slowmotion at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > External Video Recording Solutions > Convergent Design Odyssey

Convergent Design Odyssey
...and other Convergent Design products.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old July 8th, 2011, 04:46 PM   #1
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: York, North Yorkshire, England.
Posts: 466
slowmotion

Please could anybody help i want to film peregrines in slowmotion with a ex3 and nano what setting do i req
thanks
Ian
__________________
Ian Thomas.
Thomas Video Productions
Ian Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 9th, 2011, 05:15 PM   #2
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: York, North Yorkshire, England.
Posts: 466
Re: slowmotion

come on someone must know!!!
__________________
Ian Thomas.
Thomas Video Productions
Ian Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2011, 09:11 AM   #3
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Posts: 749
Re: slowmotion

Page 34 & 35 of the NanoFlash Manual...
Depends what final output you need, all are listed.

For instance ------
For 2.5x slomo at 24p --
Set EX3 to 720p60
In Nano - set:
Crank to ON
Record Rate (1st setting) to 24
Crank Rate (2nd setting) to 60
Set Nano Record to a high bit rate (this of course required fast CF cards), since cranking reduces bit rate by the crank factor.
Dave Sperling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2011, 04:19 PM   #4
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: York, North Yorkshire, England.
Posts: 466
Re: slowmotion

thanks Dave

my manual that came with mine ( disc ) was 2009 and had nothing about slo mo, does the setting you show work in pal areas.
__________________
Ian Thomas.
Thomas Video Productions
Ian Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 10th, 2011, 05:10 PM   #5
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Posts: 749
Re: slowmotion

I gave you maximum slo-mo (which is for 24p.
Download the manual from the C-D website and check out the various options. If camera is at 720p50 and you record at crank 50 / base speed 25, that only gives you 2:1 slomo.
Also verify that you have latest firmware installed in NanoFlash.

Manuals | Support | Convergent Design
Dave Sperling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2011, 11:57 AM   #6
Sponsor: Convergent Design
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado
Posts: 166
Re: slowmotion

Hello Dave,

Thank you For your response.

Best Regards
__________________
Andy Mangrum, Tech Support Convergent Design, Inc
Andy Mangrum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2011, 12:14 PM   #7
Major Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Entebbe Uganda
Posts: 768
Re: slowmotion

Just to confirm; with cameras like the XLH1 which have no 720p, then cranking on the nanoflash will not work?
Simon Wood is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 11th, 2011, 12:33 PM   #8
Sponsor: Convergent Design
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado
Posts: 166
Re: slowmotion

Hello Simon,

Cranking can work in 1080 Mode, but you must be shooting progressive, and keep in mind that the nanoFlash does not support 1080p60, (as the XHL1 does not output 1080p60)

But you can use the crank function using 1080p30 or 1080p24, Just the effect will not be as significant,

Compared to using 720p60

Best Regards
__________________
Andy Mangrum, Tech Support Convergent Design, Inc
Andy Mangrum is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 19th, 2011, 01:30 PM   #9
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: England UK
Posts: 57
Re: slowmotion

I also can't entirely make out how to do this from the manual. It does not really explain fully how to do this if you're using an EX3 in 50Hz land.

The progressive formats available in a UK EX3 are 1080/25p, 720/50p, 720/25p.

Does this mean the only slowmotion option is in 720/50p format mode and then with an upper limit of 50fps, even though the camera's onboard recording and the Nano recorder are capable of upto 60fps ? If recording using the camera's own SxS card recorder you shoot upto 60fps slowmotion by setting to 720/25p format, and upto 30fps slowmotion by setting the camera to 1080/25p format.

Then what about the shutter speed ? Presumably you put the camera into S&Q mode (switch shutter back to ON) and set the chosen frame rate on both camera nad Nano to match eachother ?

I am really missing something here, I know.
__________________
http://stephendevere.co.uk

Last edited by Stephen de Vere; July 19th, 2011 at 01:32 PM. Reason: typo
Stephen de Vere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 19th, 2011, 02:53 PM   #10
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: York, North Yorkshire, England.
Posts: 466
Re: slow motion

Stephen

I think you set the ex3 to 720/50 and then set the shutter on and set it to 60, I have tried this and also tried the other option which is 720/50 shutter off both work but i can't see much difference i iam trying to ot film peregrines in flight and wanted to slow them down it does but not really enough
__________________
Ian Thomas.
Thomas Video Productions
Ian Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 19th, 2011, 03:21 PM   #11
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: England UK
Posts: 57
Re: slowmotion

That's the issue I can't get to the bottom of - if the varying shutter speed is recorded to the Nano - and it's absolutley crucial to get the right motion blur for any given frame rate.

I'm afraid there are almost no HD cameras that can film birds in flight as well as used to be possible with film. That's one area where digital has taken us back a step. You need 100fps atleast for peregrine - you have to use a Phantom, which is big money, big sensor (big disadvantage) and doesn't too much like the outdoors. Great fun to use though !
__________________
http://stephendevere.co.uk
Stephen de Vere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 19th, 2011, 03:28 PM   #12
Major Player
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Tinton Falls, NJ
Posts: 749
Re: slowmotion

If 2:1 speed ratio doesn't do much for you, then 2.5:1 may not be that much better. But I'm guessing that setting the camera to (NTSC) 720/60 and recording to 60 frames/ for 24 playback, then letting your NLE take the 24p and speed it up to 25p (using 1:1 frame mapping, not frame blending) will give you the best ratio available from your current options, at just under 2.5:1 speed ratio.
After that you could try one of the software based 'slow-mo' plugins that actually look at each frame and create virtual frames in between them.
Dave Sperling is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 20th, 2011, 06:27 AM   #13
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: England UK
Posts: 57
Re: slowmotion

If you go the software interpolating route then make sure to set a shutter speed to suit the slowmotion ratio you want.
I've done it in the past for 2x slowmotion shooting 50i then de-interlaced (using a 'smart' interpolating de-interlacer by Graeme Nattress) to 25p, and reducing the shutter duration/angle by 50% of normal in at time of shooting makes all the difference. Never done the same with progressive footage but I bet the same principle applies.
__________________
http://stephendevere.co.uk
Stephen de Vere is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 20th, 2011, 03:19 PM   #14
Major Player
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: York, North Yorkshire, England.
Posts: 466
Re: slowmotion

I have twixtor on the casablanca that has slowmotion i tried slowing it 50% and 75% both are not very good, that of course after the nano slowed it down 2x it sort of looks abit jellowey not good enough to use
__________________
Ian Thomas.
Thomas Video Productions
Ian Thomas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old July 21st, 2011, 03:51 AM   #15
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: England UK
Posts: 57
Re: slowmotion

If you're sure the shutter speed is right then there's not much else you can do apart from going to a high end post house where they have more sophisticated slomo software and an operator that knows how to use it fully - I think the best systems involve guiding the software manually (ie. showing it where and exactly what motion to track, using keyframes) but I haven't heard of this being used on any wildlife films.

Doesn't the Red shoot 120fps using a smaller part of the sensor ? Won't be strictly broadcast spec. but you may not need that. Again, I don't know of anyone using that method for wildlife broadcast productions at the BBC. The approach is either to back off on the shot size, or if the subject is big enough and close enough and reliable enough, stump up the cash for Phantom. I did shoot some super16 film of snowy owls at 150fps for Frozen Planet several years ago but I don't know if they used it (broadcast in UK this autumn) - it did look noisy side-by-side with the Varicam footage but that series has the money to do a lot of post work (and they do).

It amazes me that it's 10 years or so since everyday small format professional tv cameras could shoot 150fps but that's one of the prices we've paid for HD.
Stephen de Vere is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > The Tools of DV and HD Production > External Video Recording Solutions > Convergent Design Odyssey

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:44 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network