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Old July 18th, 2006, 04:41 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe
I hazard to say that you're just scratching the surface.
Yes there is SO much that I've simply ignored most of it. That's because I don't have time and because I don't need these features.

However, I would be very happy if Avid tossed these neat features out and focused on finishing the key editing functions like import and export of HD XML, DVCPRO HD I/O via 1394, a better DVD encoder, and tons of tiny improvements. I have a long list!

In other words, focus on DV, HDV, XDCAM HD, and DVCPRO HD using FireWire I/O.

If you are going upscale from 1394 you really need to support the Blackmagic $1000 board -- something Avid will not do.
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Old July 19th, 2006, 12:38 PM   #47
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Does anyone know if it will be possible for Apple to have the capture window support the video scopes in HDV like it does for DV currently? This would be a very useful feature when capturing live on the set via a laptop. Actually it would be nice if FCP could do everything HDVRack does since I don't own a PC laptop nor do I intend to. But thatís just some wishful thinking.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 09:57 AM   #48
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The fact that JVC allowed a bogus version of
FCP running 24p and now its almost August and
now direct JVC/FCP support should be enough for HD100U
users to contact Bob Mueller VP at JVC.

Can't JVC/Apple release the beta version running 24p?
Someone has that software that ran at NAB.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 10:59 AM   #49
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Hmnnn..... I think it's a little out of line to bring Bob Mueller into the equation.

JVC's ProHD format specs are out there for any developer to create the workflow. If anything, it's completely on Apple to get it together and implement ProHD into their product. As of now ProHD has the support of Avid and Cineform and some others.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 11:14 AM   #50
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It's absolutely inline to bring JVC into the argument.
They promoted Apple 24p support at their NAB booth
with a rigged version of FCP.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 11:39 AM   #51
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I have to say that part of this falls on JVC as well. Of course they can't control Apple, but they must have had MAJOR miscommunications. I mean, watching Rodney Charters talking about 24P in Final Cut Pro made it sound imminent. I think Apple screwed JVC though.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 11:56 AM   #52
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I see the point now. If they (JVC) touted FCP as a solution at the NAB booth then where's the goods?

But there are alternatives that won't break the bank. Unfortunately they are all on the Windows side.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 12:58 PM   #53
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Had 2 give up on FCP/Mac :(

You know, I've always been a Mac fan/user (20 some odd years). But, because I own a JVC 100, when the time to upgrade my computer/editing solution came I felt I had no choice but to buy a new PC.

The cost was a 3rd of what a comprable Mac would be, and I knew that there would be some company/programer out there would, sooner than later, develop an editing solution for 24p HDV.

I believe at this point there are 3 PC only editing solutions available that can do just that; Canopus, Liquid, and Premiere Pro 2.

I guess my point is that if FCP had actually come out w/ the promised (by both JVC and Apple) upgrade, I'd probably paid the extra cash out to have a Mac that could do what I wanted. Instead I, and I'm guessing a lot of others, have had to go where the programs are - on a PC.

There must be, on some fundamental level, a giant corporate snafu at one company, if not both. 12,000 plus users of the JVC 100, plus thousands of other HDV camera owners (Canon) must represent a large enough group of users for someone to hire a programer or two and in the words of Larry the Cable Guy, "Get err done."

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Old July 21st, 2006, 01:11 PM   #54
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Apple. Avid, whatever man

Ipods are more important i guess.

Apple dropped the ball imo, I was ready to plunk down $$ for a intel laptop and FCP. Instead I bought PPro2 and kept my PC.
Sept for it being the 800lb elephant, I can't imagine why avid support is important, I really don't like that program, media management or not.
(no offense to anyone!)
Just my 2 cents
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Old July 21st, 2006, 06:37 PM   #55
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Both Avid and Apple have been completely rubbish on this issue. Both companies keep promising and failing to deliver. I am booking accommodation for IBC 2006 now and it reminds me that it is nearly a full year since both Avid and Apple reps on the JVC stand at IBC 2005 promised imminent full HDV1 support. This is a disgraceful situation and I'll bet JVC are not pleased about this at all - let alone the many HD100 customers who have had to abandon or modify their workflows to a great extent after waiting and waiting and waiting. Of course, it's not just HDV1 - DVCProHD support has similar support issues.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 07:11 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Stiff
The fact that JVC allowed a bogus version of FCP running 24p
Rob, I wouldn't call that a "bogus version". It was technology preview and such helped people understand that they are working on it.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 07:36 PM   #57
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Originally Posted by John Vincent
The cost was a 3rd of what a comprable Mac would be, and I knew that there would be some company/programer out there would, sooner than later, develop an editing solution for 24p HDV.
John, don't mean to argue with you but I have to chime in. I looked at the specs and cost of an editing machine on the PC side and it costs way more than a MacBookPro and it doesn't come close to the performance, as a tower, of the Apple portable. You can get cheaper PCs but it's pretty hard to get even close to what Apple sells, both in terms of features and quality.
As per PPro 2.0 I'm sorry but it cannot compare against FCP and it can't cut HDV, not unless you use CineForm and that costs as much if not more than FCP itself.
When I say that it cannot edit HDV I don't mean that the support is not in there. It is, it's just that the application is not robust enough to handle a normal, 30 minute, video shot in HDV. They have a bug in handling anything that is bigger than 4GB and that makes the app unsuitable for anything but commercials and short videos.

As we just did this for "2nd Unit", you can walk into any Apple store, buy a MacBookpro, a copy of FCP Studio (including FCP, Motion, LiveTipe, DVD Studio, and the incredible Compressor), go home, install the software and start cuttin you *feature film*. Out of the box. I can't put a price on that. Just my $0.02.
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Old July 21st, 2006, 07:38 PM   #58
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next desktop won't be mac

I don't think apple was prepared for how well the ipod was recieved by the public, and as a result I think too much attention has now shifted away from pro applications and hardware.
I may be wrong, but it seems as though apple and sony offered support for sony's new blue ray hd camera just a few weeks ago. JVC is now on the second generation of the HD100, and still no 24p support.
As a long time mac user, I feel insulted to have been sitting on a 24p project since April.
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Old July 22nd, 2006, 06:30 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by Paolo Ciccone
John, don't mean to argue with you but I have to chime in. I looked at the specs and cost of an editing machine on the PC side and it costs way more than a MacBookPro and it doesn't come close to the performance, as a tower, of the Apple portable. You can get cheaper PCs but it's pretty hard to get even close to what Apple sells, both in terms of features and quality.
As per PPro 2.0 I'm sorry but it cannot compare against FCP and it can't cut HDV, not unless you use CineForm and that costs as much if not more than FCP itself.
Paolo, man I think you're the best, w/ all the work you've put in (and I use and benefit from, absolutely), I've got to respect your opinion...

But reality is reality - Macs can't cut JVC 100 at 24p - PC's can. I hate PC's - I really do. Nothing is easy and it's so easy to make everything self-destruct. But there ARE 3 programs that work in 24p. They are not perfect - but they work. We're at a new beginning right now, where the little fat girl from Ohio (or the old fat old guy from Michigan) just might have the tools to make something special...

Thing is, I expected Macs/Steve Jobs to be the ones leading the way on this thing and they ain't. Man, I don't know, I really don't. I'm having a hell of a time trying to make pro 2 work, but, you know it's there. I really feel let down by the whole thing, because right now, whatever you're using - it isn't easy. Or cheap.

Paolo - keep up the good fight - Drinks on me if you ever come out this way-

john
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Old July 22nd, 2006, 06:41 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Vincent

But reality is reality - Macs can't cut JVC 100 at 24p - PC's can. I hate PC's - I really do. Nothing is easy and it's so easy to make everything self-destruct. But there ARE 3 programs that work in 24p. They are not perfect - but they work.

I'm having a hell of a time trying to make pro 2 work, but, you know it's there.
If you are having trouble getting Premire to work, then the workaround for Final Cut is very easy now anyway. Also for Avid Xpress Pro. I have been editing in Avid Xpress Pro with the DNxHD Codec now since the release of 5.5.1 (now 5.5.2) by using MPEG STREAMCLIP.

MPEG STREAMCLIP can do Batch Converts on the .m2t files to ANY codec, and can also allow you to edit in Final Cut Pro as either AIC or HDV. The only problem is the time to convert, and that is a small price to pay for a better editing solution if you feel Apple has the better editors (which I do).

I also don't have to use DVHSCap to capture because I have the DR-HD100, which cuts down the time massively. I also agree with Paolo about the Macbook Pro. Very fast, and remember, it runs windows. Canopus and Liquid work on the Windows side of bootcamp.

But don't get me wrong, as I have stated many times in this forum, Apple and Avid are at fault the most, more than JVC. Both companies have probably been lying to JVC for a year now. What is JVC going to do? They really can't do anything.

Avid even gets me more pissed off. Overall, the company exists because of Video Editing. Apple has a lot of other things to worry about (no excuse, but an explanation), but AVID should be a lot more focued on getting their two main editors (Media Composer and Xpress Pro) to have support for every major camera.
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