Premiere Pro Realtime and Quicktime files at DVinfo.net

Robert Dolphin · July 2nd, 2007, 03:28 AM

I have encoded some of my 720 25p HDV footage using HDLINK with Aspect HD V5 as .mov files. When using Premiere Pro 2.0 and the Cineform presets for 720 25p I get the following behaviour:

Any Cineform AVI files on the timeline play back OK and require no rendering. No red bar on the timeline.
Unrendered files of any other type play as black (normal). Red bar on the timeline.
Any Cineform .mov files fail to play at all. The timecode does not advance. No red bar on the timeline.

It seems the .mov files are recognised as native cineform but won't play.

Is this a bug or are .mov files not supported for realtime playback? Has anyone done this successfully?

David Newman · July 2nd, 2007, 09:16 AM

It is seems some PC will and some won't, based on other components installed on the PC. We are investigating. A work-around maybe to install Quicktime Alternative (http://www.free-codecs.com/download/...lternative.htm) but that should not be required.

Simon Heymans · July 4th, 2007, 06:44 AM

Hi Robert,
I have the same issue too, I logged a ticket to Cineform. They send me an update of Aspect HD v5 but it still doesn't work.

According to me the issue is linked directly with the .mov files as before I would only capture in .avi and never had any issues :(

Cineform is looking at the issue at the moment.

David Newman · July 4th, 2007, 09:14 AM

We still recommend people capture and edit with AVIs. If you need MOVs, then use HDLink to rewarp AVI to MOV as needed.

The MOV playback issue in Aspect HD or Premiere Pro, is not strictly a CineForm issue, we find those machine can't find the DirectShow QT file reader/de-mux, even though it is standard to Windows. You should be able to play MOVs in Media Player (using "Open With..") Maybe it is a missing DirectX update or similar.

Simon Heymans · July 4th, 2007, 10:11 AM

Hi David,
Thanks for the quick feedback! I will check that I have the latest DirectX update on my machine.
However since I captured all my files directly in .mov, do you suggest I should recapture them in .avi?
Both .mov and avi (transferred from mov in HDlink) work perfectly well in other players outside premiere like quicktime player or media player. Also I don;t have any issues in After effects! So only in Adobe premiere pro :(

David Newman · July 4th, 2007, 10:15 AM

Recapture is not necessary, the MOV can be converted to AVI in HDLink -- it is pretty fast as there is no recompression.

Simon Heymans · July 4th, 2007, 04:00 PM

Hi David,
What you propose is what I did but I still get many issues. For example I can playback the clip (.avi) on the timeline but I get rolling images when scrubing the same clip on the timeline.
I also have some weird images when doing slow-mo and playing back on the timeline.
Also I can't scrub the clip, images are rolling, when clip in not on the timeline so on the video box on the left side.
I sent a ticket to cineform about this issues!

David Newman · July 4th, 2007, 04:13 PM

Try recapturing those clips, it seems that the wrapping is missing some key information, as I never seen what you describe.

Simon Heymans · July 5th, 2007, 01:17 PM

Ok I try to rewrap all the files I had originally captured in .mov but that didn't work. Actually the "wrapping" in Hdlink only worked for 5 video clips than suddently it stopped and nothing happened. I try to redo the rewrap but I didn;t succeed.
Anyhow the first clips I managed to rewrap are again perfectly readable outside premiere pro but within Premiere pro same issues has described before :(.
I will have to manage this way for the time being but I hope cineform can fix the issue soon. Pretty awful to work this way when scrubbing the video!

David Newman · July 5th, 2007, 01:21 PM

Did you try capture as an AVI? Please test this.

Simon Heymans · July 5th, 2007, 02:33 PM

Ok so I recaptured my footage in .avi directly. I manage to rename the video clips the same way so I didn;t have to redo my editing, luckily it was a short project! Now it's working! I don;t get any weird issues as I had when I captured directly in .mov.

Maybe I would suggest people not to capture directly in .mov. It could be linked to the camera (JVC HD 111e).? Or maybe was cineform never intended to work that way?

Ps: I will post another issue that I have using the cineform codec with Quicktime in After effects

July 2nd, 2007, 03:28 AM	#1
Robert Dolphin New Boot Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Mt Colah, NSW, Australia Posts: 6	Premiere Pro Realtime and Quicktime files I have encoded some of my 720 25p HDV footage using HDLINK with Aspect HD V5 as .mov files. When using Premiere Pro 2.0 and the Cineform presets for 720 25p I get the following behaviour: Any Cineform AVI files on the timeline play back OK and require no rendering. No red bar on the timeline. Unrendered files of any other type play as black (normal). Red bar on the timeline. Any Cineform .mov files fail to play at all. The timecode does not advance. No red bar on the timeline. It seems the .mov files are recognised as native cineform but won't play. Is this a bug or are .mov files not supported for realtime playback? Has anyone done this successfully?

July 2nd, 2007, 09:16 AM	#2
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	It is seems some PC will and some won't, based on other components installed on the PC. We are investigating. A work-around maybe to install Quicktime Alternative (http://www.free-codecs.com/download/...lternative.htm) but that should not be required. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 4th, 2007, 09:14 AM	#4
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	We still recommend people capture and edit with AVIs. If you need MOVs, then use HDLink to rewarp AVI to MOV as needed. The MOV playback issue in Aspect HD or Premiere Pro, is not strictly a CineForm issue, we find those machine can't find the DirectShow QT file reader/de-mux, even though it is standard to Windows. You should be able to play MOVs in Media Player (using "Open With..") Maybe it is a missing DirectX update or similar. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 4th, 2007, 10:15 AM	#6
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Recapture is not necessary, the MOV can be converted to AVI in HDLink -- it is pretty fast as there is no recompression. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 4th, 2007, 04:13 PM	#8
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Try recapturing those clips, it seems that the wrapping is missing some key information, as I never seen what you describe. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 4th, 2007, 06:44 AM	#3
Simon Heymans Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brussels - Belgium Posts: 53	Hi Robert, I have the same issue too, I logged a ticket to Cineform. They send me an update of Aspect HD v5 but it still doesn't work. According to me the issue is linked directly with the .mov files as before I would only capture in .avi and never had any issues :( Cineform is looking at the issue at the moment.

July 4th, 2007, 10:11 AM	#5
Simon Heymans Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brussels - Belgium Posts: 53	Hi David, Thanks for the quick feedback! I will check that I have the latest DirectX update on my machine. However since I captured all my files directly in .mov, do you suggest I should recapture them in .avi? Both .mov and avi (transferred from mov in HDlink) work perfectly well in other players outside premiere like quicktime player or media player. Also I don;t have any issues in After effects! So only in Adobe premiere pro :(

July 4th, 2007, 04:00 PM	#7
Simon Heymans Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brussels - Belgium Posts: 53	Hi David, What you propose is what I did but I still get many issues. For example I can playback the clip (.avi) on the timeline but I get rolling images when scrubing the same clip on the timeline. I also have some weird images when doing slow-mo and playing back on the timeline. Also I can't scrub the clip, images are rolling, when clip in not on the timeline so on the video box on the left side. I sent a ticket to cineform about this issues!

July 5th, 2007, 01:17 PM	#9
Simon Heymans Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brussels - Belgium Posts: 53	Ok I try to rewrap all the files I had originally captured in .mov but that didn't work. Actually the "wrapping" in Hdlink only worked for 5 video clips than suddently it stopped and nothing happened. I try to redo the rewrap but I didn;t succeed. Anyhow the first clips I managed to rewrap are again perfectly readable outside premiere pro but within Premiere pro same issues has described before :(. I will have to manage this way for the time being but I hope cineform can fix the issue soon. Pretty awful to work this way when scrubbing the video!

July 5th, 2007, 01:21 PM	#10
David Newman CTO, CineForm Inc. Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cardiff-by-the-Sea, California Posts: 8,095	Did you try capture as an AVI? Please test this. __________________ David Newman -- web: www.gopro.com blog: cineform.blogspot.com -- twitter: twitter.com/David_Newman

July 5th, 2007, 02:33 PM	#11
Simon Heymans Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Brussels - Belgium Posts: 53	Ok so I recaptured my footage in .avi directly. I manage to rename the video clips the same way so I didn;t have to redo my editing, luckily it was a short project! Now it's working! I don;t get any weird issues as I had when I captured directly in .mov. Maybe I would suggest people not to capture directly in .mov. It could be linked to the camera (JVC HD 111e).? Or maybe was cineform never intended to work that way? Ps: I will post another issue that I have using the cineform codec with Quicktime in After effects