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Old October 11th, 2006, 12:33 AM   #1
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What is the colorspace of SD 60p?

What colorspace does SD 60p use?

Since the camera shoots this in HDV mode, does it use the 709 colorspace?

Or, since it is SD, does it use the 601 Colorspace?

If one shoots SD 60p, then edits in Liquid, then exports (fuses) the native timeline to encode using Procoder for DVD, will the colorspace considerations automatically be handled?
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Old October 11th, 2006, 12:47 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Walker
What colorspace does SD 60p use?

Since the camera shoots this in HDV mode, does it use the 709 colorspace?

Or, since it is SD, does it use the 601 Colorspace?

If one shoots SD 60p, then edits in Liquid, then exports (fuses) the native timeline to encode using Procoder for DVD, will the colorspace considerations automatically be handled?
480p/60fps uses the 709 color space because it is MP@HL-14. At least that is the spec for SD-HDV. Your Liquid system will handle SD-HDV as 709.

If you export using the DVD TS export option for use with an authoring app then the 709 will be converted to 601 when the TS files are compiled. The conversation came up a couple of years ago about the conversion and if I remember right, the system uses floating white point as the method. But then again maybe that was FCP. I can't remember. Either way, the system handles the conversion (which is minimal).
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Old October 11th, 2006, 01:03 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe
If you export using the DVD TS export option for use with an authoring app then the 709 will be converted to 601 when the TS files are compiled.
Is it possible to get the video out of Liquid without any re-encoding or rendering (except for transitions, etc.) so that I can use Procoder to do the final encoding for DVD before going to Encore (for example?)?
Thank you!
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Old October 11th, 2006, 01:18 AM   #4
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Yes you can get it out but in what format do you want it? HDV is mpeg and DVD is mpeg. Encoding to AVI will be a generation loss that is not needed. It seems far better to output as TS and then use the TS for your authoring if you need multiple sound tracks and a very complex menu system as well as DVD-ROM extra content.
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Old October 12th, 2006, 12:57 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Stephen L. Noe
Yes you can get it out but in what format do you want it? HDV is mpeg and DVD is mpeg. Encoding to AVI will be a generation loss that is not needed. It seems far better to output as TS and then use the TS for your authoring if you need multiple sound tracks and a very complex menu system as well as DVD-ROM extra content.
Apparently I am confused about this.

What I understood is that the mpeg of JVCpro is not the same mpeg that I will use on the DVD... or to put it another way, the JVCpro mpeg is too large to put 2 hours of video on a DVD. I thought I would have to re-encode the timeline to fit on the DVD. Is this not correct?

If this is correct, I want the timeline video out of Liquid as untouched as possible. I want to do any encoding required for the DVD using Procoder 2, not Liquid.

Again, if I understand correctly, most on the timeline will be in JVCpro mpeg, and the transitions will be uncompressed (having set the timeline render to uncompressed). I then want this timeline out in the best quality possible to bring into Procoder for encoding to the exact bitrate required for the DVD.

If exporting the timeline as a transport stream, will the JVCpro video remain untouched by Liquid? with the transitions encoded back to the JVCpro format?

Or perhaps the timeline should be exported to something like the BM 8bit uncompressed codec and this used in Procoder for the final mpeg encoding. (Though I don't know what Liquid will do to change the 480 to 486... that is, will lines be added that can be dropped in the final encoding, or will Liquid upsize the 480 to 486?....)

Thanks!
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Old October 12th, 2006, 02:54 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Walker
Apparently I am confused about this.

What I understood is that the mpeg of JVCpro is not the same mpeg that I will use on the DVD... or to put it another way, the JVCpro mpeg is too large to put 2 hours of video on a DVD. I thought I would have to re-encode the timeline to fit on the DVD. Is this not correct?

If this is correct, I want the timeline video out of Liquid as untouched as possible. I want to do any encoding required for the DVD using Procoder 2, not Liquid.

Again, if I understand correctly, most on the timeline will be in JVCpro mpeg, and the transitions will be uncompressed (having set the timeline render to uncompressed). I then want this timeline out in the best quality possible to bring into Procoder for encoding to the exact bitrate required for the DVD.

If exporting the timeline as a transport stream, will the JVCpro video remain untouched by Liquid? with the transitions encoded back to the JVCpro format?

Or perhaps the timeline should be exported to something like the BM 8bit uncompressed codec and this used in Procoder for the final mpeg encoding. (Though I don't know what Liquid will do to change the 480 to 486... that is, will lines be added that can be dropped in the final encoding, or will Liquid upsize the 480 to 486?....)

Thanks!
Liquid will upsize to 486 to make a compliant DVD. What format do you want to encode through Procorder? Liquid ingest m2t (4:2:0) and put it on DVD (4:2:0). There is no image robbing transcode of colorspace so your DVD encoded to TS through the Liquid system will be superior when you go like for like (colorspace wise) and not suffer the color loss by virtue of the color space conversion. In other words, you'd need to edit your HDV1 timeline as if it were an SD-DV timeline and then make sure you choose uncompressed 2vuy as your render codec. After your timeline is built you can just go into the export DVD option and set your compression preference and let Liquid resize your project to 16x9 SD DVD. Depending on your compression choices you can fit about 3 hours on a dual layer with great results.

I don't know if Procorder 2 can handle m2t files. Can it?
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Old October 12th, 2006, 07:00 PM   #7
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Stephen,
Procoder 2 does recognize m2t files.

Oddly, it reports the frame rate as 59.940
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Old October 12th, 2006, 08:51 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Steven Thomas
Stephen,
Procoder 2 does recognize m2t files.

Oddly, it reports the frame rate as 59.940
OK, now that it's established that procorder reads m2t you can encode directly from your fused timeline file. The file will be p2t (program stream) or you can select whatever encoding you wish in order to get your timeline out of liquid and into procorder. The frame rate should read 59.94. Remember the video is placed into the 59.94 stream with placeholders. Procorder will have to discard the placeholders to encode the true framerate. Try it out with any m2t file and see what it does.
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