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General HD (720 / 1080) Acquisition
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Old January 13th, 2006, 10:55 AM   #1
Major Player
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Los Angeles, California
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"Give Us Free"

(looking at my wrists)....what the?? Nothing there.......(looking at my ankles) Huh???? There's no shackles on my feet!!!!!



I got an email saying i was banned from here. It was one of the first emails I got yesterday morning. I gotta check my server for a ASCII copy of it. Then along with a bunch of other emails about what happened, I just shut down & mopped around all day sad, thinking Chris didn't like me no' mo'!


Crazy thing is, come to find out...I am banned from DVXUSER.COM.....WHY??? What did I ever do wrong there???? This Panasonic thing is like "The Pelican Brief".
JARRED (in my Martin Lawrence voice) C'mon man...This is ya Booooyyyyyyy! Free me up man. I know you smilin' I can feel you smilin' through this forum. SEE I TOLD YOU...YOU'RE SMILING AIN'T YA JARRED!!!! *CHEESE* see, I'm smilin' too! C'mon man...take off the cuffs!!!

I leave for 1 day, and it's like I been gone all year. lotsa emails....lotsa questions. Give me some time to sort through all this stuff to get back to everybody and address any questions. Actually, it may be easier to just "DROP IT". I dunno.

Ok.... gimme a sec fellas.

SIDE NOTE: Does anybody in ATLANTA WANT A JOB??? Click Here: http://www.cinemahill.com/employment...o-atl-crew.htm I'm hiring for a gig coming up. I think I'm going to start coming here for crew. Be sure to mention you're a member of dvinfo.net.

We may not all agree when it comes to 'business' and these cheap little handycams, but let's all be friends! fluck-a-camera if i lose a buddy over it! not worth it to me.

- ShannonRawls.com
(i actually got some work done when I thought I was jacked!)
Shannon W. Rawls ~ Motion Picture Producer & huge advocate of Digital Acquisition.

Last edited by Shannon Rawls; January 13th, 2006 at 11:26 AM.
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Old January 13th, 2006, 11:00 AM   #2
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Shannon man...you know there's a lotta love for you over here, dude!
Funny. The test went mostly how some folks were privately predicting they would two days in advance, eh?
Thanks for putting this thing on, and don't feel too alone out there. You're great at making folks think a little bit, aren't ya? It seems that's your specialty.
Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot
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Old January 13th, 2006, 11:24 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by Shannon Rawls
Crazy thing is, come to find out...I am banned from DVXUSER.COM.....WHY???

Join the club. We should probably make t-shirts.
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Old January 13th, 2006, 11:27 AM   #4
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Location: San Mateo, CA
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As I said on the 'removed thread' I appreciate your efforts (and Barry's as well) and enjoy your point of view.

Two quick quotes come to mind

"A man is often known more by his enemies, than his friends." Cardinal Richeleiu


"I don't hate my enemies, after all... I made them." Red Skelton

Keep on keeping on,

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Old January 13th, 2006, 12:04 PM   #5
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shannon: the internet has a short memory, but i remember back when panasonic announced their HVX200 at NAB, this board was full of snotty, one-upping comments about how canon was behind the curve, that panasonic WAS the revolution, yadda yadda yadda. then canon quietly releases their H1 well ahead of panasonic, and panasonic keeps pushing out their release date. and now that panasonic finally released their camera, it all starts up again....

i don't really understand why panasonic and canon seem to attract these goofy, noisy fan bases. they're cameras, fer cryin' out loud, and only as good as the operators behind them.... personally, i don't put much stock in these silly comparisons, anyway. i have a friend who has made way more beautiful video, at times, with a 1-chip camera than i have made with more expensive gear. so it goes.....

having said that, i think the report on the shootout at dvxuser was just as biased as the other, widely-circulated report comparing the FX-1, the DVX100, and the XL2. it should not be a surprise that the most recent camera comparison of the HD cams was just as skewed as the comparison of DV cameras. the HVX's noise is "more film-like" than the H1's....ludicrous!

it was not wrong for you to point out some of the flaws in the methodology, including your own inadequacy as the DP/operator of the H1. i got a good laugh out of your image of you standing there, flipping through the operator's manual, desperately looking for the right tweakage! i don't think you were any harder on the others' present than you were on your descriptions of yourself. it is an important point you made, that the H1 was the only camera present which lacked an experienced operator behind the wheel. that will definitely affect any outcomes. but point seems to have been lost in the mire of the cult of personality. i think your gunslinging style seems to obscure the importance of the points you're trying to make, at times, which is unfortunate, because they're important points.....

this is chris' house, though, and we're all his guests. so don't go getting drunk and dancing around here with the lampshade on again. because we need your input on these things. you've made some really good calls.
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Old January 13th, 2006, 12:25 PM   #6
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How about "give us a break". Gone for one day? You posted all over boards yesterday. Your reporting is more like Jeff Gannons.
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Old January 13th, 2006, 01:39 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Shannon Rawls
I am banned from DVXUSER.COM.....WHY???
wear it as a badge of honor, lol... back when i was looking at purchasing the citidisk recorder, i read several pages of glowing reviews on how well it worked, over at dvxuser.com.

based on that, i went out and bought the citidisk, and within an hour i found out how big of a p.o.s. it really was... i promptly returned it for a refund, and i wrote the experience up in a post here at dvinfo.net.
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Old January 13th, 2006, 05:21 PM   #8
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"Give us free"

I agree.

Maybe it's irrelevant but I run a couple of small discussion forums and one of the things I notice is the number of people who visit without registering and the number that register but don't post are huge compared with the voices that you hear on the forum, and I sometimes find myself wondering what they find valuable about the content because I never really know.

So, anyway, I wouldn't claim to represent anyone except myself but I am someone who visits here from time to time and very rarely posts and who is involved in HDV video production but only in a very small and personal way.

I want to say I found Shannon's post extremely valuable - AT LEAST AS VALUABLE as the technical analysis that may be presented by others from the same event. It found it entirely to the point and I did not really find it rude at all - especially when one takes account of Shannon's inimitable style and way of saying things. I don't think he beat up on anyone, he very clearly portrayed his personal experience and interpretation of the event. It WAS personal in places, but only where it was entirely relevant to the subject under discussion - how was the test conducted. Without that commentary I don't think it would have been nearly as easy to have judged the technical info that follows - for example even the evidence of the video captured is affected by the conditions under which it was captured.

One other thing - about cultural variation - like me, a Pommie bastard (as we are (un) lovingly known to Australians) living in New Zealand but often working in Australia - reading something written by Shannon, then say something written by Barry, then something written by a dry UK person... People have very different ways of communicating and different people notice different things and provide different insights etc etc.

Wasn't the real offense that Shannon suggested that the 'test' was not 'neutral' and was not conducted in a way that would yield 'neutral' results and that it may not be portrayed in a way that reflects all that.

Anyway, this is a ramble from someone irrelevant but when I was first looking at HDV cameras and trying to make a decision about a year ago (I eventually bought a Z1P), I Googled and went to DVXUser first. I carefully read the comparison stuff on the then current Panny, Cannon and Sony offerrings. It was undoubtably a very thorough comparison and on the basis of it I concluded that that forum was not for me because I felt that it had too much spin in the Panny direction. That's how I ended up reading this forum, and I have found it extremely helpful.

Of course this forum belongs to it's owners, like my little minnow forums belong to me, and the forum owner takes the responsibility on to guide things in the way they see as being constructive to what they want to achieve. This is just a vote from an occassional visitor for the value of allowing the broadest range of expression of information possible. I found Shannon's post helpful and not at all lacking in information, relevance or value.

Andrew Hall
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Old January 13th, 2006, 05:48 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Andrew J Hall
Wasn't the real offense that Shannon suggested that the 'test' was not 'neutral' and was not conducted in a way that would yield 'neutral' results and that it may not be portrayed in a way that reflects all that.
Yes, and that's the part that I took offense to. I don't mind if anyone disagrees with anyone else's interpretations of the results; ideally we had about ten different people there and I'd like to see around ten different reports.

However, I do feel that Shannon's initial post engages in what may very well amount to character assassination. Disagreeing about test results is fine and is to be expected; accusing me of changing settings behind people's backs and that Shannon was the only force that "kept things honest" is, however, not fine. It's not true, and it's quite disrespectful to the approximately one dozen other people who were there. In any case, I am attempting to resolve this situation with Shannon privately, but seeing as it's spreading across the Internet (I've found reference to it in at least four forums so far) I've been advised that I should make a basic statement to address it. For those who are interested, visit this link:
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Old January 13th, 2006, 06:07 PM   #10
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I take most of these tests with a grain of salt anyway, but I've got to admit after a neutral person just looking for the straight facts read the reports, the test sounded pana and sony biased, but before I get my head bitten off *smile* its only my own honest opinion on the reports so far.

"Belive nothing of what you hear, and only half of what you see"

Originally Posted by Dan Euritt
Based on that, i went out and bought the citidisk, and within an hour i found out how big of a p.o.s. it really was... i promptly returned it for a refund, and i wrote the experience up in a post here at dvinfo.net.
So the citidisk is crap? People keep on raving on about it to me about "how cheap it is" hmm cheap in price or cheap in quality? Me thinks a little bit from column A, and a little bit from column B. ;-)
"If we build RED they will come"
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Old January 13th, 2006, 06:12 PM   #11
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Okay, we've allowed everyone to express their "post" feelings on this whole
matter. I'm closing this thread. As I, and others, have pointed out in earlier
threads let's continue the talk on the actual results and opinions of the people
involved (their own opinions only, thank you).

Please keep the following in mind:

1. as far as I can tell all results thusfar have been from experiences on that test day. That was two days ago. The human brain ain't no computer memory and people where tired that day.

2. so let's wait till the people involved get a chance to sort everything out and look at the actual recorded footage on their editing screens etc.

3. hopefully the (raw) footage will be shared so everyone else can create their own opinion as well.

Thank you for consideration in these matters

Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com
DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef

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