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Old July 5th, 2006, 08:23 PM   #16
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Tom, that's exactly what I've been saying to SM for months. They lose business every day. The Mac version, or lack of it, is one of the most debated topics in their forum. One day a competitor will take the opportunity, fill the void and take the whole business away from them. It happened before.
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Old July 5th, 2006, 10:17 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Paolo Ciccone
Ram, I second what Marc C. just said: the main reason I bought DVRack was to have my own portable calibrated monitor with WFM and VScope integrated. Now that 709 colorspace is fully supported, it's the easieast way of checking your camera on the field. I compared the colors from my $900.00 HP Laptop running DVRack, against a $3500 Sony monitor and, except for the screen size, they were the same.
There's got to be a catch to this. Aside from the size, surely a real monitor can do things a laptop and hdvrack cannot?
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Old July 5th, 2006, 10:56 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by Brian Luce
There's got to be a catch to this. Aside from the size, surely a real monitor can do things a laptop and hdvrack cannot?
Yes, a monitor has more inputs. You cannot use DVRack with Component input or SDI. Also, some monitors are defintely bigger than the largest 17" laptop... and some are smaller. Other than that DVRack is a very nice solution. keep in mind that there are limita to the length of Firewire cables and the FW connector is not even comparable to BNC or even RCA connectors as solidity goes. That is a majore problem if the camera is remote or on a crane, for example.
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Old July 6th, 2006, 12:10 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paolo Ciccone
Yes, a monitor has more inputs. You cannot use DVRack with Component input or SDI. Also, some monitors are defintely bigger than the largest 17" laptop... and some are smaller. Other than that DVRack is a very nice solution. keep in mind that there are limita to the length of Firewire cables and the FW connector is not even comparable to BNC or even RCA connectors as solidity goes. That is a majore problem if the camera is remote or on a crane, for example.

Curious. How far can you run a firewire cable before it looses it's signal strength and won't work properly with DVRACK or similar program? In most instances the dp's monitor is a good distance from the camera.
Is there such thing as a firewire repeater or something that will re-strengthen the signal.
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Old July 6th, 2006, 02:04 AM   #20
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Michael:
I use(d) a 20 meter FireWire cable on DV rack. Unfortunally this cable doesn't work when I use HDV mode. DV mode is fine. The reason I don't know yet.
I will be testing boosters in the future to see if that helps.

Paolo:
I second your statement that things are changing on the Mac front for accelerated graphics. I'm not saying Mac is not developing new features, but still there is a big gap between the Mac and PC based systems.
The reason is simple: an XP based platfom benefits with all these advanced DirectX simply because the game market is the driving force behind all these hardware accelerated features. I'm not speaking for Serious Magic, but I can only comment on our own experience with the features we needed for our project. Without this available 2d/3d horsepower, it would take us many years to try to achive the same features on a Mac based system. And concering stability, we are very happy with it. This year we did the Eurovision Song Contest with it with 20 systems. (Video floor and stairs on stage)
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Old July 6th, 2006, 10:24 AM   #21
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The reason is simple: an XP based platfom benefits with all these advanced DirectX simply because the game market is the driving force behind all these hardware accelerated features.
Marc, you got a point there, game development is sorely behind in the Mac platform, although, the debate about OpenGL/DirectX, when talking games, brings up the classic argument by John Carmak about his decision to use OpenGL for the Quake engine.
Also keep in mind that some OpenGL implementations on Windows used to be done on top of DirectX, hardly the right approach and the reason why, sometimes, OpenGL seemed slower than DirectX.
Anyway, I want to be clear that my criticism wasn't direct toward you or your programming effort, I expect multi-platform development from commercial, shrink-wrapped products that want to appeal to the creative market. Your situation is different.
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Old July 6th, 2006, 10:27 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Michael Totten
Curious. How far can you run a firewire cable before it looses it's signal strength and won't work properly with DVRACK or similar program? In most instances the dp's monitor is a good distance from the camera.
Is there such thing as a firewire repeater or something that will re-strengthen the signal
I think about 15-20 feet. Marc, 20 meters is about 65 feet, no surprise that the signal doesn't work. And, yes, there are repeaters but it's hard to find good ones. Also, a machine with a FW card acts as a repeater. In other words, you can have a cable going form the camera to a laptop with multiple FW ports. Then a cable that goes from that laptop to the one with DVRack. It works and you don't need to run anything special. Just plug and play.
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Old July 8th, 2006, 09:35 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Paolo Ciccone
I think about 15-20 feet. Marc, 20 meters is about 65 feet, no surprise that the signal doesn't work. And, yes, there are repeaters but it's hard to find good ones. Also, a machine with a FW card acts as a repeater. In other words, you can have a cable going form the camera to a laptop with multiple FW ports. Then a cable that goes from that laptop to the one with DVRack. It works and you don't need to run anything special. Just plug and play.

Thanks guys. I appreciate the information. Another question just slightly off subject.... but sort of in the same vein as dvrack. I'm two days away from laying out a bunch of money for a HVX package. I've budgeted for an external (on camera) monitor. Originally I was planning on the Marshall VR70-P, but after learning that it's resolution isn't "native hd" I decided to take a closer look at the Panasonic BT-LH900. So far I've gotten great reports about the Panasonic.... which is encouraging. Granted the Panasonic is much more expensive than the Marshall, however it does offer much more: such as a waveform monitor. My question is: Do you think the waveform monitor on the Panasonic BT-LH900 would in a way replace/lessen the need for HDV/DV Rack?? For me one of the big advantages to HDV/DV rack was: 1. The waveform monitor
2. Being able to use the high resolution of a computer monitor for accurate focus.

It seems as if the Panny HD LCD will do this. It's got a waveform, true HD resoution as well as a on board focus assist.

Interested to hear your thoughts.
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Old July 9th, 2006, 06:34 AM   #24
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Hi Michael

I haven't seen the Marshall in action but I have seen the Panasonic and it is truly awesome - but it ought to be, given the price. I think that the Panasonic's built in WFM doesn't really replace HDV rack completely (and don't forget the screen is pretty small) but what is does is give you the option to have decent monitoring and a WFM in the field in situations where you could never drag around a laptop - documentary field work, for example. It's getting a little cumbersome, but you COULD actually attach the Pana to the camera and use that combo in a solo run and gun situation. Try that with a laptop!

I reckon the Panasonic - great as it is - carries a cost totally out of proportion to the camera, so I won't be investing in it. I'm going to invest in a tiny WFM mounted on the camera.
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Old July 9th, 2006, 09:03 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Antony Michael Wilson
Hi Michael

I haven't seen the Marshall in action but I have seen the Panasonic and it is truly awesome - but it ought to be, given the price. I think that the Panasonic's built in WFM doesn't really replace HDV rack completely (and don't forget the screen is pretty small) but what is does is give you the option to have decent monitoring and a WFM in the field in situations where you could never drag around a laptop - documentary field work, for example. It's getting a little cumbersome, but you COULD actually attach the Pana to the camera and use that combo in a solo run and gun situation. Try that with a laptop!

I reckon the Panasonic - great as it is - carries a cost totally out of proportion to the camera, so I won't be investing in it. I'm going to invest in a tiny WFM mounted on the camera.
Yes it is awesome... and I agree it is sort of out of proportion in respect to the camera. I've been struggling with that fact.

I'm looking at the HVX as a "stop gap" camera of about 18 months give or take a few months. At that time I plan on upgrading hopefully to a 2/3" camera or perhaps RED (if it's a viable at that time). I'm counting on the two "out of proportion" items I'm getting with this package being around for that upgrade. So I'm looking at them as more of a long term investment that will fit nicely with my future camera.
1. Panasonic Monitor
2. Cartoni Gamma Tripod

Both of these items are almost as much as the HVX itself.
Does this make sense?
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Old July 10th, 2006, 06:40 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Paolo Ciccone
I think about 15-20 feet. Marc, 20 meters is about 65 feet, no surprise that the signal doesn't work.
The cable I used has special shielding. They use a lot in fixed installations for connecting security cameras with firewire output. In DV mode it did work flawlessy in DV rack. In HDV mode it does not work anymore which is a pitty.
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Old July 18th, 2006, 08:06 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paolo Ciccone
Ram, I second what Marc C. just said: the main reason I bought DVRack was to have my own portable calibrated monitor with WFM and VScope integrated. Now that 709 colorspace is fully supported, it's the easieast way of checking your camera on the field. I compared the colors from my $900.00 HP Laptop running DVRack, against a $3500 Sony monitor and, except for the screen size, they were the same.
hI PAolo.

what are the specs on the laptop you're using with hdv rack? I think i'll take that route. seems like a good compromise solution. What is the resolution on your laptop's screen?

thanks.
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Old August 1st, 2006, 12:03 PM   #28
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I just downloaded the free trial of dvrack to try again on my MacBookPro with WindowsXP running under Parallels.
However it looks like it is still the same old demo version as before (2006.02.14), not version 1.2, which I couldn't get to work properly with the HD100 on my Macbook or on a HP laptop when I tried last month.

The first time I ran the app on the HP 3Ghz laptop it booted and I had control over the different functions, but I could never get a signal from the HD100 (720P24 mode BTW.)

Then I exited, tried again and this message appeared: DV Rack has encountered a problem and needs to close. We are sorry for the inconvenience.

Has anyone else encountered this error? Why can't Windows just tell me what the problem is?
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Old August 1st, 2006, 12:24 PM   #29
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So I just "uninstalled" DVrack Trial and then attempted to re-install it and it tells me it is out-of-date - even though this was the version linked in the email that Serious Magic sent me! Weird.

Does the 1.2 updater work on the trial version?
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Old August 2nd, 2006, 05:21 AM   #30
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Tim, how is your configuration? Are you running Windows on your Intel Mac computer?
On a PC to be able to run DVrack properly is to have the right DirectX 9.0c installation. With a tool DXDiag one can check the right settings and installation.
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