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Old May 21st, 2014, 05:41 AM   #16
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Location: Hamilton, New Zealand
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Re: UPDATE: Still researching, still undecided.

Originally Posted by Scott Wilkinson View Post
That makes sense.

This, and I admit to also feeling a bit like an "RC purist" in that I've been flying RC gliders for years in "manual" mode (since that's all there is!), so I keep thinking I should be able to fly one of these the same way. :-)
I know what you mean. I've been flying RC planes for years. But flying planes is a lot easier than flying a multi-rotor "manually".

If you go upside down in a plane, you're still generating lift and you can cruise along upside down. If you bank a multi-rotor too far (it doesn't take much) you're on the ground very quickly.

I tried to practise flying manually with a cheap little quadcopter, and it didn't end well for the quadcopter. I found it extremely difficult to keep level, and it was very easy to over-correct and lose control.

So as there's no real benefit to flying manually as opposed to attitude mode, I'm going to stick to what keeps my F550 safely in the sky.

But again, just my 2c :)
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Old May 21st, 2014, 09:17 AM   #17
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Location: San Diego CA
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Re: UPDATE: Still researching, still undecided.

Ill go through what I have done with both my multis in the last two weeks.

I came from a helicopter background and have set gains on everything from Helicommand Rigid to DJI Ace One for helis before I came to multis. With that said, untill last week I really didnt have a system down that made me feel confident in my manual settings.

So- go online or use suggestions fronm DJI where you should set gains to start. make sure you have enough satts to lock in and take off in GPS. Move the multi away and up so you have room to recover.
Hopefully your gains are close enough that your multi will stay in one place with your fingers off all controls. ( It wll)

Now, flip your swith to manual mode. The multi may drop or climb a bit , dont worry too much abotu that yet. Give SMALL stick inputs to go left and right. If you have to keep giving counter stick movements to keep it inthe air and its getting worse and worse and your multi is looking like a drunk sailor, your basic gains are set too low. Now, if they are really low you can loose control quickly. But, your GPS switch is your failsafe. If your uncomfortable in manual flip back to GPS . then go add gain. You can add 20 to each setting without doing too much change. As you go up in basic gain your multi should be more controllable each time you add gain. Do this back and forth untill you can fly your multi in manual mode without it being sluggish or uncontrollable. If you add too much gain when you give stick commands in pitch and roll it will SNAP in place when it exicutes the stick command. If you put in too much gain it can start shaking and wont stop without going back to GPS.
Once you can go from GPS to Manual without a drop in altitude or gain inaltitude and it flies like your glider, your basic gainsare set correctly. I would make sure you can fly and land comfortably in manual

Once you have your basic gains tuned you can now set your atti gains

Thats more of the users choice. Low gains will alow you to film in GPS .But if they are to low you will "Toilet bowl" when you release the sticks. What I mean by that is instead of your multi stopping in the exact spot it will go in about a 3 foot circle at first and then settle in.

If your gains are really high in GPS it will snap each time you release th sticks. What I mean by that is if your are in slow forward flight in GPS and you release the stick the multi will stop so aburptly you will see a slight kick in reverse direction.

I hope that makes sense
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Old May 21st, 2014, 10:27 AM   #18
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Location: Eugene, OR
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Re: UPDATE: Still researching, still undecided.

Thanks John---all great info/advice! Most of it made sense (I think). I found this forum page at Helifreaks.com that helped me too:
Main Gain, Attitude Gain question - HeliFreak

One user in that thread had what seemed like a good idea (I'm just not sure how to do it): he set a couple of his Tx knobs to control gains while in flight---that sounds like a great way to experiment much more quickly (in baby steps of course) without having to land and plug into a laptop every time.

I'm not sure I'm understanding the difference between what you refer to as "basic" gain and "atti" gain. In the thread linked above, they talked about "main" gain, which was defined as how the aircraft responds generally to external forces (like wind)...and they defined "attitude" gains as specifically how the aircraft responds to stick inputs (pitch and roll)...and finally "yaw" gains for yaw.

That make sense to you? :-)
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Old May 21st, 2014, 11:15 AM   #19
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Re: UPDATE: Still researching, still undecided.

Hey Scott, the info Im putting out is based on the Naza assistant which is what I think you also use with the phantom.
Some of the things I recommend or you read You may not be able to do. Im saying that because with my multis im using a seperate reciever so , with that said Imtyping from memory so I hope I get the tabs correct . I tried to find a screen grab but dont have one

1- Basic gain and atti gain

these are two sections in the software under the Gain tab

Mine reads

Basic Gain
pitch roll yaw throtle

Atti Gain
pitch roll

basic would be the same as 'Main" gain and Attitude gain is atti gain. Atti gain is for both GPS and ATTI settings

In other words when you set ATTI gain, its an additional gain added when you decide to go to attitude mode or GPS mode.

To set up switches to adjust gains mid flight here what I do, again not sure how its done on the phantom because I dont know what the radio or reciever looks like or if you have switches you can assign to channels on your reciever.

for me I have a 9 channel raido and a 9 channel reciever

so. I use the following channels

throttle- throttle channel
pitch- elevator
three position switch for man/atti/gps-aux2
IOC-flap switch
RTH-throttle hold

so that leaves two open channels.

I use a JR 9303 radio and I have two slider switches. One on each side of the radio.
I can assign one switch to X1 in Naza and X2 to the other switch. Then in the naza assistant software you can choose x1 and x2 for remote gain. ONe for pitch and one for roll.

When you do this you want to use the trim step so that you limit the range of your gain setting. And what I mean is you should have a"Ballpark" range of where you should want to go. for conversation lets say you want somewhere between 100 and 150 on a gain setting. Use your trim to set the lowest setting on your switch you will be using to 50 on the gain and your highest setting to 150.

Hope that make sense. If not PM me
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Old May 21st, 2014, 11:22 AM   #20
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Eugene, OR
Posts: 183
Re: UPDATE: Still researching, still undecided.

Thanks John---that makes sense (and I still obviously have some work to do!). I haven't downloaded the Phantom Assistant software yet but will today.

I actually have a Futaba 14SG transmitter/receiver. The manual is huge and it has a zillion sliders, buttons, knobs, and switches, LOL. This came with the "Phantom Pro Package" from Aerial Media Pros, and they set it up before shipping with all the standard Phantom controls mapped (including IOC modes, etc.) There are several knobs/switches that are labeled with cryptic abbreviations that are a complete mystery to me.

So I'm pretty sure it will do whatever I want it to---just have to figure out how! :-)
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Old May 21st, 2014, 11:32 AM   #21
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Re: UPDATE: Still researching, still undecided.

found a video that explains it

this will also show you how to "map" a channel of your reciever to a know or swith in your radio

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