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Old December 21st, 2008, 07:27 AM   #16
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Location: Perth, Australia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Harbor View Post
Hi Dennis

Can you give me a quick rundown on how you mean.....
I know I will have to go through the motions, but info from someone who has been there will give me a huge start......
and you say the 13x is that good........how much did you pay here in Oz mate?

John
Hi John,
The 13x is around $7500. When I first bought my camera it was $16,800. It is amazing and when i upgrade the camera I will sell it with no problem.
You need to understand that you can not pan like you used to. All pans must be slow and keep the action in the frame. You must track the subject and with the wide lens I rarely need to pan anyway now as I can get it all in the shot. You must set up the shot with the subject moving toward or away from the camera and this avoids the judder you are seeing. Just watch a movie and you will notice the way the camera tracks the people eg. in the scene. When they turn a corner, the camera dollies or tracks with them. The background becomes juddery but the subject remains sharp and clear. You will notice that the camera is always set up so the people are always walking toward or away from the camera. If they are sitting down, the camera moves with them etc. It takes a lot of getting used to and you have to plan the shot rather than just waving the camera in the air. After a while the shooting style becomes second nature and creates a beautiful look. I now laugh when i think of the times I wanted to send the camera back. Now i only shoot progressive. Hope that helps.
Feel free to see my web site and you can call me from there if you want.
Video Production - Internet Video
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Old December 21st, 2008, 07:41 AM   #17
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Thanks mate !

I am probably stressing over nothing haha, its a fair bit different though to shooting my normal DigiBeta or DVCpro50 stuff.
I will no doubt learn to be a better cameraman though in the end

John
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Old December 21st, 2008, 07:48 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by John Harbor View Post
Thanks mate !

I am probably stressing over nothing haha, its a fair bit different though to shooting my normal DigiBeta or DVCpro50 stuff.
I will no doubt learn to be a better cameraman though in the end

John
Of course. Thats what its all about. I do this for a living otherwise it wouldn't matter. As I say, feel free to call if you want. I work 18 hours a day every day.
Dennis
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Old December 21st, 2008, 07:54 AM   #19
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Thanks Dennis, I will get a bit in the can and see what it all looks like.
18 hours , boy I know that feeling........I own an outside broadcast company and do around 600 odd OB jobs a year....keeps me up at night too !!.
I had a look at your site....nice stuff.

Anyway, thanks again, and if I run into probs, I will give you a call.

cheers
John
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Old December 21st, 2008, 11:00 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by John Harbor
I really don't like the jittery motion on a pan, even when done slow shooting 720p/25 @ 250th shutter.
I like the look very much more at 720p/50 , but only the 200U will do it.....not my second camera, a 111E
I think some footage will come from both camera's..........what to do ???
Or am I doing something wrong...... everyone says they shoot most of their stuff at 25, but how do you get rid of the jitters as much as possible ? and get a smoother look like seen at 50 ?
Hi John.

I got your email with regards to how I achieved "flicker-free" 24p or 25p footage and I want to address it here in your thread because this question comes up quite a bit.

My background is rooted in film so I think in those terms: 24fps, standard 180 shutter angle, and a "feel" for appropriate tilt/panning speeds. For the smoothest results at 24fps or 25fps stick with the 180 shutter (1/48th or 1/50th shutter.) Less exposure time per frame (1/250th as you were using) will shorten the motion blur and give the unnatural "strobe" effect of Saving Private Ryan/Gladiator.

However, I think that most of the perceived "judder" with 24P HD footage is actually a result of type and refresh rate of your display. You can watch the exact same 24P footage on a CRT monitor, LCD computer display or large screen front projection and see different "judder" results.
So which one will be the best and which will be the worst?

The best will be projection. Why? Probably because of persistence of vision with a white screen. I screen ProHD 720p24 originated material on JVC DiLA projectors all the time and it "feels" like a film print, just with less flicker.

The second best will be CRT. CRT screens, regardless of what types of signals they can accommodate, are still interlaced. Our brains have always perceived interlace CRT as smooth with no hard transitions. In NTSC 24fps sources are converted to NTSC 60i using a 2:3 pulldown. A film shot at 24fps still feels like 24fps but there are fewer "complete" frames being shown on-screen and our brains can easily keep up because of the interlace scanning. In PAL 25P is transmitted as 50i which also helps the brain with the transition from frame to frame.

What about LCD or Plasma? Well there are a wide range of LCD displays out there and I feel like most of the ones currently found in people's homes are a technological step backwards from the CRT displays they have replaced. LCD/Plasma displays are progressive by design but vary widely in their refresh rates/response time. The best ones out there can do 120Hz refresh rate which will minimize streaking and properly portray the natural motion of progressive footage.
Plasma is typically better at this than LCD (I highly recommend the Z800 series of Panasonic plasma displays) but LCD technology gets better and better year after year.

That's all for now. I have to go shovel some more snow...again!
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Old December 21st, 2008, 04:03 PM   #21
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haha , thanks Tim......Shovel Snow !! haha, I have to put on some more suntan oil !!

Yeah, I think more than anything , I am suffering from "1st reel panic syndrome".
its a new job I am taking on shooting these 2, 1 hour specials, and then 13 normal episodes, and I really want to nail it.
For me its a totally new way to shoot, and it all seems a bit different, but I will learn.
I do however have the fortune to be going on a 4x4 trip for 3 weeks in Jan, coming back 4 days before we start the shoot, so the HD cam will be riding shotgun so I can shoot a bit to get my way of thinking around the new format......

Thanks for all your help guys, it will definately give me more confidence knowing it can be done.

cheers and have a fantastic Christmas everyone

John
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