us digital geeks...um...

I'm glad JVC took the plunge...they could make their whole line HD and blow everyone on the block away. (However, they probably wouldn't get invited to all the good "HD Consortium" parties anymore...the indie film world would invite them though.)

I used their best three chip DV Cam for most of my current film. JVC kindly loaned us one for a short time (thank You M. C. from JVC) and we ended up renting one also...then a few weeks ago we bought the "little HD" and just finished two weeks shooting and did find many work-arounds to it's limitations. Plus we've done some test conversions of our old DV footage to HD and are very happy with the results.

If only "they" could make a cam with the size of this thing and the pro control of the top line-DV cams..wow...note to "they": I don't need or want a HD box the size of a betacam. If it's bigger than a handful, then it's...um...My actors don't care...It's not the size...it's what you do with it. : )

Along with that, we have convinced some producers to shoot two upcoming films with a couple of the JVC HD cams and Aspect HD, instead of one of the high-end HD cams with the "big"' lenses...even though the producers had a sweet deal with the high-end company. In the end, it's not about perceived image quality or anything else. For us, It's about getting a good quality image that's "malleable in post." It's also about getting the crew size down in order to let the actors do their job without all of the distractions and wasted time on a traditional set. Plus, we'll have more money in the budget for better food. That's a plus always.

I'm not an official "paid endorser" for Cineform or JVC. We bought their stuff it and use it (and enjoy using it) every day...if some other tool comes out that does what we need for a project, we'll get it only if it helps the work...We're selfish that way.

Okay off the soap box...

...if someone who reads this makes a great film with these new HD tools...I want to know about it...


Take Care All,
G.P.
Rhythm Films
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Old December 13th, 2003, 05:55 AM   #7
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Toss me an email and I'll give my opinion of aspect and its not all warm and fuzzy
aka I'm not an aspect employee

trusselle21@hotmail.com
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Old December 13th, 2003, 09:35 AM   #8
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Let's keep it on the board, not off. that way others can read it, too.

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Old December 13th, 2003, 12:02 PM   #9
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Truly I'm interested to. If users have any problems would like to address them, our technical support is very responsive. Also I'm the only CineForm employee that regularly posts on this forum. "Warm and fuzzy", if you had meet me, you would know my enhusiam for HD and the technologies to support it is real. I just love this stuff.
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Old December 14th, 2003, 08:46 AM   #10
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Hey Heath, why are you telling people what to do? No one here gets paid for posting, so if we aren't comfortable about a specific issue it's our business.
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Old December 14th, 2003, 09:15 AM   #11
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If you aren't comfortable sharing your thoughts on a public forum, then why post that fact on a public forum? Forums don't exist for people to proclaim that they have information they're unwilling to share openly.

It's totally appropriate for Heath to request that members use the forum in the manner in which it is intended; the public exchange of ideas and experiences. I'd be interested in hearing the feedback, good or bad, but I'm not going to perform a secret handshake to get it. It's unethical.

Heath isn't getting paid to moderate, either, and no one is paying to use this board. People need to be more grateful and respectful of the service and contribute so that everyone benefits.
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Old December 14th, 2003, 10:58 AM   #12
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Aspect HD really is the cleanest solution to editing from this camera.

It is simple to use and works exactly as advertised.

You have 2 ways to try it by the way.

1. Buy the software from Aspect HD and use it for 30 days before you register it. If you don't like it, or can't make it work (impossible IMHO), you canreturn it for a full refund.

2. You can buy my DVD, which comes with a tutorial on installation and how to use it AND a 30 day trial version of it and Premiere. After that if you like it you can buy the software and use the included $100.00 off coupon and save some money.

Either way, you can prove it to yourself.

I am confident you will be satisfied.

DBK
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Old December 15th, 2003, 01:36 AM   #13
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Heath: the only reason I gave out my email is because the POSTER wanted someone to have a private talk with regarding the software...as HE stated in his first message. All I was doing was giving the poster what he really wanted...someone to talk to about it. And, I for one, see nothing wrong with his request.

As for my comments regarding Aspect... First of all, I DID NOT want to complain in detail about Aspect in a public forum. They have some excellent software obviously with some serious bugs they are working on. I didn't want to post anything negative because they seem like a solid company and they don't need any more negative comments. I have full confidence that their excellent support will resolve their issues, and therefore think it is not prudent to bring them up. But since you all really seem to want to know, here it is:

They have a serious problem with the program addressing virtual memory, which causes premiere to crash whenever you export a long program. Works fine when only exporting 10-15 min clips, but ALWAYS crashes when exporting longer clips. They are aware of this problem and tech support states many users have this problem and they blame it on adobe premiere 6.5 and they way it handles memory. Therefore our company cannot use aspect for any serious work. They state this will be resolved with premiere pro plug in, but we'll have to wait and see. Because of this Aspect is completely useless for us. You can read about it here on their troubleshooting:

http://supportcenteronline.com/ics/support/default.asp?deptID=614

Because of these issues we cannot even make a 30 minute DVHS tape of anything. Our system far exceeds their recommended requirements, so that is not the issue. Their support team states that this issue becomes a problem when there are too many edits/cuts in the project, but we cannot limit the number of cuts just so the program doesn't crash on us.

If you are considering the purchase, I would advise making a 1-2 hour long project BEFORE your 30 day trial is up. Make it a real project, with all the edits you would normally include in your workflow and see if Aspect crashes on you. It works perfectly for smaller projects, just when the project becomes too large, Aspect just crashes when you attempt to export it. Unfortunetely, most of the people who complain on message boards didn't find out that Aspect crashed all the time until they made their real 1-2 hour projects and realized the memory system created by adobe wasn't working well with aspect on their system.

Nevertheless,it can do as they claim and create real time HD editing. I am sure not everyone will experience these problems, though I have read about many others with similar experiences to ours, who cannot get aspect to work on their system. I think the premiere pro plug in, is going to be where we all get our money's worth. Finally, their customer support is excellent. This is still an early phase of their company, and I'm sure they will eventually resolve the issues.
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Old December 15th, 2003, 08:56 AM   #14
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Lisa,

I understand what you're saying, but we try to keep as much as possible open on the boards so others can learn.

Thanks for being candid; your presence on the board is greatly appreciated.

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Old December 15th, 2003, 11:01 AM   #15
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The memory leak that Lisa has been experiencing was fixed in-house a few weeks ago. We have released the patch to a few users, who have experienced the export problem, for testing (not every system has the problem - only a few have reported this.) Lisa, contact tech. support for the patch. This fix will be fully released as part of Aspect HD 1.1 (due out soon -- check the web-site at the end of this week.)

Thank you Lisa for your concerns about public comments. Forums can be rough place for young companies, but there is alway room for accurate non-infamatory feedback.

Thank you to everyone here for your comments.

David Newman
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CineForm.
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