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Old April 8th, 2013, 11:18 AM   #1
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Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

I tried fcpx for the first time yesterday, I had a simple 2 track multiclip, o my gosh I could not make it work, I watched tutorials on multiclip and thought it looked so easy, I think I will love fcpx after I learn its work flow better. But I'm sad that I may have to go back to fcp7 for the next couple projects. Could not get multiclip working and when I got it playing in the viewer it would not remember angle changes and it would pause for a second when trying to change camera angles. I think the pause maybe to background analyzing?
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Old April 8th, 2013, 12:16 PM   #2
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

What is it that isn't working? There are great tutorials online. Multicam editing is sooooo easy.

Did you try this?

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Old April 8th, 2013, 05:47 PM   #3
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

Unless you have the computer horsepower and data throughput, you may want to convert to Proxy media for multi-cam editing. Makes everything run so much more smoothly especially when dealing with highly compressed formats.
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Old April 9th, 2013, 12:20 AM   #4
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

That's funny because.......multicam is about the ONLY thing I like about FCP X better than
FCP 7. Granted, that is because I have a TON of time invested in learning FCP 7 and all
the keyboard shortcuts, and I just speak it's 'language'. FCP X is like a foreign language
to me as I never used iMovie and really don't get much of what is going on in FCP X.
It reminds me of an 'auto everything' camera vs. one with manual control. The software
'assumes' it knows what I want to do and just starts doing it,....clips 'snapping' to other
clips because of the magnetic timeline, footage automatically transcoding to ProRes and
so on and so forth. I know exactly what I want to do, and I'll tell you if that's what I want
you silly software!!! But, FCP X is just freaking fast compared to FCP 7. I'm on an old
2009 Mac Pro Quad Core with 16gigs of Ram and the speed increase is huge. For
simple multicam edits, I love FCP X, as it will synch them using audio waveforms. and then
I can 'skim' through the multicam clip.....just changing shots when I see I need to.
It used to take me 45 minutes to do a hour and a half multicam show in FCP 7.
I can seriously do it in about 10 minutes in FCP X as I use the skimming tool to
zip through and see where I need to switch angles. It is so fast, it's not even funny.
Plus it's basic, I am not stacking clips, compositing, and doing fancy stuff, cause I
just know the very basics of FCP X. So I use FCP X as kind of a 'plug in' to do certain
things that I can do faster with it than FCP 7. Eventually, I hope to learn it, but it will
take awhile. For now, I have FCP 7, FCP X and CS 6 all on my computer and use
them all for different things.

So, my question would be, what computer/RAM and so on do you have? What type of video
codec are you using? I've got the aforementioned Quad Core 2.66ghz Mac Pro with
16 gigs of Ram and I shoot with a Sony NEX FS100 on AVCHD 2.0 footage (which is
pretty processor intensive) and have no issues with speed. It zips right through multicam
clips without any proxy or other transcoding.
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Old April 9th, 2013, 10:15 AM   #5
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

You don't like background rendering?
You don't like being able to export a project while still working on another project?
You don't like the over all speed compared to FCP7?
You don't like the scrolling through clips without having to open them?
You don't like all the speedy features such as being able to command clips to enter the timeline?
you don't like the waaaaaaay better audio capacity?
You don't like the simpler and better color correction?

I could go on..

The only thing you like is multicam?
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Old April 9th, 2013, 04:50 PM   #6
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

If that question(s) were aimed at me, I'll do my best to answer.

1. Background rendering is cool......except when it starts to slow my editing to a
crawl because the computer can't deal with both rendering and editing. It depends on
the complexity of the project, but this happens to me sometimes, and when it does, I end up
just waiting for the project to finish rendering before I continue as it is so slow. In summary,
I like it about 75% of the time and hate it 25% of the time which is a net positive I guess.

2. I LOVE being able to export a project while still working. This sometimes slows
down what I am working on but still, big thumbs up.

3. Overall speed, again a big plus....I mentioned this in my post. FCP X is freaking fast.

4. No, I actually don't like scrolling through clips without opening them. I guess that
is my ingrained habits about how I am used to editing. I click on a clip to insert into
the timeline, and it starts trying to select just part of the clip. If I wanted part of the clip
I'd set in and out point! That yellow 'active' area annoys the snot out of me!!

5. Command clips to enter the timeline? I did that before by clicking once on them and hitting
f10. Worked pefectly fine in FCP 7

7. Way better audio capacity? In what way? I liked the old audio better in a lot of ways, the mixer,
the ability to separate audio tracks easier. Maybe the new FCP X audio has way better audio
capacity, I just don't know in what way that is. As I said, I'm new with it and attempting to learn it,
but as a working one man video guy, I don't have a lot of time to learn new programs, I have to
keep pumping out content to get paid.

8. Simpler and better color correction? Yikes I hate the new CC. The old 3 way made much more
sense to me, as did the match color function. I can't even get the new match color function to
work. I tried it last night, and every single time I clicked on 'match color' it totally froze my
computer. It said 'skim to a new frame that you would like to match the color from' but the
stinking playhead was FROZE and nothing I could do would move it. I had to force quit FCP X and
try again. After 4 tries, all with the same behavior, I finally just manually tried to color correct, and
with the new way of CC, it wasn't that good a job done by me, I'd much prefer the color wheels....
not to mention being able to round trip to Color!!!!

In conclusion, the biggest plus is the speed. But the strange new interface, while probably fine
for newer editors, can wreak havoc with pro editors who are used to a certain way of doing things.
I wish they made it more 'adjustable'. Heck, keep the new way for all those who love it, but allow
those who liked FCP 7 to set it up more like that with a track based workflow and so on. It IS
moving that direction, you can use the position tool to do some of the track based stuff, but
still a lot of craziness. But hey, if you like it, that's awesome! I wish I understood it better,
cause it's stinking fast that's for sure!
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Old April 9th, 2013, 05:28 PM   #7
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

The negative experience with a new version of a program is understandable and this is going to be true, for the most part, no matter what program it is. At least it has in the past when programs would have significant "improvements."

Writing this while not on my editing computer makes it more difficult, but to answer point #1 about rendering, it is only two clicks to turn Background Rendering Off or On (at least that's how I remember it).

Since my computer is on the low end of what is the minimum required the Background Rendering is standardly turned OFF until I am essentially finished with the job, or, if I have a break I might turn it on. I'm talking short jobs up to, say, 5 to 10 minutes. Since I tend t make a lot of edits it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to keep re-rendering all the time.

Turning rendering OFF will speed up the regular work and help avoid computer/software "problems".

Last edited by John Nantz; April 9th, 2013 at 05:29 PM. Reason: spelling no => not
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Old April 10th, 2013, 11:17 AM   #8
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

Gabe, regarding grading, don't mix "interface" with other aspects of the color board. Yes I'd prefer color wheels as well but the internal processing is at much higher resolution than it was in FCP7 and masking and the layering of such masks is far and away superior to FCP7. Yes the color match feature is not reliable nor are its auto features but most professional colorists don't use such features anyway. They do balancing and contrast in a first pass (correction) before they go into the looks building.

You might want to watch this free tutorial from Color Grading Central.
Free Final Cut Pro X Grading Tutorials

Outside of the lack of color wheel, FCPX color grading really blows away FCP7.

and these three very inexpensive plugins add a few key features from nocommotions

Colour Picker which really helps with white/black balance rather than hunting for an object in a scene
Nocommotions - Colour Picker - YouTube

Broadcast Safe - useful although one should always do this by hand first. This would cover the missed spots to prevent a show from getting rejected.
Nocommotions - Broadcast Safe Pro - YouTube

Colour Compare which is sort of like the still store one would use in a professional grading app to do shot to shot matching.
Nocommotions - Colour Compare - YouTube

FCP7 just doesn't come close to these features.
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Old April 10th, 2013, 11:34 AM   #9
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

Gabe, audio handling is better in some key areas although there's still a lot more work that needs to be done. Apparently you never have to do subframe audio editing. It was such a nightmare in FCP7 that it often wasn't worth the bother. FCPX can move audio in 1/80th of a frame increments. This in addition to keyframing in such small areas to pull out the odd pop/click. That 1/80 frame adjustment is important if you're actually using the audio from multiple cameras in a multicam shoot because of time delays to the different camera positions. It's also very important when doing ADR work and the sync is every so slightly rubbery.

Then there's the Logic AU plugins. Having Logic plugins right in the NLE is killer. Of course it would be nice to "aux bus" a role to an AU plugin would help. Again some work is needed but the plugins are there and we all wait for that next step.

Range selection is another great way to manually adjust levels. It adds the keyframe for you. Which you can always adjust of course. Need to lower (or raise) a level just Range it and bring in down (or up) and you have the four keyframes added.

There's also Surround Sound handling although, granted, that's not something a lot of people are using.

I also think doing split L/J edits is much easier and more intuitive in FCPX.

Of course I'd like to see round tripping to Logic. That might even make more sense that trying to fix a mixer into FCPX. Key would be to sending roles over. Ideally changes would be "dynamic" (given nothing is ever locked when it comes to client indecision).

My own guess is that roles "grouping" is going to be improved and round tripping will happen with Logic (and Motion) when Logic Pro X happens along with some better under the hood communication. If all Apple where doing was simple FCPXML transfer they might have been able to do that already. I have a hunch it's going to a bit more powerful than that.
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Old April 12th, 2013, 02:40 PM   #10
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

We all can find faults. But lets face it, when FCP started first we had the whooo factor and iMovie was a software for the basic people.
Today we have moved into higher technology or money spinner for Apple.
For some FCP is hard to learn and for others it is a breeze. If you have to make a living from editing then you want the best and fastest.
I say if you are happy with the software you got and it does the job and you are under no pressure to get your material out. Don't rock the boat.
I use FCP-X why.... not because i want this and it can do that. I love its simplicity and it is easy to understand. FCP7 was a nightmare for me to grasp. Not than i'm thick but onces learning curve takes longer at a certain age. Plus my editing was done in the days of 35 mm, 16 mm and Super 8. Our fastest software was hand and scissors.
Some very good debate on FCP-X
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Old April 12th, 2013, 03:06 PM   #11
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

I go back to the days of CMX340 as well as Datatron edit controllers. When tracks came into use with NLEs I was frustrated by their cross purposes of compositing and organization. Decades later Apple's FCPX is finally an NLE that separates the Timeline and Connecting clips above/below and organization with Roles. Fundamentally it's why I like FCPX. It has great organizing tools.

The timeline has incredibly flexible layering. Connected clips, not associated with each other stay that way unless I decide otherwise (Secondary Storyline). If they both are a specific kind of cutaway or title it's because I gave them a common Role, not because they are on a linear path. To me that's intuitive. It seems people without prior editing experience get that as well. There's no "coercive" association along linear paths. The editor has complete control over that.

I suspect for many of those who grew up with tracks, they have a hard time breaking the "coerced" association along linear path for objects that should be disassociated except maybe by function (Role). For them, it's probably like trying to force a right handed person to become left handed.

I've wanted this freedom since I first used Avid around 1990. While FCPX still needs to grow a bit I'm finally glad someone addressed the UI paradigm that makes intuitive sense to me.
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Old April 13th, 2013, 01:48 PM   #12
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig Seeman View Post
My own guess is that roles "grouping" is going to be improved and round tripping will happen with Logic (and Motion) when Logic Pro X happens along with some better under the hood communication. If all Apple where doing was simple FCPXML transfer they might have been able to do that already. I have a hunch it's going to a bit more powerful than that.
My suspicion is that in the near future we will see Logic Pro X, as well as a big FCPX 10.1 update, with tons of integration and it will be a powerhouse. I think that's why it took so long for the 10.0.8 update to come up, as badly as it was needed. The whole teams were working on the other two projects, and I bet they were hoping they could just get them out and skip straight to 10.1; but then had to pull people away because .8 was needed so urgently.

That all just pure speculation though...
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Old May 7th, 2013, 12:57 PM   #13
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Re: Hate fcpx, I no I will love it after learning

Just throwing in my extra 2 cents. My 2008 MBP died in January so when I had to buy a new one, I died to upgrade all my software. I went from FC6 to FCP X. Yes, it was very alien and frustrating for the first few days. I couldn't even figure out how to do a simple cross dissolve. But as others have said, there are so many tutorials and wealth of info out there that I solved every issue I had with a quick Google search.

I've been using it now for several months and I'm very happy with it, it's easy to work with.
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