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Old March 16th, 2017, 12:55 PM   #16
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Most likely JVC has done something specific with the codec but since edius is able to import, edit and export that codec means grassvalley made changes to make it work, they have their slogan "edit anything" for a reason :)
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Old March 16th, 2017, 01:13 PM   #17
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Just feels a little bogus that the camera's best HD setting produces a video file called "Quicktime movie' that isn't recognized by a Quicktime player.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 01:14 PM   #18
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

H.264 was orginally developed as an 8-bit 4:2:0 codec for delivery of consumer video content. As H.264 scope and options have expanded over the years, decoder support for 4:2:2 color depth has been haphazard and unreliable. In general, 10-bit and 4:2:2 H.264 video files should be regarded as proprietary capture footage suitable only for import into video editors and post-processing tools. Video files intended for general purpose desktop playback should be encoded in 8-bit 4:2:0 H.264 format at bitrates up to 30 Mbps. While denser formats may appear to play back properly on your own workstation, there's no guarantee they will be displayed properly on other commonly used systems.

Quicktime has a notoriously dysfunctional track record, particularly on Windows systems. Apple has abandoned Quicktime support for that platform.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 01:22 PM   #19
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

I'm not sure what all that means as it relates to the LS300 offering a YUV 422 setting on the camera. I understand Windows having issues, but I thought JVC and Apple were a thing.

Does JVC include a format on their camera that has unreliable and haphazard decoder support because it's a better format if you want to take the steps to make it work?
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Old March 16th, 2017, 02:00 PM   #20
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

I believe Grassvalley made changes to Edius so that working with mov files doesn't require having quicktime installed which is a good thing.

You could blame Jvc for developing a codec that is not editable in fcp but I say it's the developers of fcp fault for not making the required changes to make it work. It's always up the the NLE manufacturer to make sure new codecs just work, when I look into Edius primary color corrector there is an option to add a lut, in the source for the colourspace there are a lot of presets for Canon, Sony, Panasonic and fujifilm log modes but there is also one specific for the ls300 which means Grassvalley has examined the ls300 codecs to make it work.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 02:12 PM   #21
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

I've just tested this.

A 422 1080p25 file can't be viewed in the finder or in Quicktime, whereas VLC plays it properly.

It imports and plays perfectly in FCPX 10.3. The file shows as color profile HD (1-1-1) in the inspector.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 02:24 PM   #22
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

You really don't need the YUV codec unless you are working on something where that would definitely help. You could edit in ProRes4444 all the time also but why? Extremely high quality but a drive eater and beyond most editing needs. Years ago we could have done everything in D2 but DigiBeta was more than enough and cheaper too. In many editing situations ProResHQ is not visually discernible from regular ProRes yet there's a 30% difference in file size. Sometimes ProResLT is good enough although I never use it.

If you really want an improved recording free of h264 artifacts, investigate an external recorder like a Shogun. You get ProRes files and a great external monitor.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 02:32 PM   #23
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

It's the same bitrate as the HQ format so why not use it if you want... you should get cleaner keys if you are shooting chromakey. But as far as I'm aware when you are in 422 mode the camera doesn't record sub blacks or peak whites.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 03:42 PM   #24
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

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Originally Posted by William Hohauser View Post
You really don't need the YUV codec unless you are working on something where that would definitely help. You could edit in ProRes4444 all the time also but why?
Just because the camera offers the setting, seems it would be better if grading. But I'm not positive of this stuff, but I wouldn't edit in 4444 If I shot in 422 or 420, but since 422 is a setting I was going to explore it with color grading. But I can use 420 if it's close enough to the same thing. I don't do too much keying. Is the big advantage keying? I was thinking it would offer deeper color contrast and so forth.

Also my version of FCPX isn't updated to the most recent, I'll do that and see how it changes things too.

Duncan you said on FB you hadn't shot 422 in a long time, what format do you mostly shoot now on the LS300?

Thanks for the input, much appreciated.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 07:03 PM   #25
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

I am running OS10.12.3 and FCPX 10.3.2 on a six year old MacBookPro at home and my test recordings in YUV from the LS300 imported perfectly. I'm sure my office MacPro will have no problem.

Please do not discount keeping your programs up to date, it's a mistake not to. Do system backups in case an update goes awry but there's no good reason to not update (if the program hasn't changed it's GUI) unless you are in the middle of a project.

Check things out by shooting test scenes in both codecs but I believe you'll find that regular 50mbps will do you just fine in most circumstances. Even 35 isn't bad. Some people record in 4K even though the product will never be delivered that way. If grading is something you plan to do a lot of, an external recorder will be much better but be prepared to buy lots of storage drives.

Now on a side note regarding JVC LS300 YUV files on a Mac. Quicktime can't play them. VLC can. Compressor imports the files and can play them but can't convert it to anything useful. EditReady can't convert the files either.
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Old March 16th, 2017, 10:53 PM   #26
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Fixed

I got it, troubleshooting fail. It was just my FCP not updated.

You're absolutely right William and I do keep my programs updated, this was almost like a typo. I had been editing on older MacBook Pro that was slowing down and I recently bought a refurbished MacPro to use for an editing only. In my haste to check it out I just opened the version of FCP X on it, checked the version and read 10.1.3 as 10.3.1. I checked it twice is the bad part.

The plan was to remove his version whenever I needed an update, but I worry about removing stuff and I was excited about getting into LUT grading and forgot about doing it. Long story short I removed the version on it and added my current one and FCP X imports and plays the YUV file just fine.

Apologies for the sidetrack thread, as is often the case it's something simple, I just thought I had checked it. The good part is it makes sense and JVC and FCP are on a similar page like I thought.
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Old March 17th, 2017, 11:09 AM   #27
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

I have been following this thread with interest. I shoot primarily in HD 50Mb YUV 422 24p and have not experienced any problems importing and viewing the footage in FCPX. My editing system consists of a older 27" iMac running Mac OS 10.12.3 and FCPX 10.3.2. My LS300 has the latest firmware update v3.02 which was released in Jan. 2017. I record primarily to a Ninja Blade via HDMI and internally in the camera to 128GB SanDisk Extreme Pro 95MB v30 cards. The internal recording is a backup to the Ninja Blade's 23.98 ProRes 422 recording. When I import ProRes clips from the Ninja Blade into FCPX there appears to be no transcoding involved. However, when I import .MOV clips from the SanDisk card, FCPX always transcodes the .MOV files. I have FCPX configured to "Create optimized media" when importing clips. As previously suggested, make sure you have the latest updates to your Mac OS, FCPX, and LS300. Also, in FCPX check to see if you have Create Optimized Media enabled in the import Transcode setting.

Last edited by W. Bill Magac; March 17th, 2017 at 11:14 AM. Reason: Corrected spelling error.
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Old March 17th, 2017, 02:23 PM   #28
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Darn I feel bad about this thread, it was a basic thing I just missed. For others that might be reading I'll restate that the only issue was using an older version of FCPX, what made the thread long was that i checked that and misread the version.

I was using a new/old system and just blanked out when I checked. I needed to switch over to my version anyway, had just been putting it off. I figured i had missed something basic when I googled and every issue on it was from 2007 lol.


To sum it up, quicktime player wont play YUV422 video files from the card, but you can preview them if needed with the VLC player, and a current version of FCP X plays and imports YUV422 video just fine.


Giddy up.
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Old March 17th, 2017, 04:11 PM   #29
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

It's worth mentioning that FCPX performs a bit slower under Sierra than it does under El Capitan. So if you don't need Siri on your desktop don't bother updating to Sierra just yet. El Capitan will happily run the latest version of FCPX so no worries there.
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Old March 19th, 2017, 03:28 PM   #30
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay P. Kaley View Post
Darn I feel bad about this thread, it was a basic thing I just missed. For others that might be reading I'll restate that the only issue was using an older version of FCPX, what made the thread long was that i checked that and misread the version.

I was using a new/old system and just blanked out when I checked. I needed to switch over to my version anyway, had just been putting it off. I figured i had missed something basic when I googled and every issue on it was from 2007 lol.


To sum it up, quicktime player wont play YUV422 video files from the card, but you can preview them if needed with the VLC player, and a current version of FCP X plays and imports YUV422 video just fine.


Giddy up.
Actually this thread pointed out an anomaly I discovered with my 2011 MacbookPro. The JVC YUV files work great in FCPX but no other program that recognizes YUV files on my MacBookPro will recognize the JVC YUV files. My MacPro doesn't have this problem although QuickTime won't play it there either. Right now I am researching the problem with a programmer, the working theory is that MacBookPros of that era have two video cards, one card designed to help conserve energy when not using GPU intensive programs like FCPX. It's possible that the YUV file is going to the wrong GPU that doesn't have the programming to decode it while FCPX sends the file to the right GPU.
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