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Old November 5th, 2005, 12:01 PM   #1
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About to choose HD-100, will it make me happy?

After weeks of thinking I am about to choose a HD-100 camera with some additional accessories and need your opinion to our situation and the wishlist.

I work at a large, international company at the communications department. Last year we started doing our own video (I have some background in this field so I was the choosen one for this... hmmm)

Until now we have been shooting with a budget-friendly Canon XM2 (also known as GL2). We mainly do internal events, videos for internal communication and a few corporate videos for external use. Of course for a couple of videos we bring in a production company, we don't want to do everything ourselves!

On average I make one video every 2 weeks. Mostly in the range of 2 ~ 5 minutes. Output is always internet (wmv, mpg), PC and DVD.

At this moment I want to push our efforts to a more professional level, faster production times, more productions, possibility of 16:9, HDV for PC play-back, a stable shoulder-cam and a much much better film-like picture-quality. So the consumer cam has to go I'm afraid.

I have been working hard to convince the bosses that we can get better result with more professional equipment and that it is worth the investment. I don't have the final go yet and I know the budget will have a limit.

So here is my wishlist:
- JVC GY-HD100
- IDX accuset (2x accu + charger)
- IDX tally light
- R-HD100-80 (question: anybody knows how to attach this one to the camera? Any pictures somewhere?)
- WCV-82SC wide angle adapter
- PortaBrace bag

We already have tripods, light-equipment and an array of microphones.

Questions are:
- are these the necessery accessories?
- what is really missing here?
- the IDX looks good and is available over here, is it a good battery solution?
- anyone has experience with the hard disk solution?
- JVC is not about to announce an improved model within the next few weeks? (I hate when that happens)
- but the big question: will this make me and our company happy?


Thanks a lot for your time,
Erwin
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Old November 5th, 2005, 01:19 PM   #2
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Quote:
but the big question: will this make me and our company happy?
Whether it'll "make you happy" is a question only you can answer. Some people are delighted with their HD100's, others have returned them. I would strongly suggest you make time and visit the dealer and get some hands-on time with the unit before purchasing.

Quote:
JVC is not about to announce an improved model within the next few weeks? (I hate when that happens)
Bob Mueller, chief operating officer of JVC, has stated that the HD100 is a mature product and no successor/replacement is envisioned at this time.
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Old November 5th, 2005, 04:49 PM   #3
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Thanks for your reply.

Yep, I will definately pay a visit to the dealer to get hands-on time and feel the camera.

And the part about being happy, well... of course it is only a camera after all and when my customers are happy with the final result, then I will be happy too.


Regards,
Erwin
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Old November 5th, 2005, 05:51 PM   #4
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Is it really necessary to have HDV?
This isn't an attack, but you pay a price more for it, and you say it's only for playback on a PC?
Doesn't SD then suffice? an XL2 or a DVX100a or something?
I'm just curious, a HD100 seems to me like a little bit of overkill if it's just for playback on a PC.

But as Barry too said, go to the shop and try them out.
The cam that feels right in your hands is the cam for you (well, you also have to think about budget of course ;-) everyone can say a Varicam feels right in his hands ;-))
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Old November 5th, 2005, 09:17 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Mathieu Ghekiere
Is it really necessary to have HDV?
Since you are in a PAL world I would suggest the Sony HC1. For web work, CF25 is fine and not to be confused with the terrible CF24.

You can take 3MB stills for the web.

For PAL DVDs you can shoot 1080i50.

And, at least in the usa its really cheap -- under 1700.
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Old November 6th, 2005, 04:29 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by Steve Mullen
And, at least in the usa its really cheap -- under 1700.
Welcome to Euroland, where we add several hundreds of dollars (euro's) without solid reason ;)
I think prices here vary around 2000 euro.
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Old November 6th, 2005, 05:05 AM   #7
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Robin is right.
Prices here are downright terrible.
an example the Canon Xl2:

The Pal version at BH:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/cont...goryNavigation

3800 dollars.

One of the cheapest (but reliable) places in Belgium:
http://www.pixmania.be/be/nl/56682/a...er-pro-xl.html

4441 euros.

dollar and euro now: 4441 x 1.18 = 5240 dollars. For the same camera in a different country.
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Old November 6th, 2005, 07:47 AM   #8
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I have a slightly different perspective. An HD100 is hands down the cheapest option for a shoulder mount camera with a manual lens. Whether it is HDV or SD - and the camera shoots both.

I would be more concerned about whether the camera will perform at a low enough light level for your intended purpose - depends if you are shooting in darkened rooms a lot without much subject light - which can happen in things like PPt presentations. The other SD option you could look at is the XL2 - it's a workhorse with reasonably priced lens options, and there will probably be a lot of them coming up for sale second hand.

I think the lens on the front of the HC1 may disappoint - not that it's a bad lens but at only 10x you're going to struggle to get those close ups from the back of a theatre etc - however this is a great little cam for the price. It really does come down to a value judgement of what you have to shoot as much as where it ends up.
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Old November 6th, 2005, 09:55 PM   #9
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About to choose HD-100, will it make me happy?

True happiness comes only from within.
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Old November 6th, 2005, 10:02 PM   #10
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We have two GY-HD100's and are really excited about the possibilities. Coming from BetacamSP for the last 14 years, these cameras are really a nice transition. Everything is very similar to ENG EFP cameras.

One thing many people neglect to think about though, is: will you deliver in HD or SD? How will you show HD content to your audience? If your plan is to shoot 16:9 and deliver downconverted letterboxed or pillarboxed 4:3 SD, have you considered the time and disk space considerations in this conversion process? For us, it's a real consideration. All of our delivery is NTSC. I've been really thinking about how I can best use the higher resolution frames of the HD100 when converting to NTSC and achieve a telecined 16 look and accomplish a 16mm film like image. We have spent 10s of thousands each year on SRIII rentals. If we can produce a similar look with this system, it's a no brainer.

For us, it comes down to capturing in HDV and then downconverting to NTSC in software or using the downconversion in the HDV deck or Kona LH capture boards we have. (using analog component output of the deck). Whether to post in HD and then downconvert or do it before we post. It's virgin ground for our company.

As a camera system, I think the Anton or IDX battery system in a must.

Dave B
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Old November 6th, 2005, 10:19 PM   #11
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Dave,
My suggestion for your NTSC delivery is to shoot HDV but edit in downconverted SD (downconver from the deck). Letterboxing is a matter of software (FCP, Avid, etc.), i.e. if you are using Avid and have a Mojo it's a real-time process.
I have been editing on a Discovery series all summer and that's what we do with footage shot in HDV on Z1U (the main camera is XDCAM). Works fine and looks very well.
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Old November 6th, 2005, 10:20 PM   #12
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Last edited by Jiri Bakala; November 6th, 2005 at 10:22 PM. Reason: Duplicate by mistake
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Old November 7th, 2005, 12:51 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Jackman
About to choose HD-100, will it make me happy?

True happiness comes only from within.
Nice one :-)
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Old November 7th, 2005, 01:52 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Beaty
One thing many people neglect to think about though, is: will you deliver in HD or SD? How will you show HD content to your audience? If your plan is to shoot 16:9 and deliver downconverted letterboxed or pillarboxed 4:3 SD, have you considered the time and disk space considerations in this conversion process? For us, it's a real consideration. All of our delivery is NTSC.
For us, it comes down to capturing in HDV and then downconverting to NTSC in software or using the downconversion in the HDV deck or Kona LH capture boards we have.
If you protect for 4:3 you don't have to worry. Shoot HDV. DO NOT DOWN CONVERT. Edit HDV. Now you take a center-cut in FCP for NTSC. But you've also got an HD version. Simply export the HDV timeline to a red laser disk. It will play in the new $350 JVCHD DVD player.

If your NTSC audience will accept letterbox, you don't even need to protect for 4:3 -- just shoot and LB in FCP when you have edited the HDV production.

Unless you are shooting 24p there's no reason to use a Kona or DeckLink. Capture and edit HDV just like DV. 8 streams in RT is possible.
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Old November 7th, 2005, 08:23 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Steve Mullen
If you protect for 4:3 you don't have to worry. Shoot HDV. DO NOT DOWN CONVERT. Edit HDV. Now you take a center-cut in FCP for NTSC.
Shooting in HD is definitely good advice, but simply centering your shot is not always going to translate to the framing you want for a possible HD production. Rather than protect for a center shot, I would frame for an HD presentation, then use After Effects or whatever NLE tool you may have to pan and scan your image for SD output.
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