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Old August 27th, 2007, 09:36 PM   #1
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I must be overlooking something here.

I've been researching this board for days, trying to identify the best camera for me. I can't seem to find anything suitable.

- I need to be able to shoot 720p60.
- I refuse to shoot in the HDV format, as I feel it is unsuitable for production purposes
- I'm terrified of P2 cards. I don't want the stress of having to deal with dumping cards every 10 minutes during mid-shoot
- I can't afford to rent anything that's over $500 a day

Have I overlooked a certain make or model of camera, or is there not a camera in my price range that can meet my requirements?

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
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Old August 27th, 2007, 10:50 PM   #2
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Have you actually tried shooting HDV?
I wouldn't try to influence you one way or the other, there's no shortage of bunk both ways flapping around already. To just dismiss the format without trying it seems a little shortsighted and it's not like a one day rental of a HDV camera (or two) is going to be overly expensive.
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Old August 27th, 2007, 11:13 PM   #3
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Yes, I have shot HDV before, although I must admit, most of it was shot with single CCD models.

From my experience, I feel it's suitable for some situations, but not so much when planning to add compositing or layered effects in post (especially when pulling keys). Clearly that's just my opinion though.

Anyway, I'll resort to HDV if I absolutely have to, but right now, I'm hoping to find a better alternative.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 12:34 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan DuMoulin View Post
- I refuse to shoot in the HDV format, as I feel it is unsuitable for production purposes
What you're overlooking is the fact that many people do indeed use the HDV format for production purposes on a regular basis. Format is not a limitation -- closed minded thinking is, however. Right now, the JVC Pro HD product line which uses the HDV format is one of the two most affordable ways to shoot 720p60.

And the affordable 720p60 alternative to HDV is Panasonic DVCPRO HD. Since P2 cards are not viable for you, there is the option to shoot with the Panasonic HVX200 camcorder in the DVCPRO HD format without P2 cards, thanks to the FireStore FS100 portable FireWire hard disk recorder, which allows for very long continuous recording for several hours at a time.

If you're not willing to give the JVC Pro HD system a fair shot, then there is indeed no other way for you to accomplish 720p60 at that affordable price point other than an Panasonic HVX200 with a FireStore FS100 recorder.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 05:49 AM   #5
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I agree with Chris.

You will be pleasantly surprise of the image from a JVC ProHD 200/250 shooting 720p 60. In fact, both the HVX 200 (DVCProHD) and JVC 200/250 produce similar images with plenty of controls to tweak the image. Don't throw HDV out the window because of shortcomings you experienced with one-chip HDV cameras. Your bad experience could have been caused by other factors of the camera and not necessarily the recording method.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 07:30 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathan DuMoulin View Post
- I refuse to shoot in the HDV format, as I feel it is unsuitable for production purposes
- I'm terrified of P2 cards. I don't want the stress of having to deal with dumping cards every 10 minutes during mid-shoot
To echo the above two posts, the codec is only a part of the equation, and the front end of the camera should be seen as least as important, if not more so. Both the previously mentioned cameras may be limited more by 1/3" chips etc than recording codec.

Taking note of what you say about budget, and depending on how soon you need the camera, you may want to consider as a possible third choice the forthcoming Sony EX. True manual lens, 1/2" chips, and much higher than HDV bitrate recording, plus integral solid state storage at a much lower price/min than P2. Plenty written about it elsewhere on these forums, at: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisplay.php?f=150.

You may expect it to ship sometime in October, if that fits with your plans.
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Old August 28th, 2007, 09:51 AM   #7
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Nathan, I'm afraid you don't really have a choice here - it's either shoot in HDV on the JVC or use P2 Cards in the Panasonic. If 720p/60 is the format you want to shoot in, those are your only "affordable" options (Using a Firestore HDD recorder is an option, but some users have reported reliability issues - not many, but some).

I think you're going to have to decide which option you consider a "lesser evil", though by all reports both the JVC ProHD and the Pannie HVX cameras record beautiful images. And as the saying goes "it's not what you've got, it's how you use it!"
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Old August 28th, 2007, 03:52 PM   #8
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Alright, thanks a lot everyone for your input.

You've been very helpful and I appreciate the help.

- Nathan
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