Editing for HDTV

[Peter Solmssen]

I do drop the original footage directly into the timeline and edit, both in Vegas and in iMovie. The difference has been in rendering to an HD format that can be presented on an HDTV after editing.

[Dan Euritt]

you can play native mpeg4 footage out to an hdtv by plugging the output of your pc video card into the hdtv... it's known as a media center; for instance, microsoft has a version of winxp designed to record ota footage, and play it back thru an hdtv.

are you saying that you can bring the sanyo mpeg4 native footage into vegas, and play it back without rendering anything? you can make simple cuts-only edits, then export the native mpeg4 off of the timeline without any rendering at all? anything else is bad for picture quality.

[Peter Solmssen]

You can import the MP4 to Vegas and edit in the normal fashion. So far, Vegas only offers WMV9 or HDV as High Def rendering options, and they take forever.

I import MP4 into iMovie and render as Quicktime HD. I see absolutely no loss in quality on a 60 inch Sony HDTV and the process is surprisingly fast.

The only remaining questions for me are whether more sophisticated editing will require Final Cut, and whether the edited video could be converted to a less space intensive format, such as H.264, without significant loss of quality.

[Dan Euritt]

i'm still trying to figure out if vegas will edit the native sanyo mpeg4 footage... "normal fashion" doesn't help.

beyond that, what codec does quicktime hd use?

[Graham Jones]

Cutting the HD1's MP4 files in Vegas 6.0d is very efficient and the result high in quality.

This is due in part to the HDV Intermediate option, which was presumably introduced to speed up Mpeg2 editing of HDV footage. This can be used for the HD1's MP4 files - when you're rendering you can conform the original MP4 files.

Sorry, don't know how to export without rendering.

[Jake Richardson]

Hello Peter,

I am in Berkeley, and would like to see your footage if that is possible. I could pay a small fee to do so.

Thanks,

Jake R.

[Graham Jones]

Another great thing about Peter's set-up which may interest others wondering how to post with the HD1, is that because it's a 2006 Mac Mini, he would be able to run Windows XP equally fast (some say faster) than on a PC.

Although emulation programs have existed for years, new breakthroughs are possible because of the Intel chips in new Macs.

They haven't got it perfected yet, but they will soon.

My next computer will be a Mac that also runs Windows Vista.

This isn't because I have a HD1 - I always preferred Macs but needed Windows. Now I can have both!

See here for more details:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/04/13/te...pc&oref=slogin

[Steven Mingam]

Originally Posted by Graham Jones Senior

because it's a 2006 Mac Mini, he would be able to run Windows XP equally fast (some say faster) than on a PC.

LMFAO ! the new Mac (macintel) ARE PC ! they use intel processor (Core Solo or Duo, codename Yonah, architecture from the Pentium M..), pci-express bus and ATI graphics processor.... It's the same, you could build it yourself. You can also install Mac Os X on a PC now (with the right hardware inside...)

[Dan Euritt]

Originally Posted by Graham Jones Senior

Sorry, don't know how to export without rendering.

thank you... it sounds like vegas will not edit the native mpeg4 files from the sanyo, and neither will any mac program, for that matter.

as for the mac dual-boot option... i've seen some negative press about how well it works, perhaps they will get it ironed out at some point.

bootitng works really well for dual-boot situations.

[Graham Jones]

"are you saying that you can bring the sanyo mpeg4 native footage into vegas, and play it back without rendering anything? you can make simple cuts-only edits, then export the native mpeg4 off of the timeline without any rendering at all? anything else is bad for picture quality."

Dan, Just to clarify - you're not suggesting that rendering is always bad for picture quality, are you? I mean, there's such a thing a rendering without quality loss. Rendering doesn't, by definition, mean processing. It can also describe rearranging.

For instance, when I used MPEG EDIT STUDIO PRO 1.0 with the JVC cam, it was a native Mpeg2 editor. As long as you only made cuts, and didn't do any effects or anything, there was no quality loss when you rendered. I know this because I tested it over 13 re-renders.

Obviously Vegas is a different thing, but I just wasn't 100% clear what you meant about rendering and exporting.

[Joe Helfrich]

I know I'm jumping in way over my head here, but I'm hoping that one of you can give me some very basic info on editing HD video I've shot w/ my neat new Sanyo. Maybe instead of having to take time to school me on the basics, you can direct me to an appropriate info source. I'm starting at square one here. For now, I just want to be able to cut and paste the pretty videos I've shot of my new baby girl and email them out to friends and family in a format that anyone can view w/ basic versions of WM/Quicktime/Real. I need add'l software to do that, right? (I told you I'm starting w/ zero knowledge here.) From there, I'm looking forward to getting into more advanced stuff in the near future.

I get the sense from the postings I've read that my choices are Vegas (expensive!) or a new Mac w/ IMovie (even more expensive!) Problem is I already have 5 PCs in the house and my wife will kill me if I buy another machine - as much as I'd like to try a Mac.

Is there a less expensive option for me? I found Squared5 (http://www.squared5.com/). Too good to be true? Avid Liquid might be an option too (http://www.avid.com/products/liquid/) but not cheap.

Also, it sounds like I have to "render" video in order to edit it. Don't know much about that. Sure I'll find out. But it sounds like rendering using Vegas takes forever. Is that really a problem? Is it really 32 x length of the video clip(s)? Is that an important reason why folks seem to prefer Mac?

So my questions are: 1. where can I go to get a basic "how to" on editing HD video? 2. assuming I need 3rd party software, am I right that my choices are Vegas and IMovie? and 3. is Vegas really exponentially slower?

Thanks in advance for the help and thanks for slowing things down for me.

[Wayne Morin]

Joe,

For the most basic use, you can use the Ulead Movie factory that came with your Sanyo. You can edit clips and burn to dvd. You can also upload or email clips using the free upload services.

I'm also new to video editing, but I used the included software for a very rudimentary dvd compilation of my clips with minimal editing ( connecting clips, changing start/end points of clips, etc.). I had approximately 25 clips and 48 minutes of HD video plus slide show images. Rendering took a little over 1.5 hours, so about a 3X rendering time.

I ordered Vegas Movie Studio DVD + platinum yesterday to contine my path on the learning curve of video editing. Cost is less than $100US. It doesn't have all the features of Vegas 6, but it does handle HDV.

[Joe Helfrich]

Wayne,

thanks for the reply. I didn't realize the included software has editing capabilities. And thanks for the tip on the less expensive version of Vegas. Good luck with that.

[Peter Solmssen]

As noted above, I have been very pleased with the results of editing HD1 footage on the Intel-based dual core Mac Mini. The only problem has been the resultant file size, which in Quicktime HD is about five times the original Sanyo footage.

I have been experimenting with converting or rendering the edited footage into H.264. Using the original resolution and a transfer rate of 9Mb, like the original, has produced very good looking images at approximately the original file size. The advantage is not only less demands on storage, but also that the edited video can be stored or backed up on a DVD if it is under an hour in length, i.e. the same as SD, but at much better quality.

I have achieved the best results when the H.264 is in the Quicktime (.mov) format. I have also tried H.264 in MP4, but there were subtle differences from the original in brightness and contrast. I have no idea why that should be so, since we are talking about the "envelope".

Pleased as I am with the results, there is a downside. The process takes something like 20 times the running time of the video, at least on my machine, which is the 1.6 Ghz dual core Mini with 2Gb of RAM.

[Dan Euritt]

Originally Posted by Graham Jones Senior

For instance, when I used MPEG EDIT STUDIO PRO 1.0 with the JVC cam, it was a native Mpeg2 editor. As long as you only made cuts, and didn't do any effects or anything, there was no quality loss when you rendered.

in that scenario, there is nothing to be rendered, so i'm not sure what you are referring to?

the workflow you described there is just what's needed for the sanyo mpeg4 footage.