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PC or Mac, how to take your video to DVD or the Internet.


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Old August 29th, 2005, 02:14 AM   #1
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a real challenge for you all...

I'm having a tough time burning my footage to DVD. The format is no problem - it's Mpeg2 Transport Stream and whenever an encoder or author doesn't accept it I simply use RemuxTS to re-package it as Mpeg2 Program Stream, a format which they all accept...

No, the problem is that it's 50fps.

Actually, the footage is really 25p! It's simply packaged at 50p. 50p is the only way the cam, JVC GR-PD1, can output. In the past there has been some confusion over this. Many people understandably react by suggesting either that the 50p must really be 50i or that there must, at least, be an option on the cam to output at 25p. Afraid not. It's 25p footage, packaged at 50p, not 50i, and there is no option to output at 25p. The cam shoots in 25p or 50p - but whichever mode you shoot in you have to output 50p.

TMPGEnc DVD Author, Adobe Encore and DVD Lab all state, right away, that they can't handle 50fps.

TMPGEnc Express 3.0 by contrast doesn't grumble about the frame rate, but plays the picture twice at 2x the speed, like some NLEs.

DivxtoDVD doesn't say a word and burns the footage to DVD at the correct speed! Unfortunately, psychedelic distortion in some bright areas. I guess DivxtoDVD is the closest I have gotten?

Windows Media Player, Real Player and - like I say - DivxtoDVD do not seem to be thrown by 25p packaged at 50p. Inherently there isn't a problem. There's still only 25 differences a second. Each frame is shown twice. Unfortunately, I have yet to find a good way to burn.

I mean, I can burn by making what's called a 'convert stream' in the software that was bundled with the cam. This software also converts the Transport Stream to a Program Stream, but unlike RemuxTS it fixes the frame rate, packaging, everything to 25p. By contrast, there is an image quality dive.

I can also go through some NLEs that have recently learnt to handle the PD1's 50p packaging. Premiere/Mainconcept HD Plug in. Even more of an image quality dive.

I even tried using DVD Patcher, which allows you to mess with Mpeg2 Transport Streams and Program Streams - changed the frame rate of the header from 50p to 25p and the bit rate to 8. I even tried changing the whole file. DVD Lab and TMPGEnc DVD Author will finally accept the file, but DVD Lab crashes and TMPGEnc DVD Author burns the image at 2x speed!

In summary, I want software that will take me from my 50p Mpeg 2 Transport Stream / Mpeg Program Stream to DVD. Is it possible? The project is 75 mins in length. I have a dual layer burner if that is of relevance.

The fact that DivxtoDVD can do it directly, but has some distortion, encourages me.

I would really appreciate anyone's reflections on this, as I'm not a technical person and am starting to worry...
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Old August 29th, 2005, 06:48 PM   #2
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it comes with dvd authoring software called imagemixer... are you saying that you can't burn dvd's with that software, because it's re-encoding the footage to a frame rate other than what you shot it in?

as i understand it, you are saying that the 50p format isn't within the native dvd spec, hence the re-encoding nightmare.

"The PD1's recording combinations are numerous and potentially confusing, and the opportunities for shooting progressive widescreen digital video are impressive. Moreover, it can record all of its digital video formats to a standard DV tape, with MPEG-2 recording times being equal to those of DV thanks to 6-frame GOP (Group of Pictures) MPEG compression. Video recording options include DV, PS50 (MPEG-2) and Hi-Res (MPEG-2). The first is available in 625/50i 4:3 as well as standard interlaced PAL, whereas PS50 (progressive scan 50fps) is available in 4:3 and 16:9 modes. Hi-Res is a method of recording designed to give an unmistakenly film-like feel in 625/25p in both aspect ratios. Straight DV recording is made at an effective resolution of 839 x 576 pixels." -http://www.simplydv.co.uk/Reviews/jvc_grpd1.html

so the camera does have interlaced capability, it's probably more of a question of what mode you shot that particular clip in.

i think that one solution might be to look at a cineform lossless type of conversion codec, similar to the crippled workflow being used for editing hdv on slow computers.
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Old August 30th, 2005, 12:57 AM   #3
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Yes there are other recording modes on the camera - one is interlaced DV, the other is 50p. But I didn't shoot in either of these modes.

My footage is Hi-Res 625/25p. Had I been willing to output my Hi-Res 625/25p from the cam as analog, via the Component (Y/Pb/pr) output, I could have chosen between just two options, 50p or 50i.

Digitally there is only one option for the export of Hi-Res 625/25p: not 25p, 25i or 50i - strictly 50p. My footage is 25p, packaged as 50p. That's it.

Question is, where to from there!?

Currently, my best workflow is the original Mpeg2 TS - Mpeg 2 Convert Stream in KDDI software - TMPGEnc DVD Author or an equivalent author - not Imagemixer DVD, as it creates a poor quality DVD.

I am trying to remove the middle part of the equation? The Convert Stream? Which converts the 50p to 25p but also causes a drop in quality. I am trying to go directly from Mpeg2 TS (or PS, it's no problem to repackage it is as PS with RemuxTS) to encoding.. I am trying to encode 25p footage that is packaged as 50p.

Like I say, some software isn't thrown by this packaging - I just need to find software of good enough final quality.

By cineform would you be proposing Premiere, HDV Plug-in & Aspect HD?

Anyone know any other software that might handle it - that might get me to DVD?
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Old September 4th, 2005, 10:36 AM   #4
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I don't believe you will be able to "repackage" 50p as 25p for DVD, so you will need to decompress then re-encode. Convert the steam to a program stream, then load it into VirtualDub (the later versions support MPEG.) Then export as uncompress or to a good intermediate codec (CineForm.) If VirtualDub is confused by the 50 vs 25p, that can be overriden in the frame rate control. Now load this 25p AVI into your favorite MPEG2 encoder.
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Old September 4th, 2005, 11:29 AM   #5
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Thanks guys.
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Old October 3rd, 2005, 02:01 AM   #6
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The answer to this turned out to be Procoder Express. It accepted the Mpeg2 TS from the JVC GR-PD1 and allowed me to simply specify that it was 25.00 frames per second. The resulting quality was very high - none of the degradation that occured taking other routes.

Many thanks to Graham Hickling!
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Old November 8th, 2005, 01:58 AM   #7
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Although I found some quality problems late in the 70 minute DVD.

Sonic DVDit Pro 6, however, burns the cam's 25p(50p) Mpeg2TS directly to DVD without confusion over the frame rate quirk and the best quality I've seen yet - all you have to do is rename the extension from m2t to mpg

Also a nice DVD designing programme apart from that!
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Last edited by Graham Jones; November 8th, 2005 at 03:33 AM.
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