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JVC GR-HD1U / JY-HD10U
All about the original single-CCD HDV camcorders from JVC.


 
 
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Old November 3rd, 2003, 05:06 PM   #1
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HD10's ONLY!!! Just the Good Stuff...

Since we have a new camera, most people are unfamiliar w/ it. We are a small few who have had not much time to learn this equipment. I would like to post the pro's and con's of the cam so everyone out there can stop complaining about the downfalls. ALL digital equipment has limitations.

So whats the best Mic (not the best way to get sound, so don't go there)? Best lighting setup? Best ND filter? Best lens? Best settings on the camera, that you've found? If it can't be done that way, what way can it be done? No DV posts. There are other forums for that. Every time we get into a good thread about this cam, some DV person comes in whinning about what it can't do. Lets focus on what it can do, and do well, the positive. It's ok to say what not to do w/ it, but this back and forth nonsense that people use to help themselves feel better about owning a DV cam doesn't belong here. I want to learn how to shoot great footage that I know this cameras capable of.

Here's my findings:

1. Nope, can't lock shutter or f. Just exposure by holding down the (exp) button, till you see the "L" anybody use the factory presets w/ exp. lock to get custom settings?

2. I can't figure out this color noise. I thought maybe if I over light and under expose, it could trick the cam. Didn't work. Seems I have to just light well and get custom in post. Does anyone out there have suggestions? I want to shoot with lots of shadows in the background (a warm look), but then I get color noise on the gradients on the walls, especially the off white everyone paints walls out here.

Footage w/ lots of colors in seems to look best to me, but can anyone create a warm at home look?

3. Any good use for the blc setting?
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Old November 3rd, 2003, 07:36 PM   #2
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Stephen, for what's it worth: the # 2 on your list: color noise is most profound NOT in the underexposed or overexposed areas.

Rather, it seems to propagate in "borderline" areas between light and dark pixel blocks.

See here:
http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16002&perpage=15&pagenumber=4

I don't have any solution except for shooting B&W :)
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Old November 3rd, 2003, 07:58 PM   #3
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Alex,

Are you saying that you should only use this camera if you are shooting in Black and White? If you shoot color, then you're only shooting option is too blast the lights and go for a low contrast image where there are no shadows. Then color correct and raise the contrast in post. Does this seem like a reasonable solution?
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Old November 3rd, 2003, 08:13 PM   #4
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<< Are you saying that you should only use this camera if you are shooting in Black and White?>>

No. But its B&W is really good.

<<< If you shoot color, then you're only shooting option is too blast the lights and go for a low contrast image where there are no shadows. Then color correct and raise the contrast in post. Does this seem like a reasonable solution?>>>


Not really.

The solution would be to upgrade for a different prosumer HD camera with reasonably low color noise when such thing is available.
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Old November 3rd, 2003, 08:17 PM   #5
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Hey hey guys, you might just be overreacting here. This chroma shift is (most of the time) unnoticeable when seen on good monitoring devices UNLESS you only look at the zone containing it. I had a lot of people look at footage I shot containing these noise at different levels and nobody noticed (of course no indie filmmakers in the lot...) and when I pointed the zones out they most often told me I was pushing and nobody but me would ever notice, and I am a nitpicker and I am criticising all the time (that sort of stuff, witch in this case was true). You can do great color images with this camera with or without the noise.
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Old November 4th, 2003, 01:18 AM   #6
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Thanks,

The color noise is not really a big deal to me, i just wonder why in some scenes it's very low and noticable in others. It seems if you use a gel and color the light delibrately it's better. a paint the image kind of approach.

This is a tricky cam, I'm not sure if the real issue is the contrast. I've seen very good contrast images from it, when care is taken before hand. Another good thing is that it doesn't seem to grain so much in low light, just get bad color noise. Maybe it's just the monitor??? TV seems great.

You can't get away w/ shooting B/W all the time, (unless your Quentin) thats pretty funny to have a $4k B/W camera :-) HDV is truly an entirely different beast.

Whats a good LAV? And, What about filters?
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Old November 9th, 2003, 08:28 PM   #7
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Stephen

<< Whats a good LAV? >>

See our Now Hear This forum for all things audio.

<< And, What about filters? >>

Covered frequently in our Photon Management forum and also in our Towards a Film Look with DV forum. Hope this helps,
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Old November 10th, 2003, 12:49 AM   #8
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<<<-- Originally posted by Stephen L. Minor : You can't get away w/ shooting B/W all the time, (unless your Quentin) thats pretty funny to have a $4k B/W camera :-) HDV is truly an entirely different beast. -->>>

The biggest problems with any kind of DV seem to be color rendition and latitude. Shooting B&W won't help with the latitude issue, but it completely removes the color rendition problem. At 720p it makes a really, really nice B&W camera, IMO.

Now if I only had a B&W project in the pipeline. ;-)

-Rob
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Old November 10th, 2003, 01:59 PM   #9
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Though I'm a big fan of black and white (my short film, PUSH/PULL, done on an XL-1/GL-1, was totally in B&W; my feature, SKYE FALLING, done on an XL-1, was half B&W), I didn't buy this camera to shoot on B&W.

I was thinking today about the reviews and tips I saw about the XL-1 nearly five years ago. They talked about color noise problems, pretty similar to what we talk about here. It's just a matter of knowing the strengths, weaknesses, limitations, etc., and using it to our adventure.

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Old November 10th, 2003, 02:24 PM   #10
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I don't remember how many times I compared it to the miniDV noise, namely the XL1 witch I use. Even in my preliminary test findings. The fact that miniDV is now an accepted format does not change the fact that chroma noise is very present. We got used to it, why not do the same with HDV?
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Old November 10th, 2003, 02:36 PM   #11
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Exactly! You're right, Eric, we work around it, not cop out and go to black and white. I like black and white, and I usually plan it ahead of time, or during post (if it feels better to go B&W), but, like I said, I didn't shell out $3200 to shoot only black and white.

We're planning on doing a documentary early next year about a unique part of Florida history. We want to use the HD10 (with a DAT, I promise--mostly just because I want a seperate way to record the audio) and I promise to keep a diary of how it's going, shooting-wise.

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