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Old March 30th, 2016, 01:29 PM   #1
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RED Raven vs URSA Mini 4.6K vs Kinefinity Terra 6K

My view on the top three low budget cameras with higher than 4K raw options (RED Raven vs URSA Mini 4.6K vs Kinefinity Terra 6K):

Speculation: RED Raven vs URSA Mini 4.6K vs Kinefinity Terra 6K – David Peterson

If you donít factor in the price / support / brand name cred, then Iíd go for a Kinefinity Terra 6K over URSA Mini 4.6K or RED Raven any day of the week.

(.....and then I go into much more detail.... read the article!)
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Old April 2nd, 2016, 01:14 AM   #2
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Re: RED Raven vs URSA Mini 4.6K vs Kinefinity Terra 6K

Is by any chance KineMount an open mount like say Micro Four Thirds is? I am guessing it is not.

There is a thread over on BMCuser about possible interchangeable mounts for BMD cameras.

Got me thinking that the absolute best result would be if BMD adopted the FZ mount in future cameras. FZ mount is what is used in the Sony F3/F5/F55, which I've used and is an absolutely wonderful mount! You can adapt it to anything else, for instance I've got a rock solid Nikon F mount on my Sony PMW-F3. So it works, and FZ is an already popular mount used by many.

But Sony will never let BMD use FZ mount. Thus the very nearly almost as good option is to talk with Kinefinity and see if they'd open up KineMount for everybody to use (in many ways KineMount is like Sony FZ mount, and kinda better... as Kinefinity have a focal reducer option! Yay). As if that happened it would be tremendously good news for both companies, and a massive result to help the indy / hobbyist / low / medium budget film industry.

Be great if Kinefinity and BMD could talk together with each other to create a universal mount system which can go onto dominate the film industry in the future.

Possible interchangeable mounts for 4.6K?
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Old April 3rd, 2016, 10:07 AM   #3
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Re: RED Raven vs URSA Mini 4.6K vs Kinefinity Terra 6K

There are many factors when making comparisons. No one camera is right for everyone.
Price is always one of the prime factors, yet one needs to consider more than just price.
For me there is ROI, return on investment.

If you are looking to make money from your gear, having the right gear can make all the difference.

Disclaimer: I personally don't own RED, BM or Kinefinity. As an industry professional, I try to read and monitor the boards and other information provided by those who are actually working with the gear.

Red, like them or not, has a name in the industry -
a name people desire and are willing to pay for. Their gear has proven itself over and over.
Most important, imo, the images their cameras produce are stunning = 'film quality.'
What Raven promises (and will likely deliver) is amazing. Red support is also pretty solid from everything I have read. The other thing is even in three to five years, a well maintained Raven will retain a higher percentage of its initial cost.

Black Magic. For me, they make some decent stuff at amazing price points. What Grant and his team have accomplished is astounding. However, over the years their quality and industry rep is not great.
For me, I cannot afford failure no matter how cheap the gear's price point.
Added to that, no one I know in the rental market is *asking and seeking out* Black Magic - unless perhaps they are on a tight budget. Even if so, those same people would gladly move to RED if priced the same or even a little bit more. Their support is not top tier from my experience (At the U we have some BM gear. It is not what I would have purchased given alternatives from companies like Canon, Sony, Panasonic and AJA.)
Resale value in three to five = not as good as RED.

Kinefinity: I have not really kept up with this company, so I might very well be wrong here - but from postings on CML, although the cameras deliver some good quality images, I cannot remember them showing up one the NAB show floor even once so far. Their first camera - was it even delivered? I seem to remember all kinds of firmware updates and such that it was in the midst of needing to even work (with after market grading software)?
The question comes down to things like reliability, support and upgrades.
What happens when you are on set and something goes down? China is a long way away.
And last, is anyone asking for this camera or an owner operator on the rental market?

As always, your situation and needs may well supersede all my spew and your milage may vary!
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Old April 22nd, 2016, 11:51 AM   #4
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Re: RED Raven vs URSA Mini 4.6K vs Kinefinity Terra 6K

Okay - I just rolled in from NAB 2016. I was able to take a good long look at the URSA mini and Raven.
Kinefinity - I must have strolled right by them - apologies. I do see from their website that they are not yet shipping.


Okay, so I was impressed with the BM Mini Ursa. They had it hooked up to a $40,000 Fuji lens, so there was that, but unlike the previous offerings, moire and 'jello-cam' seem to be a thing of the past. It has a nice look, but I wish that the BM booth had been lighted to show off the Mini's ability to capture high DR. Instead, they had a whole slew of soft boxes hanging = boring flat light (the boxes looked ugly too). (To BM, PLEASE, hire a real DP or lighting designer next time to rock your both with dynamic lighting - both for the camera and for the audience - it would be worth it!)

I like all the features that the mini offers and for the price point nothing comes close. One of the coolest is the 12G signal output on ONE bnc. That is so so so so (4X) much cooler than FOUR bnc connectors that everyone else (well, two for Canon) seems to think is an option. It is NOT an option. I was over component video 15 years go and I am NEVER going back to RGB + 1? NO! Get it together camera makers - 12G on a bnc over copper or optical is what we want = it either works or it doesn't.

BM is going to sell a lot of these minis.
In fact, I was so impressed, I was almost ready to recommend that we buy four of them for the video studio because for us, we do multi camera shoots that I direct and hot switch, no one else is offering BM's easy workflow (router/switcher/converters/view assist viewfinder) using 12G. Also being able to record compressed RAW and pro res is another terrific feature. If - and this is an if, BM's mini proves to be a solid and robust workhorse without the flaws that plagued the Cine cam, they may finally begin to turnaround their professional reputation.

Time will tell.
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