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Old May 17th, 2015, 02:55 PM   #1
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Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

The new Ultra HD Blu-ray spec has finally been completed. Features of the new standard include "Ultra HD" 3840x2160 resolution, Rec. 2020 expanded color gamut, 10-bit color depth, HVEC compression, and higher disc capacities.

Details: Blu-ray Disc Association Completes Ultra HD Blu-ray Specification
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Old May 25th, 2015, 03:24 PM   #2
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

The question is whether it's all too late.

Lots of people completely skipped Blu-ray, at least in Europe. They may still use DVDs but for HD content skipped over to online delivery solutions such as Netflix and Amazon.

Having to buy yet another player technology is going to put a lot of people off unless it's cheap, which new products rarely are.

Honestly, I don't see much of a future for it.
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Old May 25th, 2015, 03:37 PM   #3
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

Exactly. Blu-ray never really caught on, many people I know are still content using DVDs. Now the industry comes up with Ultra HD Blu-ray? YouTube and Vimeo already allow you to view UHD/4K+ streaming video, and even then, most people don't have UHD/4K+ displays to view it.
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Old May 25th, 2015, 09:17 PM   #4
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

4K streaming will eventually take over and be everything. However, today it's only done around 15Mbp/s and that is pretty feeble.

I think it will take at least 5 years before the average Joe's internet will be able to deliver 80+ Mbp/s reliably to his house and without dropouts. (and this is not counting 80+Mbp/s on his internal WiFi network to his TV)

I think that UHD BluRay will be the standard for content creators to deliver their work to clients. It should be cheap and convenient and will certainly be the highest quality UHD for at least a while.

In order for this to take off "quickly"...it's critical that blank media, movies and players all hit the market at a very cheap price point. If it all comes to market in a very expensive way, than it's going to be slow adoption by consumers. "Time" is not on UHD BluRay's side. It has a very short window to get a foot hold. If it doesn't come out the gate fast and hard, it's going to be dead in 2 or 3 years. The internet will eventually catch up and pass it by.

Now if players are $99 dollars and movie tiles are $19 dollars for major releases, than I think it has a good fighting chance for the next 5+ years. But again, it's got to come in fast, hot and CHEAP.

Judging be the initial specs, it seems as though making disks and players should not be much more complicated than BluRay hardware production costs today.(Maybe the biggest "new" cost will be the HEVC decoder chips?)

Hopefully MPEG LA licensing and anti-piracy crap wont slow it all down with red tape.

CT

Last edited by Cliff Totten; May 25th, 2015 at 10:02 PM.
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Old May 26th, 2015, 12:50 AM   #5
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

Sorry, players need to be $30 and discs $5. The feeding frenzy that TV's experienced in the last few years will never return until there is a new technology that no one has even thought of yet. The world is quite content with the current offering and has many other thrills in this world to spend their money on now.
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Old May 26th, 2015, 01:59 AM   #6
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

The challenge will be the entire 4K "chain"...

camera (with actual 4K quality that is visibly better than comparable HD capture devices),

computing horsepower capable of playback (video subsystem - Intel is getting there, but still buggy on drivers),

display device ($1000+ 4K TV's aren't going to cut it... need to be comparable again to HD prices, right now that's just a few 3rd/4th tier brands... though that "works", the Seiki I've got is cheap and works OK)

delivery channel - high bandwidth streaming...

Storage/delivery/archiving - Burners need to be under $100, from the get go, not 2-3 years from now, decent consumer players that are backwards compatible and will make DVD's and BR look "better" on a 4K display, again under $100 MSRP in the retail channel. Retail new release movies at DVD/BR prices, or maybe even yet another "extra disc", sub $20... and where applicable, re-release catalog at "bargain" pricing. Burnable media needs to come in as close to USB media as possible, and preferably significantly CHEAPER to jump start the market...

BR discs took a LONG time to come down to "cheap" prices, as did BR burners... probably due to the competing format fiasco, BR pretty much failed to launch. Hopefully the industry learned a few things and can give UHBR (OK, it will need a "catchier" name than THAT!) a better start up!


Having already taken the "jump" to 4K, and done it on the cheap, I have to say it can look REALLY REALLY good.... but HD TV's still look plenty good... and I am sure plenty of us know people who still watch SD on their HDTVs and don't really notice or seem to care how darn FUZZY it looks!
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Old May 26th, 2015, 08:12 AM   #7
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

I really wish the industry would keep HD for a long time to come. Just beef up that spec with higher color depth, wider color space, etc. For me, that is a much better use of bandwidth than higher resolution which average consumers will never see.

I do see the point of 4K for content creators thought (to ultimately deliver stunning HD).

For now, my family/friends are the only consumers of my content, so very happy to remain on HD. It also cost a small fortune to migrate from SD to HD and I don't want to go through another transition like that any time soon.
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Old May 26th, 2015, 08:41 AM   #8
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

"camera (with actual 4K quality that is visibly better than comparable HD capture devices), "
Everything shot with film can be converted,no?
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Old May 28th, 2015, 04:55 PM   #9
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliff Totten View Post
Now if players are $99 dollars and movie tiles are $19 dollars for major releases, than I think it has a good fighting chance for the next 5+ years. But again, it's got to come in fast, hot and CHEAP.
I've said it before, but the point that nobody has here mentioned (and is in Blu-Ray UHD's favour) is the backwards compatibility with both HD Blu-Ray and DVD discs.

So whilst I have many DVD's (and still buy some) I wouldn't buy a DVD only player - not now Blu-Ray players are so competitive in price. And after the manufacturers have made their premiums from early adopters I see the same thing here - even more so as UHD & HD Blu-Ray hardware should be so similar.

Streaming was always going to take market share from physical media but IMO the two will find a level - they each have strengths and weaknesses. Streaming is far from an answer unless your internet speed is good and reliable - and there people's experiences are likely to differ. That aside, I'd expect such as a movie collection to likely have far better longevity on physical media than as downloaded files. It needn't be the case with active backing up etc, but..... :-)

In short, get a UHD version of Blu-Ray player, and then don't worry too much about whether the disc is DVD, HD or whatever. Point is it'll play them all.
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Old May 28th, 2015, 07:18 PM   #10
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Re: Ultra HD Blu-ray Spec Completed

Speaking of compatibility with DVD and BluRay.

It appears that manufacturers might be able to press UHD BluRays with the exact same equipment and hardware that they already use today. This could mean that a BluRay factory will not need to retool or purchase new machines to build a new format.

If this is true, it's safe to assume that assembling UHD BluRay media will not cost anybody 1 penny more than it costs today. So,...there is no excuse for UHD BluRays to have ANY higher costs that will be passed on to the consumer.

We know H.265 is a processor hog and that will likely drive decoder chip costs up in players but lasers, transports and mechanics "could" be the same and that is a plus for everybody.

New authoring software will be necessary which will cause a little additional overhead though.

I wonder if the disk file structure will be the same as BluRay today?

I have 100% faith that Digital Rights Management, encryption and LAWYERS, LAWYERS and more LAWYERS are SURE to gunk the format up terribly....uggg.

CT
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