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Old May 2nd, 2007, 08:15 PM   #1
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HD200 Series Scene File Recipes

PDF of HD200 Scene Files

I have finally posted the HD200/250/201/251 versions of most of my original HD100 scene files. I apologize for the long wait, but I wanted to redo them all with DSC's ChromaDuMonde 28R and Toni chart with cavity black before posting the second batch. I've retired the Gretag Macbeth chart.

You will also find a couple brand new scene files just for the HD200 series.
The first is my calibrated setting for a DSC ChromaDuMonde chart, called DSC CDM28 Chart. I am only including this scene file for research purposes. I would like others to start from scratch with their own DSC charts and see what their results are. My goal when I created this scene file was to find a "true to life" matrix setting that would translate perfectly down to NTSC colour space. The colours have hit their targets as closely as I can manage using the proper vectorscope gain, but I'm still not happy with the accuracy of reproduction on the blue side. I used the 16x5.5 stock lens as the "lowest common denominator" and tried to minimize the effects of vignette and white shading through careful choices of zoom and aperture. The results may be different with a different lens, even if white balance is set correctly.
If you own a DSC chart, please program, compare and share your results in this thread. My results are very different from Paulo's, so I'm curious what other members come up with?

The new file I'm most excited about I've named "SUPERWIDE" The new gamma curves in the HD200 series of cameras allow for even more dynamic range to be compressed into 8-bit HDV. By bringing the level of the new CINEMA curve down to its minimum, increasing the black stretch to 5 (which is about equivalent to 3 in the HD100) and manually dropping the knee to 80%, you can capture a VERY low contrast image. You should still manage your lighting ratios when in controlled situations, but this gives you even more room to play in post-production.
I recommend using ZEBRA bars at OVER100% as a guide to what your upper limit of exposure is. This will usually mean underexposing by a stop more than you are used to, but you will be controlling the highlights clipping point manually and still maintain an even exposure in your mids.
You will not want to use this scene file for straight to broadcast. It is designed for, and will require, proper colour grading. The basic idea is to render as much information as possible into HDV for the colourist to work with.

One noteworthy element of SUPERWIDE is that I spent hours trying to find the right combination of matrix controls to accurately represent all of the colours on the correct vector angles. As anyone who has ever played with the matrix knows, it is a constant game of give and take. Adjusting one element always has an effect on another. In the end I think I managed to recreate very accurate colours (as far as vector angles go) and even maintained the proper "violet" tone in NTSC. Please use a manual white balance and let me know how this new scene file works for you.

NOTE: If you plan to use any of the scene files that take advantage of WHITE PAINT function, you must set MANUAL white balance FIRST, and then manually adjust the R & B WHITE PAINT in the menus. White balancing after adjusting R & B WHITE PAINT will "zero" the white balance.


Right-Click and Save from this link (38.9MB) to view a transport stream that includes comparison tests of:
1. Superwide
2. DSC CDM28 Calibrated
3. Film Noir
4. Warm
5. Warm Green (Amelié)
6. Bleach Bypass (Saving Private Ryan)
7. Cross-Processed Color Reversal (Three Kings)
8. Film Vert (The Matrix)
9. Close-Up Film Vert
10. Close-Up Cross-Process Color Reversal
11. Close-Up Bleach Bypass
12. Running guy Bleach Bypass

Note: This mpeg2 transport stream has not been re-compressed or colour corrected in any way. Only in-camera DSP was used to achieve the "looks." These tests were shot with the Fujinon 13x3.5mm lens, even though the scene files were designed with the 16x5.5mm.

Download the attached pdf for the HD200 Series Scene File Recipes.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf HD200_Scene_Files.pdf (420.9 KB, 5502 views)
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Old May 2nd, 2007, 08:39 PM   #2
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A million thanks, Tim. There's gonna be a lot of happy souls now. I for one have felt handicapped without your recipes and those from Paolo. Thanks again :-)
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Old May 2nd, 2007, 09:52 PM   #3
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WooHoo!

Thanks Tim!
Very excited to finally see your looks the way they are meant to be.
I will have to get a color chart and learn to use it, but I'm excited to have a common ground to work with and discuss here.
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Old May 3rd, 2007, 11:00 AM   #4
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Excellent. Excellent. Excellent. I use Cinewide on my HD 100 all of the time. Now, I'm ready to buy a 200, and I can use you super wide setting. Can't wait for your DVD to come out.

Cheers
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Old May 3rd, 2007, 05:21 PM   #5
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Thank you very much Tim,
Santa Claus is back!
God bless you,
E
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Old May 5th, 2007, 12:24 AM   #6
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Soccer game 720/p60

Going to try to out your scene file on my kids soccer game tomorrow.

My 250 settings have thus far made it really nice to not immediately want to go color correction happy. It seems I'm so used to feeling like I have to drop the Magic Bullet on my footage, that having some richer defaults makes it bearable - and possible - to shoot/capture/post within the hour, these soccer games (for immediate review).

I look forward to getting this on my camera and checking it out...
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Old May 6th, 2007, 10:45 AM   #7
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Hi Tim,
I've gone through all of your settings, taking a look at scenes in my living room. These are really useful, and practical!

The DSC CDM28 actually looks real nice for an uncorrected natural look.
Better than the "stock" setting, and sometimes we all must shoot some stuff that isn't going to get a treatment....



One question came up in applying settings for Film Vert.
If you put the Cinema setting ON, Then Color Matrix and Gamma are locked at [CINE] - as other settings indicate.
I assumed that cinema is off so that color matrix can be standard in this case - although perhaps matrix and gamma are both [CINE]?

I've backed up settings on the computer from the cards - it's much faster to load from scene files, but you learn much more putting them in manually, so i was happy not to go the easy route when first trying them.

Jeffrey: only 4 slots on a SD card, no matter what size, also 4 user slots in the camera itself.

You CAN get shutter at 1/120 by going into variable shutter mode in the switch menu. It sure takes a while to wind into it, but it will stay there until you change the custom shutter setting to something else (you can turn the shutter off). I don't think it will make that much difference from 1/100 though.
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Old May 6th, 2007, 10:50 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Adair View Post
One question came up in applying settings for Film Vert.
If you put the Cinema setting ON, Then Color Matrix and Gamma are locked at [CINE] - as other settings indicate.
I assumed that cinema is off so that color matrix can be standard in this case - although perhaps matrix and gamma are both [CINE]?
Your right. Typo on my part. I will fix it this evening and upload a new pdf.
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Old May 6th, 2007, 11:10 AM   #9
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Tim, While we are on settings here, any updates on image noise comparision with the 200 series?
In an earlier post you mentioned that you turned detail down to help with noise issues when you first got the HD250.
The detail settings are still a bit confusing to me, with horizontal & vertical frequency and balance etc.
There has been some discussion of these settings with the HD100, do you use the same settings on the 200 series?
Detail settings get saved with the scene file right?
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Last edited by Sean Adair; May 6th, 2007 at 11:12 AM. Reason: afterthought
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Old May 7th, 2007, 11:48 AM   #10
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Hey Tim,

Are you going to make scene file settings for film mode only, or are you also making files for all shooting situations, 4:3 DV, 4:3/16:9 24P DV, and the rest?

Thanks.
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Old May 7th, 2007, 12:17 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Carl Martin View Post
Hey Tim,

Are you going to make scene file settings for film mode only, or are you also making files for all shooting situations, 4:3 DV, 4:3/16:9 24P DV, and the rest?

Thanks.
I haven't actually posted my own HD200 SCN files yet, and I'm not sure if I will. I've had doubts since I uploaded the original SCN files over a year ago.
I've thought alot about it and since so many 'personal preferences' are stored in the SCN file I'm considering not uploading them. It would force those who download the SCN file to work the way I work, with buttons,switches, detail programmed the way I like them.

BTW, these scene files should work just as well in DV mode. I specifically double-checked them with a NTSC scope and a downconverted signal to make sure they would translate legally into NTSC. The only one that may cause some problems is the "Cross-processed colour reversal."
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Old May 7th, 2007, 12:34 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Adair View Post
Tim, While we are on settings here, any updates on image noise comparision with the 200 series?
In an earlier post you mentioned that you turned detail down to help with noise issues when you first got the HD250.
The detail settings are still a bit confusing to me, with horizontal & vertical frequency and balance etc.
There has been some discussion of these settings with the HD100, do you use the same settings on the 200 series?
Detail settings get saved with the scene file right?
I still have no definitive answer to the noise issue. However, my primary observation is that the HD200 and HD250 seem to be about a 1/2 stop more sensitive to light than the HD100 with the same settings. My original assumption was that the analog signal entering the DSP was exactly the same as the HD100, and therefore assumed that the DSP and new gamma curves were the culprit. I've tried almost everything to minimize the noise with DSP controls without much luck.
I have some other theories, but there is no point in sharing them right now.

The detail settings question requires a whole thread unto itself. I conducted a full set of tests on the 16x5.5 and 13x3.5 lenses with a bunch of combinations of detail settings.
Download it here (22.7MB): http://www.TimDashwood.com/.Public/H..._rez_tests.zip
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Old May 7th, 2007, 12:36 PM   #13
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Scene File Tests

I was shooting some 2nd unit on a feature this weekend and had an opportunity to grab some comparison tests of the new HD200/250 scene files.

Right-Click and Save from this link (38.9MB) to view a transport stream that includes comparison tests of:
1. Superwide
2. DSC CDM28 Calibrated
3. Film Noir
4. Warm
5. Warm Green (Amelié)
6. Bleach Bypass (Saving Private Ryan)
7. Cross-Processed Color Reversal (Three Kings)
8. Film Vert (The Matrix)
9. Close-Up Film Vert
10. Close-Up Cross-Process Color Reversal
11. Close-Up Bleach Bypass
12. Running guy Bleach Bypass

Note: This mpeg2 transport stream has not been re-compressed or colour corrected in any way. Only in-camera DSP was used to achieve the "looks." These tests were shot with the Fujinon 13x3.5mm lens, even though the scene files were designed with the 16x5.5mm.

I've added this link to the first post in this thread as well.
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Old May 11th, 2007, 07:53 PM   #14
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Tim,.

In the bleech bypass settings, do I set Stretch Level under BLACK COMPRESS to level 1? or 5? I set Compress level to 5.

Duke
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Old May 11th, 2007, 07:56 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by Brian Duke View Post
Tim,.

Int he bleech by pass settings, do I set Stretch Level under BLACK COMPRESS to level 1? or 5? I set Compress level to 5.

Duke
It doesn't matter. The way it works now is that when black is set to COMPRESS, the only value that matters is the compress value. When set to NORMAL, neither value matters, and when set to STRETCH only the stretch value matters.

I think I liked the HD100 style better. There was less 'logic' involved in determining your value with a quick glance.

Have you reduced your detail?
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