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Old November 12th, 2006, 11:22 AM   #1
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FYI: Super Encoder compared to HD-100 encoder.

Hi,

As with alot of you, I have had my hands on a GY-HD250 and shot some footage. Most notably the 60p footage looks like "Video" a la 60i which should make the broadcaster jump for joy. Getting slow motion is a snap with the 60fps footage and it is extremely smooth as you'd expect.

I was most interested in the encoder though and made a small video to explain my process of comparing the HD-100's encoder to the "Super Encoder". You may be amazed at how much better the Super Encoder is compared to it predecessor. Click here for WMV. This should play for both PC & Mac.


For kicks here is a Sample Slo Mo which was a snap to do in the NLE. The clip is slowed down to 40% (ie 60fps to 24fps). Easy to do...

Regards,

S.Noe
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Old November 12th, 2006, 12:20 PM   #2
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Stephen,
Once again you have been a great resource of information!
Well done.

I was hoping JVC would improve their encoder. It appears they did!
I've been asking this exact question and you have provided the answer.
It looks like I need to start saving some coin.....
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Old November 12th, 2006, 12:39 PM   #3
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Does this super super encoder on the HD250 is also for "old" 25-30p, or only for the new 50-60p ?
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Old November 12th, 2006, 06:33 PM   #4
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Hi Stephen,

Thanks for the demo, I'll be getting my 250 next thursday!

I can't get the Slo Mo movie to work. I hear the soundtrack but don't see the video. I tried Quicktime with Flip4mac and I tried VLC.

The other movie (Super Encoder) is working fine.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 08:01 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marc Jayson
Hi Stephen,

I can't get the Slo Mo movie to work. I hear the soundtrack but don't see the video. I tried Quicktime with Flip4mac and I tried VLC.

The other movie (Super Encoder) is working fine.
Same's happening here
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Old November 12th, 2006, 08:25 PM   #6
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Thanks Stephen, great stuff!

Do you have any idea how much of the image improvement with the 250 over the 100 is due to the improved MPEG "Super Encoder" alone, compared to the new 14 bit A/D of the 250? I'm not clear where the line is drawn between the new specifications of the 250, or if they are one in the same and
more integrated than I understood.

If unique, and the improvement was totally on the encoder side then could you get similar results on the 100 when bypassing tape via component uncompressed? Or is this better asked of Ken or Carl at JVC?

Sorry, not trying to be the "why kid", just curious.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 09:01 PM   #7
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Although the new 14 bit A/D and the new encoder are separate circuits - the A/D happens before the encoding - they both contribute to the overall improvement in picture quality.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 09:19 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Patton
Thanks Stephen, great stuff!

Do you have any idea how much of the image improvement with the 250 over the 100 is due to the improved MPEG "Super Encoder" alone, compared to the new 14 bit A/D of the 250? I'm not clear where the line is drawn between the new specifications of the 250, or if they are one in the same and
more integrated than I understood.

If unique, and the improvement was totally on the encoder side then could you get similar results on the 100 when bypassing tape via component uncompressed? Or is this better asked of Ken or Carl at JVC?

Sorry, not trying to be the "why kid", just curious.
I'd expect that the A/D converter would be the reason for the much better noise supression. The lack of blocks in the blue channel would be the the result of the better Super Encoder.

On the HD-100 you'd get much better results from the component out compared to the encoded information on the tape, but the HD-250 is even better merely because of the better A/D converter. Face it, the HD-250 is better in every way than the HD-100 and the price reflects it. I'd expect the HD-200 to be in the same ballpark as the HD-250, thus the higher price (than the HD-110).

Either way, we are all winners with ProHD.
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Old November 12th, 2006, 09:21 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabrice Hoffmann
Does this super super encoder on the HD250 is also for "old" 25-30p, or only for the new 50-60p ?
HD-250's benefits also span to all available framerates on the camera (ie 24,25,30,50 & 60).

BTW: There is no HDV-SD50 or 60 modes on the HD-250. They do not exist in the menu's.
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Old November 13th, 2006, 05:58 AM   #10
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I take it the PAL version will do 50fps slow mo ?

Andy.
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Old November 13th, 2006, 07:01 AM   #11
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I'll do HD in 50p, and that's easily downconverted to slow mo PAL 25p progressive (or 50i, if you really must)
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Old November 13th, 2006, 10:13 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andy Graham
I take it the PAL version will do 50fps slow mo ?

Andy.
Yes, but I wonder of there are HDV60P modes on the Euro version as well?
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Old November 14th, 2006, 01:15 AM   #13
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If NTSC has 50fps in theirs then PAL will have 60fps in theirs, the only difference are the standard definition formats will only be local, eg. NTSC will only get DV60i while PAL will only get DV50i
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Old November 14th, 2006, 04:57 AM   #14
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It's strange that you are having issues with the blue channel. My problem with my HD100 seems to be the RED channel. Whenever I do weddings I notice the blockiness and pixelation on the roses while everything else looks fine.
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Old November 14th, 2006, 08:17 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Jaco
It's strange that you are having issues with the blue channel. My problem with my HD100 seems to be the RED channel. Whenever I do weddings I notice the blockiness and pixelation on the roses while everything else looks fine.
That is your render codec and not the native transfer. What is your editing system?
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