GY-HD200U Focus Issue at DVinfo.net

Tim Kelley · December 4th, 2008, 11:54 AM

Just aquired a GY-HD200 U unit with a 17x5 Fujinon lens. I shoot in DV 4:3 as we haven't made the transition to HDV as of yet.
This is a very elementary question but...How does one focus with this unit/setup? Simply put...I zoom in, focus tight, pull out and everything is soft on dub out. It looks okay in the viewfinder and with Focus Assist on..everything is reading blue both tight and wide. I've checked the back focus adjustment and it seems set okay. I've tried this in both a low light setting, outdoor shoot, and studio setup. All three ways produce a soft output.
I'm using TC3 settings. The color and everything else seems fine. However, I can't get a true focused shot to save my life. I'm sure it's something I'm missing but I'm clueless at this point. Any suggestions of other items/ways of shooting/settings to try? Thanks.

Tim Dashwood · December 4th, 2008, 01:15 PM

If this is happening then it is likely your backfocus adjustment.

The only other thing that could cause this is an improper seating of the lens mount.
Follow the correct backfocus procedure again and if the problem persists then remove the lens, ensure the mount is clean and free of metal burrs and then re-mount and re-backfocus.

Shaun Roemich · December 4th, 2008, 03:56 PM

Make sure to use an external monitor for setting backfocus as the LCD doesn't have enough resolution to make an accurate call. I agonized over focus for the first two weeks I had mine, then set it up with an external HD monitor (I shoot 720P60 with mine) and everything became tack sharp.

Tim Kelley · December 5th, 2008, 07:43 AM

I've been told that this camera is WAY different than the Sony DSR-250 I had been using. However, I've got to thing that the camera/lens combo would allow (with adjustments) me to focus a shot and not have it look soft. Is that a safe assumption? I guess the main question is...should this camera react different and limit me in DV mode vs. HDV mode? I would think not as a camera can focus if setup properly...correct?
Would there be any internal settings that should be adjusted as well? I know the menus are deep and are close to factory settings.

Ted Ramasola · December 5th, 2008, 07:54 AM

Tim,

Fix your back focus well and have your detail setting at normal at first. That way from there you can adjust it to suit your taste. Most of us even found the camera "too sharp" out of the box and lowered our detail. Some even put it at MIN. In my case , since I use it with a lens adapter and the GG introduces diffusion, i only lowered it at -1 to compensate.

BUT FIRST get your back focus right. Use a large monitor and your focus assist to nail it.

A word of caution, make sure that your peaking is not high since this gives you an illusion that your shots are sharp. I recommend only a dash of peaking + focus assist to nail your shots. -again this is with the assumption that your backfocus is already set.

This Camera is really different from the sony, that has a fixed lens while the jvc has a professional form lens. Even the amount of tweaks in the menu that you can do with this camera is very professional. Do not be intimidated though, give time to learn this baby and this will give you great footage.

Ted

Tim Kelley · December 5th, 2008, 08:17 AM

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll run through all of them and see what comes out. I attribute some of this to the new setup but I can't think a sharp focus in DV, 4:3 mode isn't possible with this camera. I've been going crazy stepping through menus and setups. THanks again.

Shaun Roemich · December 5th, 2008, 09:20 AM

No offense Tim but stay out of the menus and set up the lens. The issue you've described is caused by ONLY one thing: back focus. If it's in focus at the tele end and soft at the wide end, it's back focus. Ted gave you the right idea around detail. Leave it at standard before setting up back focus.

As well, ensure you haven't accidentally engaged the macro function on the lens. The macro ring should be fully locked or else you'll never get focus throughout the zoom range.

Tim Kelley · December 5th, 2008, 09:25 AM

Shaun,

No offense taken. The only adjustments made in the menu are to setup the True Color 3 menu settings and adjust to 4:3 DV Mode. Otherwise, nothing else has been tweaked. Unfortunately, I've had my JVC rep. and another video professional in the area check the back focus as well and come up with the same results. I have the JVC rep. coming out again next week to take a look at it. Also, the macro is locked in place.
I had an outdoor press conference shoot earlier this week. Sunny day so lighting (or lack thereof) wasn't an issue. Shot it and through the view finder things looked okay after focus. However, in dub out (and viewing on monitor from composite out from camera), things looked a bit soft on the framed shots of the speakers. That was the last straw with regard to really starting to reach out for help. I've had (3) inside shoots and those brought the exact same results. I've put the camera to the side until I meet with the JVC rep. next week. We'll setup a studio-type setting and go through the paces as noted and see what shakes out. I'm expecting similiar results but keep hoping it's something as simple as the back focus. Thanks again.

Shaun Roemich · December 5th, 2008, 09:31 AM

Yup, that sounds like a legitimate problem. Please let us know how this gets resolved. And it sounds like you're in good hands if you've got the JVC reps involved.

Tim Kelley · December 5th, 2008, 10:18 AM

One other note as I wait for the JVC rep visit....here are the only changes made in the menu other than the bold notifications in the manual...some of these were done to get me to the TC-3 setting as well as some by the JVC rep during his initial visit...just making sure something here doesn't jump out to anyone...

CAMERA PROCESS
(menu 1/2)
Detail-Min
Skin Detect-On
(menu 2/2)
Knee-Manual (90%)

Advanced Process
Gamma-Cinema (Level -1)

Otherwise, things are the same other than going DV, 4:3.

Shaun Roemich · December 5th, 2008, 10:27 AM

Detail at Minimum will cause the image to go "soft" but not out-of-focus. If you're used to the edgy sharpness of Sony DVCams in "normal" configuration this MAY affect one's perception of in-focus.

Ted Ramasola · December 5th, 2008, 11:23 AM

Tim,

Shaun is right about that min setting. A friend of mine who has an HD100 always felt his lens was off. His back focus was also not set well and the perceived softness was exacerbated by min setting in detail.
As I suggested, bring it up to NORMAL first then set the backfocus. ALSO try not to set your iris at full OPEN and use anything below F2.8. full open on this particular fujinon tends to soften the image and introduce lateral CA.

I have the HD100 and HD200 to confirm my findings on this.

Ted

Tim Kelley · December 8th, 2008, 03:48 PM

Well...we have put the camera at NORMAL for detail and adjusted the black stretch a bit. It seems better but I have to field test it later this week to see. We tried a 250 model with an 18 lens and it was better. I tried using my eye rather than leaning on focus assist and that seemed a bit better. However, the field test will prove if it was a me thing or what. I'm not in a true news environment but rarely do I have the time to setup lighting and/or do much more than white balance and roll. We'll see if this settles down. Thanks again for all the help along the way. I'm hoping I'm seeing the "focus" at the end of the tunnel now! :)

Dennis Robinson · December 10th, 2008, 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Kelley

Well...we have put the camera at NORMAL for detail and adjusted the black stretch a bit. It seems better but I have to field test it later this week to see. We tried a 250 model with an 18 lens and it was better. I tried using my eye rather than leaning on focus assist and that seemed a bit better. However, the field test will prove if it was a me thing or what. I'm not in a true news environment but rarely do I have the time to setup lighting and/or do much more than white balance and roll. We'll see if this settles down. Thanks again for all the help along the way. I'm hoping I'm seeing the "focus" at the end of the tunnel now! :)

Hi Tim,
At this stage i would take it back. There is something wrong as this camera will give you excellent results.

Akbar Ukani · December 10th, 2008, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Kelley

Just aquired a GY-HD200 U unit with a 17x5 Fujinon lens. I shoot in DV 4:3 as we haven't made the transition to HDV as of yet.
This is a very elementary question but...How does one focus with this unit/setup? Simply put...I zoom in, focus tight, pull out and everything is soft on dub out. It looks okay in the viewfinder and with Focus Assist on..everything is reading blue both tight and wide. I've checked the back focus adjustment and it seems set okay. I've tried this in both a low light setting, outdoor shoot, and studio setup. All three ways produce a soft output.
I'm using TC3 settings. The color and everything else seems fine. However, I can't get a true focused shot to save my life. I'm sure it's something I'm missing but I'm clueless at this point. Any suggestions of other items/ways of shooting/settings to try? Thanks.

I had the same problem..Do this...

- Hold the camera so that the smart side is facing you (where you see all the controls)
- On the lens you'll notice the word "Macro" with 2 vertical lines
- Right below the lines, there will be a little screw or knob
- Make sure that the two vertical lines are not off...they should be aligned with each other.
- If they are off, then loosen the screw and align them....also make sure that the Macro is not turned on

Hope this helps...I learned this the hard way!!

December 4th, 2008, 11:54 AM	#1
Tim Kelley Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 27	GY-HD200U Focus Issue Just aquired a GY-HD200 U unit with a 17x5 Fujinon lens. I shoot in DV 4:3 as we haven't made the transition to HDV as of yet. This is a very elementary question but...How does one focus with this unit/setup? Simply put...I zoom in, focus tight, pull out and everything is soft on dub out. It looks okay in the viewfinder and with Focus Assist on..everything is reading blue both tight and wide. I've checked the back focus adjustment and it seems set okay. I've tried this in both a low light setting, outdoor shoot, and studio setup. All three ways produce a soft output. I'm using TC3 settings. The color and everything else seems fine. However, I can't get a true focused shot to save my life. I'm sure it's something I'm missing but I'm clueless at this point. Any suggestions of other items/ways of shooting/settings to try? Thanks.

December 4th, 2008, 01:15 PM	#2
Tim Dashwood Wrangler Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Posts: 3,637	If this is happening then it is likely your backfocus adjustment. The only other thing that could cause this is an improper seating of the lens mount. Follow the correct backfocus procedure again and if the problem persists then remove the lens, ensure the mount is clean and free of metal burrs and then re-mount and re-backfocus. __________________ Tim Dashwood

December 4th, 2008, 03:56 PM	#3
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Make sure to use an external monitor for setting backfocus as the LCD doesn't have enough resolution to make an accurate call. I agonized over focus for the first two weeks I had mine, then set it up with an external HD monitor (I shoot 720P60 with mine) and everything became tack sharp. __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

December 5th, 2008, 07:54 AM	#5
Ted Ramasola Trustee Join Date: May 2005 Location: Allen, Texas U.S.A Posts: 1,117	Tim, Fix your back focus well and have your detail setting at normal at first. That way from there you can adjust it to suit your taste. Most of us even found the camera "too sharp" out of the box and lowered our detail. Some even put it at MIN. In my case , since I use it with a lens adapter and the GG introduces diffusion, i only lowered it at -1 to compensate. BUT FIRST get your back focus right. Use a large monitor and your focus assist to nail it. A word of caution, make sure that your peaking is not high since this gives you an illusion that your shots are sharp. I recommend only a dash of peaking + focus assist to nail your shots. -again this is with the assumption that your backfocus is already set. This Camera is really different from the sony, that has a fixed lens while the jvc has a professional form lens. Even the amount of tweaks in the menu that you can do with this camera is very professional. Do not be intimidated though, give time to learn this baby and this will give you great footage. Ted Last edited by Ted Ramasola; December 5th, 2008 at 08:01 AM. Reason: added text

December 5th, 2008, 09:20 AM	#7
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	No offense Tim but stay out of the menus and set up the lens. The issue you've described is caused by ONLY one thing: back focus. If it's in focus at the tele end and soft at the wide end, it's back focus. Ted gave you the right idea around detail. Leave it at standard before setting up back focus. As well, ensure you haven't accidentally engaged the macro function on the lens. The macro ring should be fully locked or else you'll never get focus throughout the zoom range. __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

December 5th, 2008, 07:43 AM	#4
Tim Kelley Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 27	I've been told that this camera is WAY different than the Sony DSR-250 I had been using. However, I've got to thing that the camera/lens combo would allow (with adjustments) me to focus a shot and not have it look soft. Is that a safe assumption? I guess the main question is...should this camera react different and limit me in DV mode vs. HDV mode? I would think not as a camera can focus if setup properly...correct? Would there be any internal settings that should be adjusted as well? I know the menus are deep and are close to factory settings.

December 5th, 2008, 08:17 AM	#6
Tim Kelley Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 27	Thanks for the suggestions. I'll run through all of them and see what comes out. I attribute some of this to the new setup but I can't think a sharp focus in DV, 4:3 mode isn't possible with this camera. I've been going crazy stepping through menus and setups. THanks again.

December 5th, 2008, 09:25 AM	#8
Tim Kelley Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 27	Shaun, No offense taken. The only adjustments made in the menu are to setup the True Color 3 menu settings and adjust to 4:3 DV Mode. Otherwise, nothing else has been tweaked. Unfortunately, I've had my JVC rep. and another video professional in the area check the back focus as well and come up with the same results. I have the JVC rep. coming out again next week to take a look at it. Also, the macro is locked in place. I had an outdoor press conference shoot earlier this week. Sunny day so lighting (or lack thereof) wasn't an issue. Shot it and through the view finder things looked okay after focus. However, in dub out (and viewing on monitor from composite out from camera), things looked a bit soft on the framed shots of the speakers. That was the last straw with regard to really starting to reach out for help. I've had (3) inside shoots and those brought the exact same results. I've put the camera to the side until I meet with the JVC rep. next week. We'll setup a studio-type setting and go through the paces as noted and see what shakes out. I'm expecting similiar results but keep hoping it's something as simple as the back focus. Thanks again.

December 5th, 2008, 09:31 AM	#9
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Yup, that sounds like a legitimate problem. Please let us know how this gets resolved. And it sounds like you're in good hands if you've got the JVC reps involved. __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

December 5th, 2008, 10:18 AM	#10
Tim Kelley Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 27	One other note as I wait for the JVC rep visit....here are the only changes made in the menu other than the bold notifications in the manual...some of these were done to get me to the TC-3 setting as well as some by the JVC rep during his initial visit...just making sure something here doesn't jump out to anyone... CAMERA PROCESS (menu 1/2) Detail-Min Skin Detect-On (menu 2/2) Knee-Manual (90%) Advanced Process Gamma-Cinema (Level -1) Otherwise, things are the same other than going DV, 4:3.

December 5th, 2008, 10:27 AM	#11
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Detail at Minimum will cause the image to go "soft" but not out-of-focus. If you're used to the edgy sharpness of Sony DVCams in "normal" configuration this MAY affect one's perception of in-focus. __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

December 5th, 2008, 11:23 AM	#12
Ted Ramasola Trustee Join Date: May 2005 Location: Allen, Texas U.S.A Posts: 1,117	Tim, Shaun is right about that min setting. A friend of mine who has an HD100 always felt his lens was off. His back focus was also not set well and the perceived softness was exacerbated by min setting in detail. As I suggested, bring it up to NORMAL first then set the backfocus. ALSO try not to set your iris at full OPEN and use anything below F2.8. full open on this particular fujinon tends to soften the image and introduce lateral CA. I have the HD100 and HD200 to confirm my findings on this. Ted

December 8th, 2008, 03:48 PM	#13
Tim Kelley Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Suffolk, VA Posts: 27	Well...we have put the camera at NORMAL for detail and adjusted the black stretch a bit. It seems better but I have to field test it later this week to see. We tried a 250 model with an 18 lens and it was better. I tried using my eye rather than leaning on focus assist and that seemed a bit better. However, the field test will prove if it was a me thing or what. I'm not in a true news environment but rarely do I have the time to setup lighting and/or do much more than white balance and roll. We'll see if this settles down. Thanks again for all the help along the way. I'm hoping I'm seeing the "focus" at the end of the tunnel now! :)