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Old March 19th, 2017, 04:52 PM   #31
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

William, the answer is likely to be that Quicktime cannot play JVC 422 because it doesn't have the right codec. Apple killed Quicktime development in 2009, and subsequently only made a couple of minor service updates.

The reason that FCPX has no problem working with JVC 422 is because FCPX is not based on Quicktime it uses AV foundation which can handle the 422 files.
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Old March 19th, 2017, 06:08 PM   #32
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

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Originally Posted by W. Bill Magac View Post
I have been following this thread with interest. I shoot primarily in HD 50Mb YUV 422 24p and have not experienced any problems importing and viewing the footage in FCPX. My editing system consists of a older 27" iMac running Mac OS 10.12.3 and FCPX 10.3.2. My LS300 has the latest firmware update v3.02 which was released in Jan. 2017. I record primarily to a Ninja Blade via HDMI and internally in the camera to 128GB SanDisk Extreme Pro 95MB v30 cards. The internal recording is a backup to the Ninja Blade's 23.98 ProRes 422 recording. When I import ProRes clips from the Ninja Blade into FCPX there appears to be no transcoding involved. However, when I import .MOV clips from the SanDisk card, FCPX always transcodes the .MOV files. I have FCPX configured to "Create optimized media" when importing clips. As previously suggested, make sure you have the latest updates to your Mac OS, FCPX, and LS300. Also, in FCPX check to see if you have Create Optimized Media enabled in the import Transcode setting.
This afternoon I decided to test Quicktime with the .mov files recorded on my Ninja Blade and the .mov files recorded on the LS300 memory card. I was unable to open the LS300 memory card .mov files in Quicktime. However, I had no problem opening the Ninja Blade .mov files with Quicktime. My suspicion is JVC may be using an older .mov codec that is not compatible with the latest v10.4 Quicktime. Has anyone contacted JVC regarding this problem?
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Old March 19th, 2017, 09:58 PM   #33
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncan Craig View Post
William, the answer is likely to be that Quicktime cannot play JVC 422 because it doesn't have the right codec. Apple killed Quicktime development in 2009, and subsequently only made a couple of minor service updates.

The reason that FCPX has no problem working with JVC 422 is because FCPX is not based on Quicktime it uses AV foundation which can handle the 422 files.
I would agree except that JVC YUV can play in QuickTime after it's been rewrapped by EditReady on my MacPro (not the 2011 laptop). The reading of codecs is dependent on Apple's updating of Pro Video Formats which last happened in October. QuickTime Player is right now treated as a consumer level program by Apple. What EditReady does is place a standardized QuickTime wrapper around video files that don't follow what Apple has allowed. The file itself is not being recompressed. Wrappers are not the codec, h264 can be in a mov file or MP4 file. It's the same codec.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 02:49 AM   #34
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

There are many different implementations of the h264 system, and this 422 h264 must be a non standard one. I expect it's a bit like levels, 422 will be a 'high' level codec, but it must be slightly out of spec and Quicktime can't understand it, then assuming the user needs to download a different codec.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 06:39 AM   #35
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

This happens all the time, in the past Sony and Canon have both introduced h264 variants that it took awhile for the NLE programmers to catch up on. We get to enjoy the confusion.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 09:53 AM   #36
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Below is a link to an Apple database listing the companies and products that have licensed the Apple ProRes codec from Apple. JVC is not in the list.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT200321
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Old March 20th, 2017, 10:26 AM   #37
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

I think you are getting confused.

The JVC records in h264, your Ninja records in ProRes.
Two entirely different things.

You don't need to convert the JVC footage to ProRes (Optimised) in order to edit with it in FCPX.
(You don't even need to import it from the card as far as I know).
But if you do Optimise it your editing experience will be smoother on older computers.

.mov files are simply wrappers to various types of movie files, in the same way .avi .mkv .mxf .mp4 are wrappers for a variety of file types and video codecs.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 01:56 PM   #38
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Duncan, Thanks for the clarification. I was under the impression a video file with the .mov extension would be the same codec, regardless of its source.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 01:59 PM   #39
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

No problem.
Wrappers and codecs can be really complicated.
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Old March 20th, 2017, 04:59 PM   #40
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncan Craig View Post
There are many different implementations of the h264 system, and this 422 h264 must be a non standard one. I expect it's a bit like levels, 422 will be a 'high' level codec, but it must be slightly out of spec and Quicktime can't understand it, then assuming the user needs to download a different codec.
That's an unwarranted speculation, considering Apple's track record of ignoring industry standards in favor of its own proprietary implementations. H.264 is replete with a long list of upgraded profiles and levels beyond 8-bit 4:2:0 color. It's far more likely that Apple simply stopped short of updating Quicktime to support the particular H.264 features that JVC uses in its 4:2:2 encoder.
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Old March 21st, 2017, 08:37 AM   #41
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

You might be right but I know for a fact, as a beta tester for video software in the past, that JVC has historically ignored industry software protocols. Many JVC devices with FireWire control didn't use the proper device identifiers to interface with NLEs. These identifiers would be programmed into the FireWire controller chip and would tell the whatever was querying the JVC device, what the JVC device was and what it could do. The software programmers had to work around it. In our case here, as explained in another thread, the LS300 doesn't fully communicate properly with a number of M43 lenses even though the camera is designed for that standard. Some lenses work fine, others are usable yet hobbled. The cause for that problem is up to speculation. That the YUV file implementation isn't quite right isn't too far from possible.
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Old March 21st, 2017, 10:54 AM   #42
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

It's frustrating that JVC's engineers haven't been able to provide full compatibility with all MFT lenses, in particular, OIS support which is lacking for many lenses. The reason, however, is glaringly obvious - Panasonic's refusal to release full engineering documentation on the implementations of their MFT lens protocols. This policy has forced third party manufacturers like JVC and Sigma to resort to reverse-engineering only as many lens features as they have had resources to test:

dvinfo.net/forum/attachments/jvc-4k-pro-handheld-camcorders/37060d1485272205-ls300-lensprotocols-jvcjyls300_tested_lens_info.pdf

In my experience, desktop playback of 4:2:2 color depth in H.264 files has always been problematic, not just in Quicktime but with many third party video players as well. I've also seen encoding errors occur in custom 4:2:2 files produced by MainConcept's professional H.264 encoder. Most hardware manufacturers like JVC don't develop their own H.264 encoders, they license reference encoders and configure them specifically to support the features of each camera model. Here's an example of a similar playback issue with files produced by a Canon camera that uses the same Quicktime encoder (2007.09) used to produce JVC 4:2:2 MOV files:

https://discussions.apple.com/thread...art=0&tstart=0
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Old March 26th, 2017, 01:54 PM   #43
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Re: LS300 memory card issue...

Does anyone know if the LS300 plays nice with Sony Vegas? I'm running v12.....
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