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Old April 26th, 2013, 03:00 AM   #61
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Rosenzweig View Post
The answers to your questions are in the videos. Here are three all done in sunlight from a pocket, compact camera (Panasonic ZS30/TZ40) shooting at 108060p. You can *download* all three (the originals from the camera) and view them on anything you like and compare to what you can see from other cameras. That is the answer, not what someone claims he or she saw or thinks they know in theory:
Unsharp? Filled with artifacts? Too noisy?
I have viewed those clips attentively by a flat Sony 48". All they look fine. I have noticed the camera works better with cloudy weather, when there is sun the image is weak and the face of the persons are overexpose.
But in general I like those clips, they are sharp, full of details and with good colours. You cannot expect more from a $400-$500 camera.
I thank you.
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Old April 26th, 2013, 07:53 AM   #62
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

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Originally Posted by Adriano Moroni View Post
I have viewed those clips attentively by a flat Sony 48". All they look fine. I have noticed the camera works better with cloudy weather, when there is sun the image is weak and the face of the persons are overexpose.
But in general I like those clips, they are sharp, full of details and with good colours. You cannot expect more from a $400-$500 camera.
I thank you.

Just like the little camcorders these small cameras use a general exposure mode most of the time but can be persuaded to expose differently. If face detection is on and identifies a face it will focus and expose for that face ( focus , exposure and WB for the face) so can compensate a little for the overexposure at times. They have various shooting modes that can be selected or left in iAuto mode to let the camera decide. I think the Panasonic is much like the Sony in that it will lock on to up to 8 faces and manage focus and exposure to maximize the picture. The closer the camera to the people the better the control of course. It will of course not bring down the exposure to cause too much effect on the rest of the image. That is the value of a large camera like the NX5U where the knee can be changed in picture profiles to roll off the highlights, great for a set up shot but useless for point and shoot where the little cameras easily perform better.

In still mode the cameras even have a mode to emulate the shallow depth of field of a DSLR !!! The more I use the little cameras and camcorders the more of a fan I become. Still have the NX5U for the main camera for multicam shoots though where it does have an advantage.

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Old April 26th, 2013, 05:47 PM   #63
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

I always get mixed up by those stupid fractional sensor sizes! The long and short of it is, we're mostly speaking of "small sensor" cameras...

Along the lines of what Ron is saying is that the HX50 and the HX300 (as well as earlier 100 &200) have an EV adjusting wheel right by your thumb - hit it (on the 300), give it a spin and you can dial in the exposure adjustment on the fly - it's often all you'll need, as most long time shooters know the Sony "auto" can tend to overexpose a bit. I used that dial to shoot some shots of the full moon last night, -1.7 to 2.0 worked nicely! It's not "full manual", but can do the trick oftentimes to dial in a more useful exposure, and it works in movie mode while recording!

As Ron also notes, there are some "fun" picture modes in the consumer cameras, including a DoF emulation, and I've been playing with the "illustration" mode... There's a lot to like about some of the current lot of cameras, if you like takng pictures or video and are creative - you don't need a "big camera" to get usable quality. I find that a nice "small" kit tends to be easier to take along, so you end up with more shooting opportunities
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Old April 28th, 2013, 05:25 AM   #64
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

I'm quivering with excitement for the Sony HX50. :) When will it ship or will it be possible to buy it?
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Old April 28th, 2013, 07:22 AM   #65
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

Beginning for June in North America not sure for Italy. It should be on the Sony site now.

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Old April 30th, 2013, 08:04 AM   #66
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

I have just viewed some shots by Sony HX200. They are wonderful for high definition and chromatism but when I have seen the car run or people walking with faster steps (when they quicken one's pace) I see a irregular movement, it is not fluid movement, it seems a trigger-action. Why I see this problem? Yet the Sony HX200 works with 1080p50/60. What is the problem? I have viewed those shots with fat Sony 48".
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Old April 30th, 2013, 08:26 AM   #67
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

How did you view this video? Are you sure you actually got the source video at 50/60P.

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Old April 30th, 2013, 08:51 AM   #68
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

I view my videos by WD Western Digital TV at 1080p 50Hz. Could be the video was shot at 60p and if I view it at 50p I get problems?
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Old April 30th, 2013, 09:01 AM   #69
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

Where did you get the file ? What do the properties say ?

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Old April 30th, 2013, 10:06 AM   #70
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

This is the video I have downloaded and viewed on my TV. It was shot in 1080p.
I have downloaded other video with less fast movements (guys with fast walking) but I get the same problem.
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Old April 30th, 2013, 08:14 PM   #71
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

Some devices have a bit of trouble with 60p - it's a larger bitstream, and it's possible that it could be causing some stutter. At least that'd be my first guess. Does it always show stutter at the same spots, or is it somewhat random? And if you pause, does it smooth for a bit, then start to stutter?

I saw a little bit of stutter here on my computer on playback, but I've got a lot of things running... 60p has had me contemplating a system upgrade for a while too, but most times it plays back fine.

Keep in mind that the HX300 is using a completely new sensor vs. the HX200. So far, the new sensor is getting decent results, I've got to do some pixel peeping on larger screens, but it does look like Sony got this one pretty well tweaked.
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Old May 1st, 2013, 04:32 PM   #72
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

It is somewhat random.

I have viewed many shots with care of many cameras around the same price and now I can tell you the best image quality is of Sony HX200.
I have downloaded some shots from my PC and then I have checked them by WD Western Digital TV on my TV. I have checked shots of Sony HX200, Sony HX300, Lumix FZ150, Sony SLT-A57 and Sony RX100.
Sony HX200 is very far better of all others and cheaper. Colours are very good, also high definition. In my opinion it is the best camera for that price.
Pity it is impossible to plug on it an external light for video because there isn't any hot-shoe.
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Old May 1st, 2013, 06:51 PM   #73
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

The downloaded videos that you compared were all shot under the same lighting? Otherwise your conclusions might be misleading
A crappy camera will shoot beautiful video under good lighting whereas an otherwise superior camera will shoot crappy looking video under poor lighting.
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Old May 1st, 2013, 11:23 PM   #74
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

Yeah, all shot in identical conditions... not likely. All shot by the same operator... that alone can account for a LOT of variation... All processed in post the same way... doubtful. SOOOOO many "variables" left unaccounted for!!

I've seen bad clips (or worse yet "tests/reviews") from cameras that I know quite well... that embarrass the camera AND the person posting their "sample"... you can't believe everything you see, read or download from the internet...

Just as a "fer instance" - I shot some samples of the full/nearly full moon on two consecutive nights - the first night there was a fair amount of dust/moisture in the air... definitely noticeable in the results!! That's under otherwise "identical" conditions, the first set had a bit of softness the second set did not, even though the first was shot on monopod, the second handheld... Both are better than the best I could get with the 100/200, less noise, and less CA... I'm happy. Also less "jpeg overspray" for want of a better desription of something I saw in many HX200 shots, both my own and posted samples.



I've only had the HX300 for a couple days, but I'd give it a qualified "thumbs up" so far, and it's the ONLY camera I have with 1200mm optics (+ more in clear zoom).

I still need to shoot more test video, but I can say that the stills are signifcantly better to my eye in the 300 than in the prior two cameras. ALL of them are weak in poor light (small sensor, you can only expect so much), but the 300 seems to hold together a little better to higher ISO's, and doesn't exhibit problems in "good light" or flash shots that caused me to give up on the earlier versions. I've pulled up a few similar samples, and I'd take the 300 over the 100 and 200. I'm sure in the ranges the Alpha APS-C camera lenses match, the Alphas would "win".

From the limited testing I've done with video, I'd also say it has at least a stop, if not more, of better sensitivity in lower light (when compared to the TX100, which is a bit better than any of the other Sony P&S cameras in low light for reasons I've never figured out!)... The HX300 is the best I've seen from any of the small sensor Sony P&S cameras - it won't touch the top end CX/PJ type video camera, but it's actually pretty good.

If you want to add a light, it's easy enough to get a straight or folding flash bracket that will mount a small dimmable LED light when desired, I usually have that setup with me If I anticipate needing the added light. It won't make a small sensor match a bigger one, but it can be an equalizer.

Unfortunately I don't have a lot of video samples of the HX100 and 200 that I can match conditions, or the RX100 either - these tend to be "grab and go", shoot whatever is interesting cameras, so matching conditions is sort of hard! BUT, the HX300 has already earned a spot alongside the RX100, barring unforseen "gotchas". I got use out of the RX100 and 200 when I had them as well, for what they did well!

If the upcoming HX50 is as well tweaked and with good optics, it could be a nice package.
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Old May 2nd, 2013, 02:12 AM   #75
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Re: Are there any compact cameras recording like a good videocamera?

I'm sorry but I have to contradict you.
Now I explain you better: I have downloaded more than 100 videoclips in 1080p of those cameras. I like to compare them in daily light only because I will shot in daily light only. I don't take interest for a big Zoom but for a medium Zoom only. I have downloaded clips tested only in town and in country (with very green background) and I have checked their image quality in wide angle lens and medium Zoom.
I have checked with care around:
40 shots of Sony HX200
4 shots of Sony HX300 (there are so few clips on Internet)
20 shots of Lumix FZ150
30 shots of Sony SLT-A57
15 shots of Sony RX100
... and some shots of some other cameras like Sony NEX 6, etc

The only camera very close to Sony HX200 was HX300 but I haven't checked their comparison because there aren't many clips of HX300 on Internet.

RESULT
1) Every videoclip of Sony HX200 was perfect. It is incredible but NO shot was imperfect with bad colours and definition. 100% of the clips were OK!
2) All the shots of Lumix FZ150 were good but not like HX300 or HX200
3) All the shots of Sony SLT-A57 were very good but not like HX200
4) All the shots of Sony RX100 were very good but not like HX200

IN MY OPINION the best camera of them is Sony HX200 because I haven't seen any bad clips. Every clip was perfect.
I will wait for Sony HX50 because I think it will be a wonderful camera but .... if the clips I will download aren't good like Sony HX200, with no doubt I will buy the HX200, even if I like more smaller cameras.
I trust my eyes than what I read on their specifications. You can believe me or not believe me but my eyes have made a lot of training on the video.
I prefer Sony HX200 over HX300 because it costs less and it has a tilt display. I have read some specifications about HX300 and there are contradictory writings. I still don't understand if HX300 has tilt display.

PS: My hought is confirmed by some reviews:
http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/72...-camera-review
http://www.pocket-lint.com/review/73...t-hx300-review
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Last edited by Adriano Moroni; May 2nd, 2013 at 07:23 AM.
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