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Old May 5th, 2014, 02:00 AM   #1
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FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Anyone have any idea on a schedule for this? 4K YCC 10-Bit Compressed up to 60fps is a promised feature on the website but it seems a long way off at the moment.

This is pretty much a prerequisite for me to purchase - while I can see some advantage in the 4K2HD modes the compressed 4K is what I I'm waiting for.
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Old May 5th, 2014, 05:18 PM   #2
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

You can see where Dan from CD answered a basic "when" question here:

Just got the 7Q?
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Old May 5th, 2014, 07:36 PM   #3
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Dear John,

We are trying not to be too specific about "when" questions.

We just do not want to let people down when things do not go as planned.

To be more open, sometimes a feature requires more work than expected, or if we find a bug that takes quite a lot of effort to resolve.

Our current push is to enhance our Apple ProRes 422 so that we can support 1080p60 (it is currently limited to 1080p30).

As soon as this is accomplished, and it is close to being finished, we will be working on adding a 4K compressed codec.

Thus, in general terms, we expect to add this 4K compressed codec this summer.

I hope this helps.

Respectfully,
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Old May 16th, 2014, 12:21 AM   #4
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Thanks Dan

Shame about that - the cost of the media being quite high (although not in relative terms to other devices) but if I'm going to record close to 1.5 hours of 4K raw material @25P I'm going to need at least 4 x 512GB drives I think.

That's the main application for me and that adds significant cost to just 2 x 512GB drives.

Also strange that you've had a 4KProRes example on your website since before the launch of the device which might have led users to believe it wasn't far off...

However keep up the good work and hopefully push those engineers along!
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Old May 16th, 2014, 08:00 PM   #5
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Dan, just make sure you guys don't leave us in need of 4K time lapse in the dust!

Those of us who want to shoot in 4K RAW look forward to the 1TB SSD's too.
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Old May 17th, 2014, 02:38 PM   #6
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Mitchell View Post
Thanks Dan

Shame about that - the cost of the media being quite high (although not in relative terms to other devices) but if I'm going to record close to 1.5 hours of 4K raw material @25P I'm going to need at least 4 x 512GB drives I think.

That's the main application for me and that adds significant cost to just 2 x 512GB drives.

Also strange that you've had a 4KProRes example on your website since before the launch of the device which might have led users to believe it wasn't far off...

However keep up the good work and hopefully push those engineers along!
Dear John,

I am using one low cost CompactFlash card for comparison.

A Transcend 400x 32 GB CompactFlash card costs $33.50.

This is a card rated at up to 45 Megabytes per second write speed.

256 GB of these cards cost $268 (All US Prices).

Our 256 GB SSD supports writes at around 500 Megabytes per second, far greater than 45 Megabytes per second, but the cost of our SSD is just a little greater.

Our 256 SSD costs $395 and has built in power protection in case power is lost.

And our SSD's use less power than all other SSD's as far as we know (and this applies to all SSD's that we have tested).

And, as far as we know, our SSD's cost less than any other professional media.


------------------


I attempted to find a 4K ProRes sample file on our website, but I could not.

I don't doubt that it exists or did exist, but it was not created (directly) by the Odyssey7Q.

We may have recorded a 4K Raw file, then rendered it out to Apple ProRes 4K,
so that many users could see the 4K Footage.

But, we are working very hard to provide 4K to a compressed codec as soon as possible.

The enabling infrastructure in our firmware is nearly complete. There are three parts to this enabling infrastructure:

1. Recording to a compressed codec at a high speed,

2. Playback of the compressed file at high speed, and

3. Rate control, during recording so that we meet the required specifications for the codec.

Items 1 and 2 are complete and we are working on Item 3.

(I am anxiously awaiting for the day when Item 3 is finished, as then our ability to provide 4K to a compressed codec should follow relatively soon thereafter.)

We intend to offer, for free, the ability to record 4K to a compressed codec, in 4K,
for the F55, for the Panasonic GH4 + YAGH, and for other cameras that output 4K, full uncompressed, over four HD-SDI 1.5G video streams, which is the industry standard for driving 4K Monitors.

And we intend to offer the ability to record 4K to a compressed codec for the Sony FS700 and Canon C500 as part of our extra cost options that support these cameras.

Thus, if you have the Odyssey7Q and want to record 4K to a compressed codec, from the F55 or GH4+YAGH, there will not be an extra option charge.

And if you already have the FS700 Raw Option, or the Canon C500 Raw Option, then there will not be an extra charge either.

I hope this helps.

Respectfully,
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Old May 17th, 2014, 02:41 PM   #7
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Allen View Post
Dan, just make sure you guys don't leave us in need of 4K time lapse in the dust!

Those of us who want to shoot in 4K RAW look forward to the 1TB SSD's too.
Dear Dave,

Yes, we want to offer 4K Timelapse.

Are you wanting this in 4K compressed, or 4K Raw?

We are also looking forward to 1 TB SSD's. The manufacturers have not provided us with pricing yet.

Respectfully,
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Old May 17th, 2014, 05:19 PM   #8
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Hi Dan. Time-lapse to 4k RAW for me, please.
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Old May 17th, 2014, 08:09 PM   #9
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Dear Arnt,

Thank you for letting us know your preference.

Respectfully,
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Old May 18th, 2014, 12:27 AM   #10
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Dan, I vote for RAW time lapse too, but only as a first choice of both. We need the extra dynamic range of RAW Slog2 and the ability to better grade in post. I still think both is better for those that don't want to dither around and need something quick. So perhaps time lapse in 4K compressed for later, RAW for now.
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Old May 18th, 2014, 06:33 AM   #11
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Dear Dave,

Thank you.

Respectfully,
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Old May 19th, 2014, 05:04 AM   #12
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Keaton View Post
Thus, in general terms, we expect to add this 4K compressed codec this summer....
to be honest: that does not sound too good. C-D is way behind the schedule of promised features and avoiding to announce a fixed date doesn't make things faster. I had a invest of 4.5k € and I really would like to know when I will be able to offer my clients 4K (4K RAW is no option with 20GB file size per minute). 4K2HD and 240fps is great and adds value to my work but the longer C-D takes with 4K ProRes the faster other cameras catch up.

Following the reliability of C-D's schedule as before "this summer" could also mean October. I am very sorry that I have to state that.

Last edited by Clermond Ferrand; May 19th, 2014 at 05:05 AM. Reason: grammar
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Old May 19th, 2014, 11:36 PM   #13
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Well, the alternative is is state it will be ready within a year, then always beat that prediction.

I am reminded of the ProRes upgrade.....they had it all ready to go, and Apple caused a delay. How does CD or anyone predict that sort of thing, nor know when an outside company will give approval? That was outside of their hands.

When it took forever to negotiate with Sony and for Sony to finally realize that cannibalizing their bazooka recorder was not a huge threat, that negotiation could not have a known outcome and timetable.

But we all get frustrated when we need a feature and have to wait, and can't plan a shoot or particular capability to a client.
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Old May 20th, 2014, 12:38 AM   #14
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Well, the alternative would have been switching to another camera system instead of buying the 7Q. But I like the FS700 and I was relying on C-D.

I think it's a bit lame to blame Apple for the delay. First of all C-D was experienced in this process from the Gemini and they should have known where the catch might be. I don't see Atomos heaving big concerns with Apple. Secondly it's out now for two months but we are still missing 4K. Thirdly the battery plate has now finally arrived at my local dealer 5 months later than the 7Q. How should I have shot on location without companies like WestSideAV (plus extra 50$ FedEx shipping?) Looking back at the promised DNxHD codec at the Gemini which is cancelled totally I have some concerns about "surprises". So c'mon C-D don't ask for future features but get going on what was announced from the beginning.
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Old May 21st, 2014, 07:54 AM   #15
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Re: FS700 4K Compressed - any idea when?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clermond Ferrand View Post
to be honest: that does not sound too good. C-D is way behind the schedule of promised features and avoiding to announce a fixed date doesn't make things faster. I had a invest of 4.5k and I really would like to know when I will be able to offer my clients 4K (4K RAW is no option with 20GB file size per minute). 4K2HD and 240fps is great and adds value to my work but the longer C-D takes with 4K ProRes the faster other cameras catch up.

Following the reliability of C-D's schedule as before "this summer" could also mean October. I am very sorry that I have to state that.
Dear Clermond,

Your criticism is noted.

Also, I hope I never blamed Apple for delaying our release of the Apple ProRes 422. There were many steps involved in creating support for this codec, including writing it from scratch. Obtaining certification from Apple is just one part of the process.

Our team is working very hard to provide a 4K compressed codec. This is our number one priority.

But, please remember that we have many engineers and they cannot all work on this one project as they would interfere with each other, thus other projects are being worked on simultaneously.

As soon as possible, we will make a more specific announcement about when we will release a 4K compressed codec.

Respectfully,
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