How about a shorts film contest with our HD10U at DVinfo.net

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Old July 10th, 2004, 09:35 PM   #1
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How about a shorts film contest with our HD10U

Guys, I have an idea, though I donít yet know how feasible it is or how to properly implement it. The idea is simply a HD10U short film contest. I think that if we can get a consensus among the willing members to submit to making a short, then we can each produce a five (or no more than ten) minute short. The idea is to demonstrate not just the proper use of the cam, but also real creativity in its use. We could give the contestants thee months to complete their respective films, and then upload them for group critique and discussion among us (judging format to be discussed). It seems like a fun way to generate a lively discussion and frankly to learn indie dv film making by actually doing. If the moderators of this forum and enough of the members are willing to do this, and if we can get space to accommodate about 30 or so submissions, then I think it is doable. The idea is to learn, share and have fun. To be sure there are technical details to be worked out such as costs, format, rating (I suggest keeping it to NC-17), etc., but that is also a part of the fun. I would appreciate any feedback on the idea (note I do not know if it has been suggest before, but even so, I am suggesting it now.)
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Old July 11th, 2004, 10:00 AM   #2
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How about getting JVC involved with some prize's!
I think they would love the exposure of a HD1/10 shorts contest.
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Old July 11th, 2004, 11:25 AM   #3
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I'd be into a contest...and I think IFC or some other cable network might be into running the winner. Who has connections?

Otherwise, we should offer our shorts to INHD and INHD2.

Murph
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Old July 11th, 2004, 11:51 AM   #4
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Great ideas! So let's see if we can't get organized around this notion. With the permission and help of the forum adms I would be willing to help organize the contest. We could appoint a committee of let's say 4-6 members to handle submissions, contact interested vendors, create ground rules, etc. And of course set a timeline for when the actual work must begin and end. I would think companies like Cineform, Lumiere, JVC, Ulead, Sony, Mainconcept, etc, would be interested in this idea. However, whether they are interested or not, I still think it's a good idea, and we should do it for the love of making films and what we can learn from each other by doing so.

Thanks

Dwight
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Old July 12th, 2004, 05:56 AM   #5
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Change of heart here..

If the powers that be want to setup a Short HD contest they should do it because we've started to produce without them. By that I mean what incentive do they have to do a contest when there ain't no HDV shorts online to watch! We can watch 1,000,000 DV films though.

Just my opinion, but let's post and talk about our films. This forum is great for tech talk, but stinks for comments on posted work. It might be because people are busy or whatever, but I'm busy and find time to post comments on videos I download. I posted my latest video, but almost no one commented on it. So, I'm kind of thinking that I don't want to waste my time now trying to help others who post their work. It stinks, but hey 100's of people from here downloaded my video and no one took 20 seconds to comment. I'm not seeing how working hard to help others showcase their work benefits everyone.

Let's the powers that be do it (magazines etc)...they get paid for it!

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Old July 12th, 2004, 09:26 AM   #6
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Murphy, I agree that the members (especially those with broadband) should try to support the endeavors of the individual members with helpful comments on their work. Along those lines I am suggesting is that we do just that. I don not know how many of the users here are actually trying to create content with their HD10U, but let's face it, many of us want to test our creativity with the cam and have it critiqued by our peers. I suggested a contest because I thought it would be a good and fun vehicle for the members to get into the habit of doing just that. In my view the word habit is the key. In my opinion we currently have the habit of sharing technical information (which is a good thing). It would be nice if we could get into the habit of sharing creative expressions (with the HD10U as the medium). God knows we are all busy, and for many of us filmmaking is a second or third job if not career. However, the fun aspect of being creative is why I am here. The technical stuff is just what I use to help me be creative. I am creating and trying to create fun content, Iíd do this whether I show them on this forum or not. However, I think we can all benefit from exposure to our individual creative use of the HD10U medium. But note, I do here you, we should have been more supportive. Myself being no exception.

Just a thought.
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Old July 12th, 2004, 09:35 AM   #7
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Well, I am supportive of your idea for sure. But, let's see who responds to this post you started...I'm betting you and I are it.

I don't know why excitement to see more HD content online isn't there. I'd love to see it everywhere....DV stinks compared to HD in my opinion. I've got a 4 day shoot in Canada starting tomorrow and I am shooting with a DSR-300...wish it were HD.

Murph
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Old July 12th, 2004, 08:33 PM   #8
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I'd figure the biggest hurdle for most HD10 users (including myself) would be the file sizes involved in uploading a full HD clip of any meaningful length....

While WMV9 offers HD resolutions to those of us with PCs, it doesn't appear to be stable enough yet to give total viewing support to everyone who would like to view HD material.

Besides this, the use of downconverted or highly compressed HD material gives a false impression that the HD10 can't deliver true HD footage. Not so good when so many downloads are from people wanting good footage to help them decide between purchasing 3 chip SD camcorders or the HD10. I've seen one of my WMV9 clips quoted elsewhere by a poster (who totally mis-read the accomanying information) as an example of RAW!!! HD footage!!!! After that episode, I have decided not to post any more clips until I've upgraded my connection & server allocation....

Also, most people when pressed, won't offer an opinion on something that they feel unqualified to pass judgement on. I too have noted the disproportionate number of downloads of my clips compared to responses......but, I felt that for those people with the brains & experience to understand what they were looking at, it was worth it.....so don't get discouraged!!!

Don't get me wrong however; I do think the HD short movie contest & Christopher's HD clip share 'pool' are worthy concepts....
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Old July 13th, 2004, 07:42 AM   #9
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Ok, so what I am hearing is that we have technical issues to overcome. I hear that, and my response is that such things are a part of the challenge and fun in making an HDV contest happen. So if we can realistically identify the technical challenges, I would like to hear some solutions.


Dwight
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Old July 13th, 2004, 08:44 AM   #10
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One solution is to downconvert to SD to save on bandwidth. Then, the final three will go full HDV resolution.

Or get a company involved as a sponsor by giving us bandwidth to host the site.

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Old July 13th, 2004, 08:50 AM   #11
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<<<-- Originally posted by Dwight Flynn : Ok, so what I am hearing is that we have technical issues to overcome. I hear that, and my response is that such things are a part of the challenge and fun in making an HDV contest happen. So if we can realistically identify the technical challenges, I would like to hear some solutions.


Dwight -->>>

The technical challenge is, as far as I can see; producing a 5 min. clip of a format compatible with a majority of operating systems and hardware, that can maintain a high enough bitrate to reduce artifacts, at the full 1280 x 720 30fps HD 16:9 resolution, while providing a small enough file size to make uploads/downloads fast enough that people won't just give up, and server hosting practical....

A 1 min. HD10 m2t/MPEG2 at 1280 x 720 30fps at the full data rate of 18300000 bps (which would be what those wanting to see how the camera performs before accepting it's viability) yields a file size of approx. 140meg. A 5 min. clip would be approx. 700meg!! Using WMV9 would reduce the file size for a 5 min. clip to around 70-80meg, with the playoff being increased artifacts due to the much reduced bit rate. I haven't had too many opportunities recently to check WMV9's streaming capabilities, but that would at least - if it works - make downloading heaps easier, which would solve one bottleneck.

The problem with WMV9 HD is the required processor speed, the lack of Mac playability noted on these boards and it's flakiness in playback on PC if the encoding isn't handled perfectly. Despite these current draw-backs, I believe WMV9 offers the only current HD delivery format capable enough for a contest of the type proposed. It may not suit everyone, but it's a lot closer to full viability than anything else out there at the moment on any platform....

BTW here's a link to a 2mbit WMV9 HD10 clip to see what I mean...
Just download:

Winter Magic Festival - Carrington path - with logo 2.wmv

from the link below:

http://www.pnc.com.au/~scris/hd_images/
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Old July 13th, 2004, 11:22 AM   #12
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Ok, if WMV9 is at least viable, if not perfect, then the next question is where can we get the bandwidth to host the event? After that we need to figure out a fair system for judging the contestants (i.e. technical skills with the cam, special fx (if any), overall creativity, sound, etc.), and of course determine who will be submitting work and how. If we can get this far, then we can consider things such as corporate sponsorship of prizes (or none at all, either way I am indifferent), and of course what if any limitations we should place on the film makers to ensure that the contest is done fairly.


Just some thoughts
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Old July 13th, 2004, 02:03 PM   #13
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I suggest finding a sponsor.

I'll ask my server dude.

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Old July 13th, 2004, 02:16 PM   #14
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I'll call JVC and some others. Is there any interest on the part of Cineform (David) or Lumiere, Sony, Bill Gates:-), etc? I am not asking for a definite commitment at this point, just an acknowledgement of interest.
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Old July 13th, 2004, 02:24 PM   #15
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Do you have contacts in JVC? I was planning on giving a call to some JVC people I've met in the past.

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