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Old May 4th, 2009, 07:41 PM   #1
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Which lens is better: Canon or Fujinon?

I have the fujinon 17 -1 and I would like to get the Canon when it shows up . Is it better ?



Doug
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Old May 5th, 2009, 01:59 AM   #2
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I keep getting emails with the same question. Canon 14x4.4 or Fujinon 17x5 ? For those who may not know, The Canon is the intended bundle lens for the HM700 but it isn't available until June. In the meantime JVC is bundling the Fujinon 17x5, which is a more expensive lens.

I've now had a chance to shoot with both of them and I have to say they both perform very well, but there are pros and cons to each.

Canon 14x4.4 Pros:
  • Slightly wider than the Fujinon 17x5
  • Very sharp and virtually zero CA in the centre of the image at the wide end or corner to corner at the long end of the lens
Canon 14x4.4 Cons:
  • The lens breaths a lot at the wide end
  • CA very visible in the corners at the wide end
  • Flimsy plastic macro ring button that has some give and take which affects the backfocus
Fujinon 17x5 Pros:
  • Long zoom range (5mm-85mm)
  • Excellent corner to corner sharpness (approaching 900TVL)
  • This is a $3500 lens so it a great value to get it bundled with the camera
Fujinon 17x5 Cons:
  • Not quite as wide as the Canon 14x4.4
  • Breaths, but not as much as the Canon 14x4.4
  • Slight CA at the long end

I have clips from each of these lenses that I will upload sometime this week. Unfortunately I have never had both of these lenses in my possession at the same time in order to conduct true side-by-side tests. However I plan to pull some 1:1 frame grabs to demonstrate the differences in the same situations.

If I had to choose to buy the HM700 bundle with the Fujinon 17x5 now or wait until June to get the bundle with the Canon 14x4.4 I would buy now, get the more expensive Fujinon lens for the same price, then wait to test the Canon in June and sell the Fujinon for profit if I felt the Canon was good enough for the type of work I do.
Make sense?
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Old May 5th, 2009, 12:30 PM   #3
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Tim's summary matches my expectations. Personally I was excited to get the 17x at this package price. It certainly has the build and heft you expect at that price.

Doug - I would consider holding out for a 13x lens for very sharp and clean wide angle - mid focal length work. Then, since you do nature, look at a direct mount Nikon adapter (the MTF by Mike Tapa who is in this community, or there are other choices).
Couple this to an 80-200 f.2.8 zoom, or even longer more exotic glass for some very clean extended tele work. Zooming during the shot may not be practical, but that's overrated anyway ;^)
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Old May 5th, 2009, 04:44 PM   #4
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One small question. I am getting magenta and green fringe with 16x lenses (same than GY200, here in Italty bundled with HM700 still today) but.. and here is the question.. I saw similar fringe on high contrasted lines (ie a white building in counterlight) also on the HM100 (that has totally different lenses!!!).. So what... the problem is in the CCD system.. this new half pixel slanting of 2 of the 3 CCDs to get higher virtual resolution ?! Or what ??
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Old May 5th, 2009, 05:10 PM   #5
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Hey Tim, is the 17x a big improvement over the 16x fujinon in terms of sharpness and CA?
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Old May 5th, 2009, 05:35 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcello Mazzilli View Post
One small question. I am getting magenta and green fringe with 16x lenses (same than GY200, here in Italty bundled with HM700 still today) but.. and here is the question.. I saw similar fringe on high contrasted lines (ie a white building in counterlight) also on the HM100 (that has totally different lenses!!!).. So what... the problem is in the CCD system.. this new half pixel slanting of 2 of the 3 CCDs to get higher virtual resolution ?! Or what ??
The old 16x5.5 lens is low-quality compared to the new ones being bundled here in North America. It has pronounced chromatic aberration when the iris is close to full open and when the lens is zoomed in. It also vignettes near the end of its zoom range.
Here's the thing about CA: all lenses will exhibit some degree of chromatic aberration, even the best cinema lenses around. This stands true for fixed lens cameras as well. Pixel shifting should have no effect (if it did you would always have CA.) The key is to understand under what conditions (iris & zoom) it will be most pronounced and then to try to avoid those areas of the lens.
When you hear cinematographers talk about the "sweet spot" of a lens this is what they mean. The best range to shoot with any lens tends to be between F/2.8 and F/5.6. F/4 is ideal. The sweet spot for focal length on a zoom can vary based on the lens design. For example CA is pronounced on the wide end of the Canon 14x4.4 but typically long end of Fujinons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amos Kim View Post
Hey Tim, is the 17x a big improvement over the 16x fujinon in terms of sharpness and CA?
With CA and vignetting the 17x is much better. Sharpness wise it is slightly better, but the 16x was always sharp enough for HD anyway (see my resolution tests.)
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Old May 5th, 2009, 06:08 PM   #7
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OK, here's another related question:

Given that the Canon 14x4.4 is "slightly wider" than the Fuji 17x5, and that I shoot a lot of indoors stuff, I'm leaning toward waiting for the Canon.

But if the Canon is insufficiently wide for interview work, which would mean I'd wind up buying a wide-angle adapter anyway, would it be better to just get the Fuji + a wide angle adapter, and have maximum flexibility? Or will the Canon perform much better with a wide adapter than the Fuji?

Also, which of the two lenses lets the most light into the camera?
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Old May 5th, 2009, 06:12 PM   #8
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Avoid wide adapters when you can for the best image possible.
If you are shooting in tight quarters on a regular basis then there is no substitute for the Fujinon 13x3.5. It is my favourite 1/3" lens.

The Fujinon is slightly faster at F/1.4 (the Canon is F/1.6).
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Old May 6th, 2009, 12:05 AM   #9
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All I know is I want the 13x3.5... so I figured get the more 'expensive' lens that the camera is available with.

Is JVC/Canon going to make the 14x4.5 available separately?
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Old May 9th, 2009, 12:56 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by David Petersen View Post
Is JVC/Canon going to make the 14x4.5 available separately?
I don't know. It would make sense if Canon did considering the Sony Z7/Z270 and Panasonic HPX300 are also 1/3".
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