Monitors, so many to choose from. at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > Apple / Mac Post Production Solutions > Final Cut Suite

Final Cut Suite
Discussing the editing of all formats with FCS, FCP, FCE


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old March 30th, 2002, 04:16 AM   #1
Trustee
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Chigasaki, Japan.
Posts: 1,660
Monitors, so many to choose from.

I'm doing it, bye bye PC editing, hello G4/FCP3. What I want to know is what monitors are people using and what do they think about them. I've currently got a 19" Mitsubishi Diamondshape which is great, but it's staying with my PC for web/graphics work.

I'm particularly interested in
1. Apple 22" Cinema Display
2. Dual 21" Sony's
3. Dual 17" Apple Studio Displays.

I know Apple has just released the 23" HD Display so if any one is using that I'd also like to hear your opinions

Another question is how is a Sony Studio Monitor hooked up to the Mac?
Adrian Douglas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 05:27 AM   #2
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Austin, TX USA
Posts: 2,882
Funny you ask, Adrian. I'm going to the electronics market tomorrow to look at Sony pro monitors for my Mac. I'm looking at the 8" to 14" models.

I'll let you know what I find out.
__________________
John Locke
SursumFilms.com
John Locke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 10:28 AM   #3
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,943
If you can swing the 22" Cinema Display -just do it-! The 16:9 aspect ratio is perfect for FCP. It's an excellent digital LCD display. I wouldn't even think about alternatives for a video editing Mac station.
__________________
Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission.

Hey, you don't have enough stuff!
Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really!

See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com
Ken Tanaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 10:36 AM   #4
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Austin, TX USA
Posts: 2,882
Adrian,

Concerning the Cinema display, this link has a PDF file that you can download that gives a blow-by-blow comparison against other monitors

http://www.apple.com/creative/resources/acd/
__________________
John Locke
SursumFilms.com
John Locke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 11:38 AM   #5
sergeant
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Monitors, so many to choose from.

<<<-- Originally posted by Adrian Douglas : I'm doing it, bye bye PC editing, hello G4/FCP3. What I want to know is what monitors are people using and what do they think about them. I've currently got a 19" Mitsubishi Diamondshape which is great, but it's staying with my PC for web/graphics work.

I'm particularly interested in
1. Apple 22" Cinema Display
2. Dual 21" Sony's
3. Dual 17" Apple Studio Displays.

I know Apple has just released the 23" HD Display so if any one is using that I'd also like to hear your opinions

Another question is how is a Sony Studio Monitor hooked up to the Mac? -->>>

HI ADRIAN....

Been doing a lot of research on this G4... Now thinking seriously about gettin a G4 dual 1G w/1.5m ram and adding a couple of Seagate X15 Cheeta's to it , all along, with FCP3... Have a 19" Sony right now, but thinking of one of the Apple flat displays, however that may be later.... Is there any trouble between FCP3 and the XL1s??? Been using Premier 6 with Pinnacle DV500 and it's a REAL pain even tho my PC is big and top drawer all the way thru.... Trying to get as many opinions as I can before spending those big bucks..... Just too bad I didn't go that way first before going with Adobe and Pinnacle..... Also, would you know if Adobe After Effects Production bundle will work with FCP3, as I already have that??? Trying to find a "perfect" editing system seems so hard.... Trouble is I can't afford to spend no $50,000. on one... I'm just one little guy making police training films for my department and they won't kick in any bucks, other than for tapes and supplies... I do it for the love of it.... Just married to my police work and my video, not a women, and happy.... By the way, since switching to DV, I have a big editing rack with Panasonic NV8500's including a soundcraft mixer and much more, that I'm looking to sell... Know anyone stateside that may be interested???? I live in Tennessee.... Send them my way if you know of someone...

Later... Ron

By the way... You'll have to hook up your monitor to the output of your camera or your DV deck.... I have a Panasonic AG1000 hooked up to my computer and the monitor hooked to it's output..
  Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 06:55 PM   #6
Warden
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 8,267
Hi Ron,

I wouldn't bother with the big seagate drives. Their speed is way overkill for DV. However, if you are editing uncompressed video via the Digital voodoo, CineWave from Pinnacle or the Aurora board they are great. I would buy two big 120 gig 7200 ide drives and raid them with the Sonnet board. Total cost maybe $600.00 and blazingly fast. Spend the savings on the biggest Apple cinema displays you can afford.

Good luck.

Jeff Donald
Jeff Donald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 08:14 PM   #7
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Austin, TX USA
Posts: 2,882
I've used the Cinema Display for over a year now...and can't imagine how I ever got by without it. It's great for lots of reasons, not just for DV--such as having easy access to multiple open programs, large rendition of fonts so that you can sit back and read (no squinting), side-by-side comparison of files, etc. But for FCP, it is especially convenient since the tool window layout fills the screen perfectly and still gives you plenty of working room. You can choose between the "two up" or "three up" (my preference) window layout--the three up puts it all right there in front of you.

Now that I've upgraded to the dual 1 gHz G4, I have no complaints at all. It came with a Seagate 80 Gb drive and I added one more 60 Gb (hard to get larger sized HDs here). Plus, I bumped the memory up to 1 Gb. With these additions, I have no problem with storage or with having multiple programs open...and render times are blazing fast.

I'm looking into adding a DV deck and studio monitor...and am heading to check out studio monitors today. The only downside to this is that I'll have to get an analog capture card to add to my G4 that accepts s-video and RCA connections--they seem to be rare animals. Haven't found hardly any info on them.

The Sony DSR-11 deck can connect to the G4 via FireWire plus audio/video connections.

Adrian, concerning a "monitor plus deck" set up, Apple recommends attaching a deck to your G4 through an analog capture card. As for the types of inputs you'll need on your capture card, Apple says "S-Video is typically the highest quality of video used by high-end consumer video equipment" and then also says "Component YUV is as good as analog video gets" and adds that Component RGB is the next best choice (for the professional market).

After connecting the deck, you connect the studio monitor to the deck. You'll need to connect your external speakers to the deck.

If anyone has advice on capture cards for the Mac, I'd appreciate it.
__________________
John Locke
SursumFilms.com
John Locke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 08:19 PM   #8
Obstreperous Rex
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: San Marcos, TX
Posts: 26,900
Images: 513
I had the pleasure of editing some DV on an FCP system with an Apple Cinema Display while I was working at the Canon Imaging Center for the Winter Olympics, and it was simply stunning... to quote Ferris Bueller... "if you have the means, I highly recommend it."
__________________
CH

Search DV Info Net | DV Info Net Sponsors | A Decade (+5) of DVi | ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!
Chris Hurd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 08:26 PM   #9
Warden
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 8,267
Best Capture Card

Hi John,

I feel the best analog capture card for the Mac G4 / FCP is the Digital Voodoo boards. they are supposed to be intrducing a new one at NAB. what makes them so great? They are the olny board that does 10 bit as opposed to 8bit video. the use of 8 bit leads to double rounding which degrades the signal. the other choices are the CineWave board from Pinnacle and the Aurora Igniter board. All three boards are $2,000 and up. check out their sites for complete details. I've used the digital Voodoo and the Pinnacle board and the digital voodoo board is great. if you just need to get composite video into and out look at the Sony DVMC-DA2 or the Dazzle converter from Hollywood? Both do a decent job.

Jeff donald
Jeff Donald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 08:55 PM   #10
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Austin, TX USA
Posts: 2,882
Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the fast response. I took a look at your suggestions...the Voodoo Iridium SD card looks most interesting...it's 10-bit and is priced at $1,700.

http://www.digitalvoodoo.net/iridiumsd.htm

I'll hang tight and see what they announce at NAB.

CineWave RT also looks interesting...and has a price around $1,200

http://www.pinnaclesys.com/docloader.asp?templ=10&Product_ID=108&doclink=/dotMedia/cinewave/English(US)/doc/CinewaveWhatsNew.html

The reviews of the Aurora Igniter and it's $2,000 price make it a bit less appealing

http://www.auroravideosys.com/Pages/igniter.html

All three are great leads, Jeff. Thanks for the heads up.
__________________
John Locke
SursumFilms.com
John Locke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 09:14 PM   #11
Warden
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 8,267
10 bit vs. 8 bit

Hi,

I've seen side by side of the 10 bit voodoo vs the 8 bit cinewave and the differences are stunning. The voodoo site used to have a lengthy article on the advantage of the 10 bit over the 8 bit and how double rounding occursif the techies are interested. the bottom line though, is the major post houses that use the mac are almost all using the voodoo board. Follow some of the links at Apples site and you'll see.

Jeff
Jeff Donald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 30th, 2002, 11:30 PM   #12
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,943
John,

You and I have nearly identical Mac / FCP rigs. I have a Panasonic deck connected to the G4 via Firewire. My Sony 8" NTSC reference monitor is connected to one of the deck's analog outputs. The other outputs are connected to a video switch which lets me patch over to a 27" Sony or to a VHS deck.

Until Matrox releases useful OS-X drivers for my RTMac this setup works pretty well for me. I'd like to reinstall the RTMac board to at least get the use of its break-out box again.
__________________
Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission.

Hey, you don't have enough stuff!
Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really!

See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com
Ken Tanaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 31st, 2002, 01:09 AM   #13
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Austin, TX USA
Posts: 2,882
Ken,

I just spent the afternoon looking at/for capture cards, DV decks, and monitors at the big electronics market. The only thing I came back with was the Fontopia earbud headphones you recommended earlier (which are comfortable, don't slip, and have good sound, by the way).

Looking around, though, raised some questions.

For instance, why does the Apple diagram configuration in the FCP manual recommend connecting the deck to the computer with both FireWire and RCA plugs? Wouldn't the RCA plugs would be completely unnecessary with a FireWire connection? If that's the case, I can save a bundle by foregoing the capture card.

Also, what is the real advantage to having an NTSC reference monitor over just using a TV?

And, in reference to your message, Ken...what video switch are you using to connect to your TV and your VHS deck?
__________________
John Locke
SursumFilms.com
John Locke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 31st, 2002, 02:16 AM   #14
Retired DV Info Net Almunus
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 6,943
Hey John, glad to hear that you found the ear buds!

Re: deck connections, I never noticed the connection diagram in the FCP manual. Honestly, I really have no idea why you would connect both Firewire and analog (RCA) signals to the Mac. Firewire is all you really need to get audio and video in and out of the computer. Unless you're looking for uncompressed capture capabilities or needed to capture from an analog source I wouldn't imagine you'd need a separate capture board.

Re: my a/v switch, it's a real handy and relatively inexpensive device. Mine is a Sony "AV Selector SB-V66S". It can basically route up to 5 a/v sources among each other via RCA and/or SVHS connections. By design there is 1 "monitor" channnel (a 27" Sony TV on mine) to which any of the 5 sources can be switched via push buttons on the front panel. It can also route signals for copying between sources via push buttons. This switch is basically analog, requires no external power and adds nothing to the signals. It's only about an inch tall, is quite light-weight and has a footprint nearly identical to that of a VCR. I ordered mine through a local Radio Shack approx. 2 yrs ago. I'm pretty sure that it cost somewhere around $125.

Re: why use a NTSC reference monitor, certainly you can get by with just a regular tv. But most consumer sets cannot be calibrated accurately, cannot show underscan and are often set with a reddish bias (it helps sell sets). Reference monitors can easily be calibrated to SMPTE bars, can switch to 16:9 mode, can show or hide underscan, etc. If you're doing any serious color correction such a monitor is virtually indispensible. But otherwise you can certainly get along with a good-quality consumer set to preview your video.
__________________
Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission.

Hey, you don't have enough stuff!
Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really!

See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com
Ken Tanaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old March 31st, 2002, 03:14 AM   #15
Trustee
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Chigasaki, Japan.
Posts: 1,660
If your final output is going to be VHS, then a consumer TV is a must. When I was working in a recording studio back in 88, during the final mixdown stage, we would listen to the mix on the studio monitors, a set of consumer speakers, and finally in the car stereo to make sure it sounded good on all 3.

The consumer TV is for the same reason. People don't have reference monitors in their homes so what may look nice on a 500+ line ref monitor may look crappy on the ole HMV.

Unfortunately finding the perfect system involves walking into a TV station which just won't fit in a Japanese house, or my wallet.
Adrian Douglas is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > Apple / Mac Post Production Solutions > Final Cut Suite

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:43 AM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network