DTE options for component 720p from HD100? at DVinfo.net

Go Back   DV Info Net > JVC ProHD & MPEG2 Camera Systems > JVC GY-HD Series Camera Systems

JVC GY-HD Series Camera Systems
GY-HD 100 & 200 series ProHD HDV camcorders & decks.


Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old October 30th, 2007, 11:24 AM   #1
New Boot
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Toronto, ON, Canada
Posts: 16
DTE options for component 720p from HD100?

So, I'm wondering what the product options are for going direct-to-disk from the *component* output of an HD100? I already know about the IO HD and the thought of lugging around a big brick AND a laptop AND a hard drive does not seem like a plausible solution for most shooting scenarios I'll be in.

Essentially, I'd like to take advantage of the uncompressed output, but have a device that is truly portable, battery operated and has a built-in hard drive?

Any suggestions?

Thanks!

david.
David Fernandes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 30th, 2007, 12:18 PM   #2
Obstreperous Rex
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: San Marcos, TX
Posts: 26,900
Images: 513
"Uncompressed" and "truly portable" tend to be mutually exclusive terms. Not what you wanted to hear perhaps but that is indeed the case. If you stepped up to the HD250, you could take uncompressed HD in digital format from its SDI output (instead of analog from the component jacks) and record directly to something like Convergent Design's Flash XDR recorder (see our Industry News for details). In my opinion that's your best option for avoiding HDV compression.
__________________
CH

Search DV Info Net | DV Info Net Sponsors | A Decade (+5) of DVi | ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!
Chris Hurd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 30th, 2007, 01:39 PM   #3
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: santa fe, nm
Posts: 3,264
Images: 10
My own experience with alternative captures, at least with the HD110, is that you won't get any better than what you get over firewire (compression). The component outs on this cam have already passed thru a D-A engine and DO NOT represent raw CMOS data. While the internal A-D engine coming off the CMOS is 12 bit, I don't know what bit depth the successive D-A engine is for the component out ports. Perhaps the HG250 with it's HD-SDI output doesn't have this conversion scenario and will yield better results.
Bill Ravens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old October 31st, 2007, 02:23 PM   #4
Major Player
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 663
my mileage varies a bit from the last poster

The live output is 4:2:2 720/60p 10bit instead of 4:2:0 720/30p 8bit. And you don't have HDV MPEG2 artifacts. Yes, some D-A occurs, but that's better than D-A-D. In my experience, the uncompressed output looks significantly better. However, it's a lot of data to ingest into any system and is tailored for studio use (i.e. live passthru, not into an nle).

CMOS? Do you mean CCD?
__________________
software engineer
Jad Meouchy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2007, 08:15 AM   #5
Major Player
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Belgium
Posts: 497
Seems to be a bit of overkill, but the Codex Portable seems promising...

Otherwise the Wafian HR-1...

No compression artifacts anymore.
__________________
High-Definition Video Consultant - CEO of Delimex NV - http://www.delimex.be
gear of choice : http://www.wespgear.com
Werner Wesp is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 2nd, 2007, 08:35 AM   #6
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: santa fe, nm
Posts: 3,264
Images: 10
Jad...

yeppers...I'm too lazy to remember whether the sensor was CMOS or CCD. There are differences, but, for the purposes of this discussion, it doesn't really matter.

And, indeed, if one has the hardware support for passthru from the HD110 analog component ports, one might experience a slightly improved image. I'm afraid that capability is stratospheric stuff for many people, myself included.

I would be interested to know if the HD110 is capable of the same image quality as the HD250. I.E. comparing the HD250 HD-SDI output to an HD110 analog output, fed into a HD-SDI converter on a short leash. I beleive the JVC ad campaign made a point of the fact that while there is 10bit output at the component port of the HD110, the internal A-D was 12 bit.
Bill Ravens is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 4th, 2007, 10:35 PM   #7
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 868
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Ravens View Post
Jad...
I would be interested to know if the HD110 is capable of the same image quality as the HD250. I.E. comparing the HD250 HD-SDI output to an HD110 analog output, fed into a HD-SDI converter on a short leash. I beleive the JVC ad campaign made a point of the fact that while there is 10bit output at the component port of the HD110, the internal A-D was 12 bit.
At a guess the HD-SDI would have to e superior, and the component is better than an HDV recorded signal. Further to Chris's comment you could use a mini component to HD-SDI converter and then the XDR. You won't get uncompressed footage this way, but you will get 100Mb/s 4:2:2 MPEG2@HL. Convergent design makes both boxes.
John Mitchell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 9th, 2007, 08:45 PM   #8
New Boot
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Posts: 13
If not mistaken:

HD100 - 4:2:0 8bit thru composite
HD250 - 4:2:2 8bit thru HD-SDI

I don't think the JVC can deliver more than 8bit after it passes the DSP, so if you want the most "uncompressed" signal you would definitely have to go with the HD250 (HD-SDI) to get the most out of the color space and bitrate.

Please correct me if I'm wrong...
Federico Aragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 11th, 2007, 04:57 PM   #9
Contributor
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Sydney Australia
Posts: 868
Quote:
Originally Posted by Federico Aragon View Post
If not mistaken:

HD100 - 4:2:0 8bit thru composite
HD250 - 4:2:2 8bit thru HD-SDI

I don't think the JVC can deliver more than 8bit after it passes the DSP, so if you want the most "uncompressed" signal you would definitely have to go with the HD250 (HD-SDI) to get the most out of the color space and bitrate.

Please correct me if I'm wrong...
I'm pretty sure the HD100 is 8 bit 4:2:2 via component (not composite).
John Mitchell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 12th, 2007, 12:45 PM   #10
Trustee
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 1,063
You're right - 4:2:2 component only (ie - not through the firewire).

john
evilgeniusentertainment.com
John Vincent is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 23rd, 2008, 05:17 PM   #11
Trustee
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,268
A cheaper alternative would be to use Blackmagic Intensity Pro to capture uncompressed component. You could also use Cineform NeoHD to considerably reduce the storage needed and it would still look like uncompressed.
Michael Maier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old January 28th, 2008, 04:08 PM   #12
Regular Crew
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Paris
Posts: 72
why doesnt any manufacturer could build a kind if hard wired cineform recorder into a NLE ?
It would have a component, hdmi or hdsdi input, a realtime Cineform compression inside, some kind of 250GB sata disk alfa FireWire output ?!
it would definitely be a hundred time better than HDV, but a hundred time smaller than native HD ?
__________________
JVC HD200+redrock M2+1.4 lens+steadicam Flyer
mini35 weddings
Eric Ramahatra is offline   Reply
Reply

DV Info Net refers all where-to-buy and where-to-rent questions exclusively to these trusted full line dealers and rental houses...

Professional Video
(800) 833-4801
Portland, OR

B&H Photo Video
(866) 521-7381
New York, NY

Z.G.C.
(973) 335-4460
Mountain Lakes, NJ

Abel Cine Tech
(888) 700-4416
N.Y. NY & L.A. CA

Precision Camera
(800) 677-1023
Austin, TX

DV Info Net also encourages you to support local businesses and buy from an authorized dealer in your neighborhood.
  You are here: DV Info Net > JVC ProHD & MPEG2 Camera Systems > JVC GY-HD Series Camera Systems

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 



Google
 

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:06 PM.


DV Info Net -- Real Names, Real People, Real Info!
1998-2017 The Digital Video Information Network