Full Sensor Dream Lenses

[Noa Put]

So you want the same focal length compared to a full frame camera that has a 50mm lens attached?

[B.J. Adams]

i am just wondering why the specs say its the equivalent of 50mm on 35mm, and if this applies to ls300.

[Noa Put]

I believe they do this for any size sensor that deviates from a 35mm full frame sensor as that appears to be a standard that's used to indicate what field of view you will get. With m4/3 is simple, if you have a 50mm lens on a full frame camera and you want to have the same field of view on a m4/3 camera you divide by 2 so you need a 25mm. From what I understand you need to do the same with the f-stop so a 50mm at f2.8 on a full frame camera should have the same shallow dof as a 25mm at f1.4 on a m4/3 camera but don't quote me on that, I never did any actual test as I don't have a full frame camera but have read it, anyone is welcome to correct me if necessary.
Edit: forgot to mention that this is only the case when you set vsm to 80% or "mft", once you start changing that the field of view changes as well but not the dof.

[Duncan Craig]

What you are talking about here is simply the crop factor.

The 25mm lens is designed for Micro Four Thirds which has a 2x crop factor. Meaning that when the lens is used on a MFT camera such as the GH4 it has the same field of view as a 50mm lens on a traditional 35mm film stills camera. Put the lens on an LS300 and you'll have to set the VSM level down to remove the vignetting as it's not 'supposed' to cover a sensor larger than the GH4.

A 50mm lens is often referred to as a 'Standard Lens' which is a popular focal length for 35mm still photography. For cropped sensors such as the APS format a 35mm will give roughly the same angle of view because the crop factor is around 1.5.

A lens designed for APS will cover the entire LS300 sensor.

Silly question, but the thread title relates to Full Frame lenses?
Your best bet if you really want FF lenses is to buy a set of Samyangs, I've just bought 5 they are amazing.

[Noa Put]

I also had the complete set of Samyangs but for my Sony nex-ea50 and when I sold that camera I sold the lenses too. These lenses have a very good price/performance but I was not satisfied with all of them, my 12 and 24mm where pretty soft in comparison to panasonic mft lenses but them being softer did give the image some "character", some might call it cinematic, not sure :) the samyang 7,5mm fisheye was so soft that I found it unusable, the 9-18mm olympus that I got instead was like night and day at 9mm and I"m sure the 7-14 panasonic or olympus will put the samyang to shame at 7mm. My 12mm did have a issue with irisblades that got stuck but the supplier replaced it with a new one without any discussion.
I might get myself the 135mm t2.2 as that would be a great lens for ceremonies and for 549euro that's a great deal.

[Duncan Craig]

Noa, I did read that some people had softness issue with the 24mm when fully open but that it's very sharp with the iris closed slightly. I'm not sure if mine has this issue, I don't think I've filmed with it fully open.

According to online reviews the 35,50 and 85mm lenses compare favourable with Zeiss primes.

I couldn't comment on fisheye and ultra wide Samyangs. I use a Tokina 11-16mm f2.8 for wide shots.

It's worth mentioning that the latest Cine versions of the lenses have distance and iris scales on both sides of the lens (not on the top) and they have matching optical coatings. As well as uniformly aligned follow focus teeth positions (if you need that sort of thing).

[B.J. Adams]

Originally Posted by Duncan Craig

What you are talking about here is simply the crop factor.

The 25mm lens is designed for Micro Four Thirds which has a 2x crop factor. Meaning that when the lens is used on a MFT camera such as the GH4 it has the same field of view as a 50mm lens on a traditional 35mm film stills camera. Put the lens on an LS300 and you'll have to set the VSM level down to remove the vignetting as it's not 'supposed' to cover a sensor larger than the GH4.

A 50mm lens is often referred to as a 'Standard Lens' which is a popular focal length for 35mm still photography. For cropped sensors such as the APS format a 35mm will give roughly the same angle of view because the crop factor is around 1.5.

A lens designed for APS will cover the entire LS300 sensor.

Understood fully, thanks.
Everything comes at a price and compromise, the Panasonics offer very good quality for their price factor, but they are MFT and you have to crop down to avoid vignetting, but on the other hand you don't need expensive adapters. However I still think this is an OK option for someone who is just starting out and doesn't have thousands of $s in cash to spend on lenses.

[Noa Put]

Everything comes at a price and compromise, the Panasonics offer very good quality for their price factor, but they are MFT and you have to crop down to avoid vignetting

You make it sound as if that is a bad thing :) MFT lenses can be just as good as apsc lenses (when it comes to IQ) that cover the entire sensor. I also think you are misunderstanding the concept of jvc's larger sensor, you can say a MFT lens is using a smaller part of the sensor so it's cropping, I would say the lens is using a part of the sensor that it has been designed for. The larger sensor main benefit is that is does allow lenses, other then MFT, to be used, which is a advantage no other manufacturer can claim, unless someone has managed to fit a MFT lens on a Canon or Sony. This gives you access to a very broad range of lenses that can be used.
Another advantage of the larger sensor is the fact you can make zooms out of prime lenses.
Native MFT lenses also offer the advantage that you have full functionality when it comes to OIS, aufofocus and iris controlled from the camera without the use of a adapter but their main disadvantage is that you lock yourself into a system that is not transferable to any other brand of camera, except Olympus, so when you start to invest in MFT glass you are locking yourself into that system, that's something to think about but it's no "compromise" whatsoever.

[B.J. Adams]

Noa, I fully agree with you. That's why the only choice for me was the LS300, as it allows flexibility in lenses at the budget I can afford.

I don't think MFT is a bad thing. For someone like me, who has 0 lenses, it's a good way to get 2-3 lenses to start working with, at an affordable cost. Personally i do not want to spend $800-1000 on an MFT though, I would prefer putting that investment in an EF lens that I can use in the future on other systems. but that will come in due course. For now, and from all the great info all you guys are providing, I will get a couple of MFT lenses to start off

[Noa Put]

Originally Posted by Duncan Craig

I did read that some people had softness issue with the 24mm when fully open but that it's very sharp with the iris closed slightly. I'm not sure if mine has this issue, I don't think I've filmed with it fully open.

I had the first generation Samyang lenses which did not have a declicked iris, only my 24mm was also a first gen cine lens with a declicked iris so it might be that Samyang has improved their glass in the meanwhile. I found their slightly softer look more appealing to look at but have to say I used it on a nex-ea50 which did not resolve nearly as much detail as my current camera's so that probably is one of the reasons why I see a bigger difference now. But even compared to my sony 18-200mm stocklens the Samyang lenses where visibly softer.

[Duncan Craig]

Noa. You must have had a bad example of a Samyang lens.
Their 'Cine' lenses seem to be considered as good as Zeiss Primes which are 8x the price.

All I know is that they look really good on my LS300, and certainly much sharper than my MFT zooms, as you would hope.

(My Sony 18-200 was much sharper than my Nikkor 18-200VR, but the Sony now seems almost faulty compared to my Panasonic pair)

[B.J. Adams]

Duncan you use MFT Samyangs or other mounts + adapter?

[Noa Put]

Originally Posted by Duncan Craig

Noa. You must have had a bad example of a Samyang lens.

When I used them with my Sony they where not bad examples, I even had a 12mm replacement where the irisblades would stick and that one would perform just the same, the only lens I had to compare to was my 18-200mm stocklens and that one was sharper then my Samyangs.
I have not had the chance to test them on my jvc though.

[Duncan Craig]

I bought them in Canon mount. That actually worked out a little cheaper for most of them.