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Old August 14th, 2009, 08:18 AM   #1
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HV30 to Broadcast Monitor in FCP

I am wanting to finally add a broadcast monitor to my system. I am using FCP and working with HD ProRes footage that I want to monitor in SD for DVD distribution. I have an HV30 and would like to use it as the link. Anyone doing this or know the best way to get the best quality D/A from this device?
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Old August 14th, 2009, 10:56 AM   #2
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If you're thinking of just using Firewire to connect the camera to FCP for exporting previews you can't. Firewire doesn't have the bandwidth to allow real-time playback of HD streams; you can get still-frames only but not full motion.

What you want to do will require either a KONA or BlackMagic card. The least expensive option would be the Intensity Pro from BM which is HDMI connectivity.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 11:26 AM   #3
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Or a Matrox MXO solution...
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Old August 14th, 2009, 01:09 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by Jonathan Bufkin View Post
I want to monitor in SD for DVD distribution.
I was under the impression that FCP could actually do this. You would configure it to output regular DV over firewire and use a camera which can display 720x480 DV footage. This setting is separate from the sequence setting, which would be HD.

I have never tried myself, but seem to recall this being touted as a new feature way back when FCP first became HDV-aware. Not sure if the HV30 can do this however. Give it a try...
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Old August 14th, 2009, 02:51 PM   #5
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Thanks for responding guys. I'm with Boyd as I've done this with the RCA connectors into a regular TV but I am looking for the best way to do it. The HV30 has 4 different outputs:

HDMI (Type A)
A/V Mini (3.5mm 4 pole Mini-jack)
DV out
Component out (Type 1)

I wasn't sure of the best/affordable option of getting one of these to either S-video or BNC. I have an iMac so using a card is not possible.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 05:02 PM   #6
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Hi Jonathan, you are not going to be able to get a 'broadcast' monitor quality check with your system, because you will always be monitoring and mastering at DV resolution and DV compression if you are monitoring out of firewire live.

DV compression is fairly unsuited for broadcast quality finishing, as it introduces compression artifacting in the post workflow (aliasing, chroma bleed etc.) every time you render an effect because of it's very low chroma resolution. As an acquisition format ingested and worked with in an intermediate format it's ok, but if you are viewing out of DV you'll effectively viewing a DV signal.

However, going through DV to a component monitor (broadcast or otherwise) is still a much better workflow than watching on your computer screen, AND if you aren't doing colour correction, graphics, titles or effects (e.g are just looking at your DV encoded footage with no changes to it to check the file/tapes natural look) it will give you an accurate picture.

So use your component out, your component out will use RCA type connectors, you should be able to buy three BNC - RCA connectors relatively cheaply, and that's all you should need.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 05:10 PM   #7
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Thanks Craig. That is very useful information. I really just want to get a better idea for color correcting my footage for wedding DVD's so it sounds good for that. The BNC to RCA adapters are a good call.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 07:43 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Jonathan Bufkin View Post
I have an iMac so using a card is not possible.
Sounds like you are probably good to go Jonathan, but just wanted to come back to Shaun's suggestion of the MXO. I am using the original MXO with a 23" Apple Cinema Display and an iMac as my primary editing system at the moment. You plug the MXO into the DVI port of the iMac (you need the mini-DVI adaptor, but that's no big deal). You then plug your extenal computer monitor into the MXO, run the calibration utility and you have a color-accurate monitor.

I paid $1,000 for the MXO last year but you may find them for less now as I believe they're discontinued. Maybe more than you want at the moment, but it's a good solution for the iMac if you want decent color.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 08:49 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Craig Parkes View Post
DV compression is fairly unsuited for broadcast quality finishing, as it introduces compression artifacting in the post workflow (aliasing, chroma bleed etc.) every time you render an effect because of it's very low chroma resolution. As an acquisition format ingested and worked with in an intermediate format it's ok, but if you are viewing out of DV you'll effectively viewing a DV signal.
Interesting note: DVCam (which is identical to DV in all technical specs relative to image quality) is pretty much the defacto standard in my market for standard def ENG/EFP broadcast. The "DV isn't good enough for broadcast" paradigm has shifted dramatically in the past ten years and it is now accepted alongside BetaSP, DigiBeta et al for broadcast in many markets. Of course, this is typically using 2/3" 3CCD broadcast Sony cameras and not $3000 1/3" or 1/4" cameras (although we certainly see those images every day as well). As CH likes to point out, content is king.
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Old August 14th, 2009, 11:37 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Boyd Ostroff View Post
Sounds like you are probably good to go Jonathan, but just wanted to come back to Shaun's suggestion of the MXO. I am using the original MXO with a 23" Apple Cinema Display and an iMac as my primary editing system at the moment. You plug the MXO into the DVI port of the iMac (you need the mini-DVI adaptor, but that's no big deal). You then plug your extenal computer monitor into the MXO, run the calibration utility and you have a color-accurate monitor.

I paid $1,000 for the MXO last year but you may find them for less now as I believe they're discontinued. Maybe more than you want at the moment, but it's a good solution for the iMac if you want decent color.
That's good to know. I will definitely consider this in my next step-up.
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Old August 16th, 2009, 05:10 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Shaun Roemich View Post
Interesting note: DVCam (which is identical to DV in all technical specs relative to image quality) is pretty much the defacto standard in my market for standard def ENG/EFP broadcast. The "DV isn't good enough for broadcast" paradigm has shifted dramatically in the past ten years and it is now accepted alongside BetaSP, DigiBeta et al for broadcast in many markets. Of course, this is typically using 2/3" 3CCD broadcast Sony cameras and not $3000 1/3" or 1/4" cameras (although we certainly see those images every day as well). As CH likes to point out, content is king.
Hi Shaun, I understand this very well, which is why I said broadcast finishing, not broadcast acquisition. DV if treated properly in post can stand up surprisingly well to other broadcast formats. However, if you are viewing your screen through firewire you are looking at DV compressed output - which means the stuff you have done WHEN editing (especially colour correction and graphics etc.) are getting additional DV compression. This creates noticeable artifacting, so it's not suited for this sort of work. If you are NOT working in DV compression in your post tools (e.g you are working in a different codec such as PRORES) then you will not actually be seeing what you are getting when you monitor out of firewire. (Unless you are using some additional hardware, such as an Avid MOJO or AJ IOHD box).

Even if you are going back to DV tape for delivery, you will get a better result if you don't work in DV compression, and only output to DV at the end, because of the lossy nature of DV compression.
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Old August 16th, 2009, 08:52 AM   #12
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Even if you are going back to DV tape for delivery, you will get a better result if you don't work in DV compression, and only output to DV at the end, because of the lossy nature of DV compression.
One more niggle with the above and I think we have a pretty complete dissertation on DV:
If, as Craig suggests, one is doing colour correction and titles and graphics, bumping to another codec in post may have value. If one is doing straight cuts or simple dissolves, don't bother. You'll take a greater quality hit from two transcodes than you would by staying native in the codec ASSUMING that layback to tape is indeed over Firewire and not analog or SDI.
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