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Old November 21st, 2003, 12:06 PM   #1
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How often do you guys have to change to a new hard disk?

I have done 3 projects and used over 120 GB and have room for my next one and then I'm done. Am I doing something wrong? Because by my calculations I have only used about 50 Gigs and it says I have used 120? On the scratch disk, do you need to keep all the files that FCP automatically makes copies of? What about all the captured files that are in my project folder and then in another folder (can't remember what that folder is called off the top of my head?)?
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Old November 21st, 2003, 12:09 PM   #2
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If you're done with the project, why are you still keeping the files on your hard drive?
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Old November 21st, 2003, 12:23 PM   #3
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Indeed, you only really need to keep the FCP project file (usually relatively small) and any peripheral files created outside of FCP (ex: stills, composites, etc.) at the end of a project. You can then dump the "Capture" and "Render" folder contents for the project. You would be able to re-create the entire project, if needed, from the project file.
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Old November 21st, 2003, 12:36 PM   #4
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I guess I am being optomistic and hoping more people will call for more copies. I admit, I am a pack rat too.

Re-creating the project: So, when you dump the captured files I know it keeps "what" it was in the project file. I would then have to recapture all the material I assume. Then, re-render the project, export again, burn it and dump the files again? Is this a pain in the butt?
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Old November 21st, 2003, 12:40 PM   #5
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Slight delay while recapturing not so much a problem - if you have good tapes with no drops or breaks, and you have properly logged the footage from the start, then recapturing is a breeze... pop the tape in and go do other things until you need to change tapes.

Delay while rendering... again, not so much a problem - Render all, walk away and do other things.

when comparing the time it takes to recapture/rerender v. having to buy extra storage for a current project, I'll take the recapture/rerender option any day.

You might want to check out the tutorial I wrote a year or so ago called "Backing up at Project End". It is part of my Final Cut Pro Quick Tip series and can be accessed on my site.

Cheers...
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Old November 21st, 2003, 12:57 PM   #6
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Stephen, thanks for the info! Great site...

From the tutorial:

"...as long as you have remembered to label your tapes correctly..."

#!*@ I forgot to label my tapes by reel and take, etc. That sucks. Hey, live and LEARN....

How do the rest of you guys do it? ...the project file way or something else?
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Old November 21st, 2003, 01:05 PM   #7
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At the start of every shoot I label my tape before popping them in my camera. For example; if I am shooting a convention I might label my tape NAB_2003_D1_T1. This equate to (in my logical stream of thought) NAB 2003 Convention, Day 1, Tape 1. If I have multiple cameras doing the same shot (for example one camera doing a wide shot and the other camera doing close ups), I label the wide camera NAB_2003_D1_T1a and the other NAB_2003_D1_T1b.

Each tape has it's own unique timecode... Tape(s) 1 always start with 1:00:00;00, Tape(s) 2 always start 2:00:00;00, etc.

What happens in a situation when I am shooting and need a new tape and haven't labeled it yet? Well Timecode helps, but if I am really busy, I just assign a pocket of my pants (or other location) with a mental label system, and then at the end of the day, when emptying the pockets, place the labels on them.

When I digitize my footage, I just label the Tape in FCP the same way as I labled the tape on the case. HOWEVER, I did have an Avid instructor always want to thwonk me upside the head for labeling this way. He always insisted on labeling tapes 001, 002, etc., so when you went to an online system like a Grassvalley or CMX that they would understand that labeling convention.

Hope that helps
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Old November 21st, 2003, 01:29 PM   #8
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Clayton, if your worried about making copies make a mini DV copy and use the XL1 as a source machine.
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Old November 21st, 2003, 01:46 PM   #9
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Jeff, that's a great (duh) idea. But, wouldn't be cheaper to make a DVD of the project and then just use Toast to copy the DVD? And, wouldn't it last longer?

Stephen, what is Grassvalley and CMX?

And, do I have this correct? Your instructor wanted you to start labeling tapes at 001 and go to 999? Having no idea what was on the tape?

I guess you just have to find a system that works for you and go with it as long as you understand it and can explain to others!
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Old November 21st, 2003, 01:54 PM   #10
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Sorry, forgot to ask....

So, when you label a tape in FCP (actually in the program) after you insert it in the deck, it records that label onto the tape and will forever be recognized by FCP as what you have named it?

And, I assume you can't go back and do that, you have to do it the first time? Or, since I haven't deleted any footage yet, can I go back and label them now (in FCP) so all my clips are associated with specific tapes for recapture?
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Old November 21st, 2003, 02:45 PM   #11
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<<<-- Originally posted by J. Clayton Stansberry : Jeff, that's a great (duh) idea. But, wouldn't be cheaper to make a DVD of the project and then just use Toast to copy the DVD? And, wouldn't it last longer?

If you're talking about just keeping the 'data' part of your project and not the footage then a DVD would work. However, if you are talking about the visual footage (and final project) a DVD only holds 4.7 gigabytes, a tape much more than that. So, a DVD of your finished project is compressed to make it fit on the DVD. Any edits of the footage off of the DVD would take a quality hit. If your finished project was short (around 15 minutes) you could potentially store all of the clips as data with no quality loss. I don't how much overhead there would be with all of the associated additional FCP files.

Has anyone used the new Sony tape backup system that lets you dump all of the raw footage, data files, etc. to a streaming tape for faster restoration later?
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Old November 21st, 2003, 11:32 PM   #12
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Well if you had the money you could use a hard drive for backup. That costs a lot more than keeping your DV tapes though.

DV tape should last as least 15 years. DVDs- no idea. Make sure you store these materials properly. At around 10-15 years you can re-create your projects and use hard drives for archival. If Moore's Law holds true they will be A LOT cheaper. This path is probably the best idea, unless you have lots of money to spend on archiving.

Also make an extra master copy of your project. It'll allow quick restoration and provide extra protection against tape degradation.
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Old November 22nd, 2003, 05:19 AM   #13
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Old November 26th, 2003, 04:06 PM   #14
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I don't hope people will want more copies, I know they will.

But there's no need to do it from FCP, in fact that's probably harder.

I just take the finished job and create a Mini DV tape containing the finished job including Bars & Tone, Slate, Countdown and Trailer and call that my dub master. I use it to drive my dubbing stack (a distribution amp and 6 Panasonic commercial VHS VTRs). I also burn a DVD which can be used both as a backup and as a dubmaster, but I can also take out and use in field playback applications (like when they want to show video in the midst of a meeting).

My M.O. has been to make an executive decision as to when the job is really really final-final-final (no more last-minute changes, usually this state is achieved after the job is in distribution and they know better than to ask).

Once I'm at that stage, I keep the FCP project file (which is tiny) and dump the media. I have found that outside vendors will keep the captured media on their drives only for a maximum of about two weeks before charging you weekly for the drive space, so I think I am being lenient. It's really a judgment call, I don't really want to have to recapture the media but if I need the drive space it's time to be ruthless.

I may get a little more lenient as the price of drives continues to drop. I just picked up an external 160GB for $180...I can really dawdle before erasing jobs with that.
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Old November 26th, 2003, 04:16 PM   #15
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Oh yeah, Clay, to answer your question, CMX was one of the really early computerized editing systems, it actually was a kind of digital controller to control VTRs, so it was tape-to-tape...this was before non-linear came along. I think the first ones used teletype keyboards...talk about not interactive!

Grass Valley Group is a company that has been around for a long time making heavy-duty broadcast television equipment. From signal processors to switchers and the like. They are now part of Thomson, a big international electronics company.

Since I am not editing on either, I feel no need to call my tapes "001, 002" etc. but I do use unique descriptive titles to distinguish them, usually location and date, and tape number if more than one tape per day. "Palm Springs 9-19-03 2of2"
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