JVC GY-HM200 - alternative to Sony PXW-X70

[Craig Yanagi]

Regarding macro, you can be inches away from the subject and keep focus on the subject.

[Paul Anderegg]

Well............seems the real package is the LS300, the HM200 is like a Ford Mustang V6.....similar style, but the engine is a turd. :(

Paul

[John Nantz]

Size comparison of the Canon XA20, Sony PXW-X70, JVC GY-HM200, JVC LS300CHU, and just for comparison, the JVC GY-HM600/650

The lens on the LS300 is sketched on (artist rendition) and is probably shorter than what would be typically used. For example, with a Nikon or Canon lens and the Metabones adapter, the overall camera length would be longer than shown.

The concept of a modular cam is something to think about, especially one that can use a variety of lenses. When the lens can easily cost more than the cam itself, and 4K would benefit with good glass, then it seems it would make sense to go the modular cam route. Question: Since I haven’t considered a modular cam before, am I missing anything here?

Also, when one has several lenses and a modular B-roll cam, then lenses could be swapped around, and, a modular B-cam wouldn’t cost as much as a fully equipped cam.

A possible downside seems to be finding and using lenses, or lenses and adapter combinations, that work with a modular cam - things like focus, autofocus, iris, etc. Haven’t come across anything about how Image Stabilization works with adaptive lenses. Sony, Panasonic, and Canon have some good IS systems in their camcorders, some models better than others. This is another area for discussion.

The HM200 is looking like a good cam and it’s one that will work fine with FCPX. For a bit more, the LS300 looks interesting, especially with the Rokinon lens (promotion) added in at no cost.

Edit: The Canon is facing the opposite way because if it was flipped the wording would be backwards. Also, tried to line up the back of the camera bodies, not the EVF, with each model.

[Anthony Lelli]

Originally Posted by Paul Anderegg

Well............seems the real package is the LS300, the HM200 is like a Ford Mustang V6.....similar style, but the engine is a turd. :(

Paul

not really. Something happened.... the HM200 has been saved by the 4K surprise of the lens performance: pretty good wide open (and 1.2). Only in 4K. (the lens is not good enough below f/2 in HD). That changes everything for what now I consider a 4K only camera. Just ordered 2 128GB card (U3). yes... in 4K is that good to deserve the cards. My opinion of the HM200 changed dramatically after I saw the lens @1.2 in 4K. WOW

about the LS300 I don't really see the point , if you think GH4. Yes better ergonomics but it's not like the LS300 is a shoulder camera or anything: needs to be held in mid air too so..... what's the point? The GH4 gives remote (lanc-ish) too for the servo zooms. what else? the sensor? I say HM200 for a camera ready now that does everything in 4K or the GH4 for the creative videographers (with or without a crew or movie sets : with crew: commercial and movies , without a crew: amateurs obsessed with the bokeh for the 2 minute boring youtube video with cheesy music)

and that's the marketing targets for those cameras in a simple sentence.

[Paul Anderegg]

I am confused.......the lens is not sharp enough for HD, but looks amazing in 4K? :-\

Paul

[Andy Wilkinson]

Yes I am confused too!

Anthony, any chance of posting some quick test shots so we can see what you are talking about???

The way your recent post reads this does not make sense (to me anyway) but we really appreciate you sharing your experiences on here with this cam.

[Anthony Lelli]

Originally Posted by Paul Anderegg

I am confused.......the lens is not sharp enough for HD, but looks amazing in 4K? :-\

Paul

LOL yes, that was a surprise, something that I would never guess and in fact I didn't even try 1.2 in 4K. It was a test that I did leaving the lens wide open by mistake. then I did it again, and again: in 4K 1.2 keeps a decent sharpness and contrast, very useable. hard to believe but that's how it is.

[Anthony Lelli]

Originally Posted by Andy Wilkinson

Yes I am confused too!

Anthony, any chance of posting some quick test shots so we can see what you are talking about???

The way your recent post reads this does not make sense (to me anyway) but we really appreciate you sharing your experiences on here with this cam.

it was hard to believe but then again lots of things happen in 4K, for example it gets darker (6DB difference from HD) , so why ? it's the same lens, no?

[John Mitchell]

Why is anybody proposing this - silly thread. A1/2.3 " sensor versus a 1" sensor - completely different cameras designed for different purposes. Different depth of field for a start..

[Kevin Balling]

These two camcorders are poised to attract the same potential buyer. There are many, including myself, who would be in a position to choose between the two, and a thread like this can sort out some of the good and bad points of each. I consider it valuable.
These cameras are both considered prosumer, they are about the same size and form factor, the same price range, similar picture quality, on and on. For these reasons I consider this thread appropriate and anything but silly.

[John Mitchell]

Didn't mean to offend, you're right the specs are very similar. What I should have said IMO these cameras differ at the most fundamental basics - sensor size.
That will affect noise floor on the image, depth of field, dynamic range etc..
So the 1" sensor will be easier to throw the background out, but harder to focus. Better in low light and better dynamic range and probably less aggressive in camera noise reduction. 14million effective bigger pixels versus 9million so clear image zoom is going to be less artificial on the Sony as it doesn't involve pixel shifting etc..

So if you do a lot of shooting where you want everything in focus then choose the JVC - for a studio based situation the JVC may be a good choice, for live streaming it may be better than the Sony.
Me - I'd pick the Sony for most types of work. X-AVC 10bit 4:2:2 internal HD for green screen work is also a big plus IMO. Yes the colours are screwed out of the box but that can be overcome.

[Kevin Balling]

A decent review of the JVC GY HM200. The video concentrates on the 1080P mode and some low light footage with gain examples.

On location with the JVC GY-HM200 (includes low light tests) on Vimeo

[Anthony Lelli]

Originally Posted by Kevin Balling

A decent review of the JVC GY HM200. The video concentrates on the 1080P mode and some low light footage with gain examples.

On location with the JVC GY-HM200 (includes low light tests) on Vimeo

yes it's a bit dark in low light but in 1080 I can go up to 15DB with no bad noise. in 4K I am limited by the 30p but I can use f/1.2 , 1.4 , 1.6 (only in 4K) while in 1080 I can't go below 1.8. Notice the "cold" WB by default (it's like a JVC signature of the colors)

impressive little machine, after I couple of weeks I kinda understand why the guy wanted to publish a new video about it.

One more thing: the sensor read-out in 1080 is fast and gives smooth pans! Finally. not just less rolling shutter (that I did notice immediately) but also the typical blur that starts the moment you pan or tilt. The HM200 is hands down the best camera that I had in years regarding panning. outperforms even the EX1r for a fast pan. In 4K is a little more visible , but still better than other cameras in 1080!

[John Nantz]

Kevin - That was some fine Internet sleuthing to come up with that link by Rick Young that you have in post #57. This gives us another good look at what this cam can do and the low-light portion with the different settings was very helpful.

There are still some areas of interest, like how well the 1/16 ND filter will work in sunlight on the water. The shot on the sailboat with the chrome winch was helpful.

Something on the optical stabilization would be of interest. Weight-wise, at 3.4 lbs with battery but without mic, this will fit nicely on my Glidecam 2000 because it is rated for up to 6 lbs, but the Glidecam takes time to set up and it isn’t always available.

I looked at some of Rick Young’s other videos and the Dedolight one at one of the shows was a good watch. Haven’t seen much on the Dedolight in the US and I really like my Ledzilla (with Sony battery). After watching the video, though, I’m ready to add a larger Dedolight or two to my kit.

Rick did some previous reviews with some pretty good cams but he seemed pretty impressed with the HM200.

“The devil is in the details” and we’re all looking for those details.

Edit: And speaking of details, Anthony, thanks for the info about Jello and panning. That's good to know and the jello thing is one thing I was concerned about since this isn't a 3CCD cam.

[Anthony Lelli]

Originally Posted by John Nantz

Edit: And speaking of details, Anthony, thanks for the info about Jello and panning. That's good to know and the jello thing is one thing I was concerned about since this isn't a 3CCD cam.

blur panning (and tilting, but mostly panning) has been a problem since forever. Rolling shutter as well. Now I believe that it has very little to do with the cmos sensors or the (global) shutter. But with the speed of the read-out. basically the chips in charge of processing the sensor. In fact one of the major thing with the C100II is just that: they double the speed just for the blur panning. And regarding the RS why the alexa doesn't show it? why the F55 doesn't show it? one is global and the other is not.