CineForm product opportunity? at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Cross-Platform Post Production Solutions > CineForm Software Showcase

CineForm Software Showcase
Cross platform digital intermediates for independent filmmakers.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old March 24th, 2006, 10:55 PM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
CineForm product opportunity?

Procoder 2 does not function with PPro 2. Canopus has been silent on the issue, leading some to speculate that Canopus does not intend to release a Procoder for PPro 2, perhaps because Canopus increasingly views Adobe as a competitor. What is needed is an alternative professional encoder from a company that views Adobe as a partner. Is this a product that would fit within the CineForm lineup?

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 10:25 AM   #2
Major Player
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: monroe, or
Posts: 572
I would chime in here that there are several areas that someone like Cineform could pick up the ball where Premiere Pro 2.0 has dropped it, namely, batch processing. For whatever reason, this function is no longer a part of Premiere... probably to enhance justification for their bundled suite with After Effects.

Transcoding capabilities for Panasonic's P2 also ranks high in terms of needs, and that has been rumoured to be in the works...... David? Anything you can pass along to us?
Marty Baggen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 12:59 PM   #3
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty Baggen
Transcoding capabilities for Panasonic's P2 also ranks high in terms of needs, and that has been rumoured to be in the works......
Yes, that would be closer to the CineForm product line. Just wish there was a an equivalent to Canopus Procoder for PPro 2, but it does so much and so well, it would be a big effort to match the capabilities. In time, we can expect another company to fill the void, but it's particularly painful for the current Procoder user base. One user who posted on the Canopus forum has four licensed copies that he can no longer use. Ouch, at $500 a pop, that will leave a mark. :)

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 01:22 PM   #4
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Thousand Oaks
Posts: 1,095
Has anyone tried TMPGEnc 3.0Xpress high quality video encoder? http://www.pegasys-inc.com/en/product/te3xp.html

I too am a big fan of Canopus, however, their relationship with Adobe has been on a decline that is directly proportional to the development of Edius. Not only has there relationship with Adobe suffered but Canopus had quite a few utilities like XplodePro which they no longer support. Xplode was a great little application for developing custom alpha and 3D transitions.

I would love to see Cineform fill the void left by Canopus.
Chuck Spaulding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 01:52 PM   #5
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Spaulding
Has anyone tried TMPGEnc 3.0Xpress high quality video encoder?
Does TMPGEnc include a PPro 2 plugin? Procoder 2 will work with PPro 2 if you are willing to render the timeline to an intermediate uncompressed avi file. Of course, the intermediate file for some HD projects will be huge, not to mention the extra time required. I am not a Procoder user, but based on reviews I have read, it was very easy to set up a Procoder render queue from within Premiere 1.5 to render every format you needed in one step (DVD, low-bandwidth streaming, high-bandwidth streaming, etc).

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 02:04 PM   #6
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Spaulding
Not only has there relationship with Adobe suffered but Canopus had quite a few utilities like XplodePro which they no longer support. Xplode was a great little application for developing custom alpha and 3D transitions.
Speaking of Canopus utitilies, Imaginate is an excellent application for creating slide show videos, but here again, Canopus has dropped support for PPro 2, and some features no longer work when using the plugin with PPro 2. Of course, you can still render the Imaginate timeline and then import into PPro 2, but it's a shame that just when Adobe released dynamic linking and the ability to integrate AE and PPro sequences, we lose this integration between PPro and other third-party utilities like Imaginate and Procoder.

Let's hope that CineForm and other Adobe partners will sieze the opportunity.

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 02:24 PM   #7
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Thousand Oaks
Posts: 1,095
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christopher Glaeser
Does TMPGEnc include a PPro 2 plugin? Procoder 2 will work with PPro 2 if you are willing to render the timeline to an intermediate uncompressed avi file. Of course, the intermediate file for some HD projects will be huge, not to mention the extra time required. I am not a Procoder user, but based on reviews I have read, it was very easy to set up a Procoder render queue from within Premiere 1.5 to render every format you needed in one step (DVD, low-bandwidth streaming, high-bandwidth streaming, etc).

Best,
Christopher
No, I think TMPGEnc3.0 is like ProCoder2 in that you to render a Cineform AVI first. Even though this is an additional step I generally render a Cineform AVI distribution master. I believe you can set up batch encodes with TMPGEnc3.0 for any number of formats. Plus its only $58...

I have not tried it yet, although its hard to imagine that the quality as good as Canopus.
Chuck Spaulding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 02:30 PM   #8
Trustee
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Thousand Oaks
Posts: 1,095
Quote:
Originally Posted by Christopher Glaeser
Speaking of Canopus utitilies, Imaginate is an excellent application for creating slide show videos, but here again, Canopus has dropped support for PPro 2, and some features no longer work when using the plugin with PPro 2. Of course, you can still render the Imaginate timeline and then import into PPro 2, but it's a shame that just when Adobe released dynamic linking and the ability to integrate AE and PPro sequences, we lose this integration between PPro and other third-party utilities like Imaginate and Procoder.

Let's hope that CineForm and other Adobe partners will sieze the opportunity.

Best,
Christopher
One cool thing is that Imaginate works well with AspectHD so at least you can render a Cineform AVI directly from Imaginate and import it into PPro2. It's obviously not integrated as well as AE7 and the Dynamic Lynk but as least its very good quality.
Chuck Spaulding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 25th, 2006, 04:30 PM   #9
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Spaulding
One cool thing is that Imaginate works well with AspectHD so at least you can render a Cineform AVI directly ...
Thanks, that's good to know. I have not yet purchased either Imaginate or Procoder, but I may get one or both with the knowledge that support for PPro 2 is not forthcoming. I was assuming uncompressed avi in the workflow, but I expect Aspect HD will do just fine. In the unlikely event I have any issues, I know I can count on CineForm support.

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2006, 08:04 AM   #10
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 138
I wouldn't give up on Procoder integrating with 2.0...Canopus isn't the only partner in Procoder and while upgrades are slow they do make a lot of money from PPro users. If you have the full version you can still render the timeline and use watch folders over a network(I have a dedicated render machine networked to the editing machine) and make as many types of files(in my case SD mpeg for dvd, a .m2t to write back to tape, and sometimes WMP 720p file) Procoder is much faster dealing with a file as opposed to encoding from the timeline(true with any encoder) but it will be nice when it integrates.

On imaginate just copy the old plugin into 2.0...users are reporting this works fine. Also Imaginate may see some changes as well:)
Randy Donato is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2006, 09:06 AM   #11
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Donato
If you have the full version you can still render the timeline and use watch folders
Yes, watch folders is certainly a nice feature and is one of the reasons I may decide to purchase Procoder.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Donato
... but it will be nice when it integrates.
For now, I'd be happy with a statement from Canopus that they plan to support PPro 2. There is speculation that they intend to walk away from the Adobe products, and Canopus has not said anything to the contrary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Donato
On imaginate just copy the old plugin into 2.0...users are reporting this works fine.
Users have reported that stretching an Imaginate clip in PPro 2 no longer works. It's a minor issue, but the more serious issue is the lack of support, or even a comment about support for PPro 2. In recent months I've spent about $30,000 on camera, computers, and software. I think Procoder and Imaginate could be good additions to my workflow, but I'm reluctant to spend $700 knowing up front that so many Canopus users are unhappy with the support.

That said, your comments are helpful, and one more vote in favor of the purchase. Thanks!

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2006, 10:45 AM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 138
Very true that you will not see any support for editing plugins like the old Storm/Ppro combo...for a variety of reasons including some important ones on the Adobe side they just couldn't get the Rt effects that Canopus offers to work inside Ppro. But with Procoder and Imaginate they are separate animals with different engineers and markets. As you know Thompson Valley now owns them and it is hard to gauge what that will mean but I think by NAB a lot of answers will be available including product support...I never buy software betting on the come though and suggest you do the same until something formal is announced.
Randy Donato is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2006, 11:00 AM   #13
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Stratford-upon-Avon, Warwickshire, UK
Posts: 47
Surely you can frameserve from PP2 to Procoder? - or TMPEGEnc for that matter? No need for a huge intermediate AVI file.
Michael Bott is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2006, 11:29 AM   #14
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Pleasanton, CA
Posts: 258
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Bott
Surely you can frameserve from PP2 to Procoder? - or TMPEGEnc for that matter? No need for a huge intermediate AVI file.
It's my understanding that the PP2 / Procoder combo requires an intermediate render (which can be automated using watch folders, but requires a render nontheless), whereas Procoder can render directly from PP1.5 with no intermediate file required.

Best,
Christopher
Christopher Glaeser is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Cross-Platform Post Production Solutions > CineForm Software Showcase

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:49 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network