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Old September 11th, 2006, 04:15 PM   #1
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Time Code breaks on tape

I had an interesting situation this weekend.

One shoot on Saturday, the HDV tape came out with very minor time code breaks when I paused the camera. The footage was continuous, no signal gaps and you can't see the timecode break while playing the footage at normal speed. Working with the tape today I found capturing with Final Cut was near impossible so I used DVHSCap and MPEGStreamclip. MPEGStreamclip had to fix the time code before it could preview the footage or transcode into QuickTime. Other than that the trancoded QuickTime files seem fine.

I shot something else on Sunday with absolutely no change in the camera's settings from Saturday. Curious I tried to capture this with Final Cut. Final Cut accepted the footage without a problem which saved a lot of time.

I am using a BR-HD50 and a G5 for capture. Anyone have a clue?
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Old September 11th, 2006, 06:21 PM   #2
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I just came from a shoot with some 11 tapes and there are TC breaks on some of them. In fact, one tape has a fairly nasty problem remaining me of the 'mode change' issue. The tape is playing back and suddenly it hits a spot where it goes blue with some periodic disturbances. The next bit of footage is really bad, in fact, when we were in the field the camera asked for head cleaning. This is after some 9 tapes from the previous cleaning. I cleaned it and the recorded some more on the same tape. The new footage is fine.

Now the interesting thing is that when I was capturing this footage using the deck and the tape hit that very same spot, it made the deck 'think' that the heads need cleaning. Instead of cleaning I ejected and re-inserted the tape and continued capturing without any more problems. My thoughs are that perhaps it was a bad spot on tape... although, the 'mode changing' problem also made the deck 'think' that there is a problem with the tape or heads and it was clearly caused by the camera. Who the hell knows.

Oh yes, I also got a good handfull of SSE in perfect conditions at 0 dB at around f5.6. I will create a 'compilation tape' for you guys to see. And yes, my camera is the "A" version, which allegedly was re-calibrated when I sent it for the upgrade in the spring with a note that it has quite a bit of SSE. Of course, I have NO guarantee that the JVC technician who did the upgrade even looked at the note, not to mention actually did anything about it. I have one more day of shooting and then, needless to say, the camera goes back fro re-calibration or replacement.
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Old September 11th, 2006, 06:34 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiri Bakala

Oh yes, I also got a good handfull of SSE in perfect conditions at 0 dB at around f5.6. I will create a 'compilation tape' for you guys to see. And yes, my camera is the "A" version, which allegedly was re-calibrated when I sent it for the upgrade in the spring with a note that it has quite a bit of SSE. Of course, I have NO guarantee that the JVC technician who did the upgrade even looked at the note, not to mention actually did anything about it. I have one more day of shooting and then, needless to say, the camera goes back fro re-calibration or replacement.

That happened on my camera a few months back (SSE in at 0db bright conditions).

They couldn't find any alignment problems on my camera.

fortunately we've not seen it since.
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Old September 11th, 2006, 06:56 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiri Bakala
Oh yes, I also got a good handfull of SSE in perfect conditions at 0 dB at around f5.6.
What settings were you using? Were any of them set to AUTO? (Including those in CAMERA PROCESS)?
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Old September 12th, 2006, 10:31 AM   #5
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We've seen this TC breaks problem happen once -- zillions of little clips where there ought to be 'one' -- and it's scared us badly enough that we've gone back to using our other cameras for a while until we learn more. I hope that this news...
http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=2027
...is good news for this camera. From what I've read, we're really not yet sure if it's a camera problem or an FCP problem - are we?

What's the state-of-the-art knowledge on the cause of this anomaly, up to now? I'm not following this on a daily basis and would love so know 'the latest' - !! It's such a great camera, it pains me to see it sitting here gathering dust because my staff is worried about it...
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Old September 12th, 2006, 10:35 AM   #6
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"One shoot on Saturday, the HDV tape came out with very minor time code breaks when I paused the camera. "

Did you perhaps have the time code in free run rather than record run?
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Old September 12th, 2006, 10:50 AM   #7
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Actually, we had it in "regen" - what's that switch all about anyway?
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Old September 12th, 2006, 12:03 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Earl Thurston
What settings were you using? Were any of them set to AUTO? (Including those in CAMERA PROCESS)?
No, no... all settings were manual and TC in 'record run'. As much as I like the pictures, this camera is temperamental and quite unpredictable. Mature technologie? Maybe in JVC's dreams...
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Old September 12th, 2006, 10:16 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lew Barger
"One shoot on Saturday, the HDV tape came out with very minor time code breaks when I paused the camera. "

Did you perhaps have the time code in free run rather than record run?
That was my first thought but no it wasn't. The TC breaks are different by frames not the amount of time in pause or off. And the following day didn't repeat the problem despite not changing any setting.
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Old September 12th, 2006, 10:23 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiri Bakala
No, no... all settings were manual and TC in 'record run'. As much as I like the pictures, this camera is temperamental and quite unpredictable. Mature technologie? Maybe in JVC's dreams...
Unfortunately these problems have been part of my experience with various JVC items over the past 20 years. THe most realible JVC items I ever had? Their 3/4 inch decks and the BY-110 tube camera. Everything else has had weird microprocessor problems of some sort. It's too bad since JVC has come up with some exceptional products that are undermined by quality control problems.

I still like my HD-100 although.
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Old September 12th, 2006, 10:24 PM   #11
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So William: Then the only thing that may have changed would have been the quality of the electricity reaching the camera's systems: The voltage.

Perhaps when the battery declines a bit the problem arrives...?

Well, I have not done the definitive tests to determine if this is so, but based on observations exactly like yours, William, we are now using this camera only in the studio, where we can plug it directly into its a/c adaptor.

At first this seemed to solve the problem - but now I am told we have had the problem even with the camera running directly off its a/c adaptor. So how can we use it for anything?

Another possibility -- let us not forget -- may be a 'difference' that exists in our computers from one day to the next, as the video is being imported. The degree to which the computer's processor is busy doing other things at the same time could be an issue...the degree to which the hard-drive is needing to skip around as it does various jobs at once could be involved...

These are just guesses. We all need a definitive answer to this question -- and a clear solution. Where is JVC on this? My experience with them has been over-the-top-positive: The most responsive and pleasant manufacturer I have ever dealt with. So I hope JVC speaks up and addresses this issue before the success of this camera is affected.
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Last edited by Scott Shuster; September 13th, 2006 at 09:03 AM. Reason: (new info: My staff reports the problem recurs (unpredictably) even when running off the a/c adaptor instead of the battery)
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Old September 13th, 2006, 08:38 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by William Hohauser
That was my first thought but no it wasn't. The TC breaks are different by frames not the amount of time in pause or off. And the following day didn't repeat the problem despite not changing any setting.
Sounds like you have all the camera adjustments covered. Any chance a tape glitch could cause this type of error. Don't know, but can't think of any thing else that is usually the culprit when a non repeatable error comes up.
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Old September 13th, 2006, 04:25 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Shuster
So William: Then the only thing that may have changed would have been the quality of the electricity reaching the camera's systems: The voltage.

Perhaps when the battery declines a bit the problem arrives...?

Well, I have not done the definitive tests to determine if this is so, but based on observations exactly like yours, William, we are now using this camera only in the studio, where we can plug it directly into its a/c adaptor.

At first this seemed to solve the problem - but now I am told we have had the problem even with the camera running directly off its a/c adaptor. So how can we use it for anything?
Both days were started off a freshly charged battery. The time code problem existed from the start of Saturday's tape. Sunday's tape was perfect from start to finish. Both were captured to the computer on Monday.

Two remotely possible issues. Saturday's shoot was in a room that started warm and ended up around 87 degrees farhenheit. It was also the first shoot I did without a FireStore HD which I sent back (and am waiting for a replacement).

Sunday was in a normal room temperature situation.
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Old September 13th, 2006, 04:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lew Barger
Sounds like you have all the camera adjustments covered. Any chance a tape glitch could cause this type of error. Don't know, but can't think of any thing else that is usually the culprit when a non repeatable error comes up.
Lew
It's possible, the tapes used are from a batch of JVC "HDV" tapes that gave me one absolute stinker of a tape. These, however, have no apparent drop outs.

I'm waiting for my replacement FireStore. That was easy to work with and quicker.
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Old September 13th, 2006, 04:32 PM   #15
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I had a very nasty Panasonic AMQ tape that caused major dropouts. I really wished I stayed with SONY (which I used to use with my previous setup). After this job is done, I think I'll clean the heads on the camera and deck and switch back to Sony tapes.
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