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Old October 6th, 2006, 07:53 PM   #1
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is resizing HDV CF25 to SD (PAL) loseless?

Hi everyone,

Speaking of resizing the video from Z1 camera, mode Cineframe 25.
I'm pretty sure there's no visual difference between cineframe 1440x1080 and 1280x720. Let's say, my final destination is PAL DVD. Well, no keying, rotoscoping, fX etc on a timeline (just CC, cuts and fades). Well-known test shows that the vertical limit of Z1 in CF mode is about 540 lines (less than PAL video definition!). So my question is: should I resize CF to 1280x720, edit and then resize the final AVI to SD; or should I resize directly to 720x576 on a capture (thus saving disc space and maybe one step of conversion' degradation)?

Thanx,
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Old October 6th, 2006, 09:23 PM   #2
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I would edit at 1280x720.
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Old October 7th, 2006, 05:48 AM   #3
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David, I would too - somehow I feel it would be a better way to go.
But could you give reason for editing in 1280x720?
One of them is, as I think, a native real-time mode in PPro, the second is an increased horizontal resolution - it's always better to stay in higher resolutions during colorizing/editing).. Am I right?
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Old October 7th, 2006, 11:00 AM   #4
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Native is not the reason, as you are resizing form 1440x1080 to 1280x720 you are no longer native, so no point in taking an MPEG hit. In CineForm AVI the 1280x720 will have a small disk footprint and higher performance (without a resolution penalty as you shot in CineFrame 25.) Edit in HD gives you the oversampling needed to allow you to frame re-crop for you SD production. Plus you will have an HD master for a little future proofing.
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Old October 7th, 2006, 03:30 PM   #5
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by "native real-time mode" I meant cineform's preset, of course, not a Premiere's mpeg editing.

Thanks again for reply. I'll be working at 1280x720, definitely!
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Old October 9th, 2006, 11:52 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Newman
The Cineframe mode only resolves about 540 lines, so either 720p or 1080p presentation with have about 540 lines. So converting 1440x1080 to 1280x720 doesn't lose anything.
Hmm.. I've done converting 1440x1080 (Cineframe25) to 1280x720 via HD Link and then via After Effects. And I've done converting 1440x1080 to 720x576 (SD) as well. And the result in both cases is the same: AE gives more crisp video, definitely! Well, I've been told that sometimes downconversion from HD to SD introduce some flickering, but I tried 5 different TV sets - everything plays perfectly.
So Alex Raskin is right - if the final result is DVD, try After Effects.

Could you comment it, David?
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Old October 9th, 2006, 04:40 PM   #7
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Which Aspect HD version?
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Old October 10th, 2006, 12:06 AM   #8
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the last one - build 69
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Old October 10th, 2006, 12:20 AM   #9
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That's a pity now we are going to have to determine why. :) We are using Lanczos scalers, which look excellent for most image sources. "Crisp"-ness of AE, may mean it has more sharpening.
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Old October 10th, 2006, 01:06 AM   #10
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Yes, AE does produce more sharpening. Maybe in case of Cinealta's files it's not too good (aliasing/flickering artefacts), but in the world of cheap HDV cameras soft "semi-HD" videos look even softer.
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