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Final Cut Pro X
The latest version of FCP from Apple.


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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:20 AM   #16
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Regarding old projects... Clients can want to update old projects, the content can be valid, but it needs adjustments or updates and they don't want to spend money on a editing a completely new version. Perhaps this could be something they do every year, so the mid 1990s version may only be a percentage of the content.

It's rather like Microsoft bringing out a version of Word that can't read files from the previous versions of Word
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Old July 24th, 2011, 04:49 AM   #17
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Actually, the biggest group of complainers are young guys who have been brought up editing on FCP. They've not seen change before and they can't handle it.

I read one so-called expert exclaim he'd been editing for all of eight years, first on Avid then on FCP. He really thought he knew his stuff. The reality is he knew a lot about FCP7, but little outside of his limited experience.

Some of us started with sticky-tape and have moved from film to tape and on to NLEs. That experience allows for a more balanced judgement.

My own judgement is FCPX is years ahead of the competition in certain areas, but it's also years behind in other areas. I can use it on certain projects, but not all, so will run both FCPX and FCP7 for the short term. Certainly, I see know point in jumping ship to Adobe or Avid.

It's up to individuals and companies to decide if it fits their needs, but they should keep an open mind and at this price point people should download it and give it a thorough workout before making that judgement.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 06:51 AM   #18
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

You should probably re-read my post a little more thoroughly. I listed the inability to import legacy projects as a "legitimate gripe".

Cool off, old timer!(just kiddin, and no, 40 does not make you an "old codger"...I hope not, ill be there in 5.)

-burk
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Old July 24th, 2011, 01:45 PM   #19
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Davis View Post
David,

I'm honestly interested. Do you edit on FCP-X or is this just your impressions of how it looks to work from watching the demos?

Everything I've read from those who use it, none of them seem concerned that X's compound clip vertical orientation provide less flexibility than the stacked horizontal linear clips of FCP-7. Just that it's a very different way to approach the issue of multiple video assets arranged simultaneously over time.

Genuinely interested.
Bill,

I do have FCP X that I purchased about 3 weeks ago. So, my impressions are based on both my own experience and other editors opinions that I work with out here at NASA, here in Houston, and those posted opinions like Scott Simmons and Oliver Peters. Just so you guys know I graduated with a degrtee in Film/Televisiosn from Sam Houston State in 1985. Started out as a CMX editor (CMX Edge), then migrated over to BVE 950 Sony with Betacam SP and one inch linear bay. In 1994 I partnered with a guy and bought an Avid Media Composer 1000 in 1994. As an aside, moving to non-linear editing from linear was by far more "revolutionary" than moving to FCPX from Avid.)

IF you're interested go and listen to the gentelman who beta tested Edit Droid from Lucas Film, the precurser to Avid and everything else and he wonders as I if the trackless magnetic time line is really all that flexible, he is being honest. But, here's something I encountered last night after my post.

Case in point,

Last night I play with a test sequence in which I laid a music track down as a primary storyline and started laying in video as connected clips. Then to my surprise guess what. You cannot add trasnsitions between those video clips. Why, because it appears that FCPX assumes transitions are only for the "primary storyline" Try it yourself if you don't believe me. That is something that you can do in every other edit program with tracks. No exception.

So, here is the crazy workaround I stumbled on. Add placefolder or gap at the beginning of the sequence, drag music down and move connected clips to primary storyline. That is several mouse clicks and a lot of dragging just to move music down and video to prmary to allow for transitions. In every other program, it is two mouse clicks, new tracks and that is it.

Try doing a rolling trim across 10 or tracks like Avid can and in FCPX. You cannot do it without I guess creating a bunch of compound clips. Prove me wrong, please. I'm sure some of you will say I won't ever edit 10 tracks. Well that may be true for one man shops, but not a facility setup with commercial or even sometimes corporate clients.

The basic "storyline" metaphor in FCPX assumes all of this supposed flexibility but is designed to help keep everything in sync. Which takes away flexibility, Imagine if your car decided to drive itself and assumed you would always make right turns because they are safer than left turns. You would literally drive in circles.

BTW, for all of you guys that are younger,,,and you're interested in working professionally in a day to day production company or department. I really suggest you learn Avid or Adobe Premiere,,, like now.

The future of FCPX is not written yet. And don't confuse simplicity with "simple editing" easy to use with 3 or FCPX storylines compared to editing complex sequences with lots of audio tracks and video layers that are common with professionals. If you're an FCPX editor and love it then great. But, if you're seriously want to edit and get paid a salary then you need to learn how to collaborate, learn other editing programs,,,,and yes ,,,learn from some the old codgers. Because I may be 49 punching 50, but I have adapted from editing film on a flatbed to linear tape editing to non-linear on a computer. And that was hard work and i will not take a back seat to any younger editor. I am very competitive!!!! I am learning FCPX, I know Avid MC, FCP 7, Adobe Premiere, Edius, and Vegas (somewhat). There are a lot of older editors who are at the top of the mountain editing projects with real budgets, real money, real paychecks. They don't like FCPX as a whole. We are willing to teach,,but not to those who won't listen.

Cheers. (Sorry for typos but I'm in a hurry) peace.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 02:14 PM   #20
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Hey David,
I too have noticed the inability of adding transition between connected clips. It's annoyed me, and when I was reading your post I was thinking to myself, "Apple can't possible be this stupid as to not make that possible". (I'm sure some would beg to differ...). So, I went digging to see if I could find a way to do it. It sems that X just kind of regards secondary clips as individual cutaways unless you tell it otherwise. But if you select a group of connected clips, then right click, you see an option for "Create Storyline", or just press Command-G. Which then groups them together, and makes them function more like the primary storyline. Now you can simply select the edit point between two clips and add transitions. Very easy. But what it still can't do, as far as I can tell, which I need to do right this moment, is to be able to add transitions from a connected clip, back into the primary storyline. Can't seem to find a way to do that. Still looking...

p.s. Thanks for sharing about your long career and diverse experience in many platforms of editing. It's always important in periods of major transitions in paradigms, for us "new guys" not to loose respect for the importance, knowledge and experience of the "old ways", and the "old codgers" who used them.

Cheers,

Ben
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Old July 24th, 2011, 02:21 PM   #21
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

David.

You have to know how FCPX works. Just select the clips on that row and hit Command G and you have Secondary Storyline. Then you have good old fashioned track with transitions etc.

I've been working with FCPX since it was released. If you understand how it works it's much more flexible than track based editing in my experience.

Connected clips have a different purpose than Secondary Storylines. Again that's something you have to understand. Connected clips are used when you need to tie the relationship to a specific clip or frame in the timeline. Secondary Storylines have only one connection point. If you try to use a screwdriver to hammer in a nail you will certainly be frustrated. Understand the tools and you understand the flexibility of the tool kit. In other NLEs I only have tracks, in FCPX I have choice.

Secondary Storylines still need some work though.
I submitted the following feedback to Apple.
Preference setting to make Secondary Storylines the default behavior.
Preference setting that makes a Connected Clip a Secondary Storyline when adding a transition or a popup box asking if you would like to make it a Secondary Storyline.
Precision Editor needs to work in Secondary Storyline (it doesn't currently).
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Old July 24th, 2011, 02:48 PM   #22
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Quote:
But what it still can't do, as far as I can tell, which I need to do right this moment, is to be able to add transitions from a connected clip, back into the primary storyline. Can't seem to find a way to do that. Still looking...
Make connected clip a Secondary Storyline and add a dissolve at the end.

Alternately, Control V to show keyframe editor and use the opacity fader handle.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:04 PM   #23
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

I agree with Shaun, there seems to be of late ppl sniping at anyone who hasn't embraced FCPX as an old codger. Its pretty simple if you need to open previous projects or rely on a feature that they've dropped like muli-camera mixing, then all the new stuff FCPX offers doesn't mean much.

Let's be honest, the basic method of non-linear editing hasn't changed. Professional editors don't do a lot of dragging and dropping, we use key commands because its the fastest way to work. Apple's primary intent of FCPX broaden its appeal by dumbing down the interface to iMovie drag and drop method and then added some pro features to justify paying for it.

On topic: meta tags feature is nice and I also like pinning feature to hold a clip to another.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:07 PM   #24
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Thanks Craig and ben. I will give it a try later tonight. Secondary Storylines.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:19 PM   #25
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
Make connected clip a Secondary Storyline and add a dissolve at the end.

Alternately, Control V to show keyframe editor and use the opacity fader handle.
Thanks. I'll play with that later on!
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:35 PM   #26
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Pete, the problem is not about the missing features which people acknowledge, it's people claiming features are missing but are there. Some of them need better implementation but that's going to happen.

If it's really "dumbed down" than why do so many people not understand how it works? Actually I think it gives many more choices in some cases. Connected Clips and Secondary Storylines are one example. In other places it's unnecessarily convoluted. Try adding an audio only dissolve.

Dissolve - drag and drop or command T just like FCP7
Video only dissolve - Expand Clip then drag and drop or command T - more complex
Audio only dissolve - detach audio, make secondary storyline, drag and drop or command T - extremely complex.

Audio only dissolve should be the same ad Video only dissolve - Expand Clip.

Expand Clips gives me very good and precise control over video and audio for split edits. Much easier than FCP7.

But Expand Clips has a problem with Dual Mono Audio. I want to see both tracks displayed. Instead I have to Detach Audio to have control over the two audio channels.

So I'm well aware of issues others don't even bring up because they haven't gone that deep. I expect the above issues will be fixed in updates though. Certainly none of this is dumbing down though. It's actually unnecessary complexity.

Apple's making certain assumptions. That people doing audio crossfades will use the faders for more precise control in Expand Clips rather than wanting to simply drop in an audio only dissolve. That most people with dual mono audio will disable one of the channels (done in the Inspector) such as in Shotgun backup and Lav primary mics. Many though actually use two separate mic feeds for interviews or want to keep the shotgun for ambiance control.

All that, and I still think FCPX will be a killer, very fast, very flexible NLE as they improve this stuff.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:43 PM   #27
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Features I like:

Conform Speed. If you have 24p timeline and drop in a p60 clip and use Conform Speed you get your slowmo. Many people shoot p60 for slowmo and you no longer need to convert AVCHD to ProRes and then reflag in Cinema Tools.


Rate Conform. Working with mixed frame rates. FCPX gives you four choices how to handle. Drop clip in timeline and go to Inspector and you have the following options:
Floor (default) truncates to nearest integer
Nearest Neighbor rounds to nearest integer, (reduces artifacts but might stutter)
Frame Blending creates in between frames by blending
Optical Flow creates frames by analyzing pixel motion to create new frames.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:48 PM   #28
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Spatial Conform.
When working in different frame sizes files can fit the timeline frame size by either Fit, Fill, none (which doesn't try to conform to the frame size. This is good when mixing SD and HD frame sizes. FCP legacy modified the file in the motion tab but FCPX keeps this function separate from scaling (called Transform).
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Old July 24th, 2011, 03:58 PM   #29
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

Range Selection.
Audio level advantage. Select a range within a clip and bring down (or up ) the level. No need to create keyframes it does that for you. You can go into the keyframe editor if you'd like to change them.

Video Retime advantage. In Retiming (Command R), select a range and change the speed of the selected range. It will ramp into and out of the range. Select Optical Flow generally for best quality. Simply grab the in or out of the range and move to change the speed of the range. The one downside is there's no keyframe control over the ramp in/out.

Retiming
As noted above, it's easy to have multiple speed changes ramping in and out. Doing it as connected clip assured no rippling while work on the clip. Then decide how you want to fit in to the Primary Storyline. Downside is that there's no fit to fill although it's easy to stretch or compress to match the in/out of the Primary Storyline.
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Old July 24th, 2011, 05:20 PM   #30
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Re: Tell me what is GOOD about FCP X

The very easy way to open old projects is to open them in FCP7, that's my plan. Suitable new projects are being started in FCPX and any legacy stuff continues in FCP7. It works fine in Lion and alongside FCPX and will continue to do so.
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