Uncompressed HD at DVinfo.net

Calvin Bellows · July 27th, 2010, 06:40 PM

Hello everyone. I know the HM 700 shoots native to HD but is that uncompressed. I have been approached by a company to shoot some stock footage for them but the final version has to be uncompressed Quick Time files. So would I have to run everything through compressor with the uncompressed setting or can I just transfer the files?

Bob Richardson · July 27th, 2010, 09:32 PM

The files that the HM700 makes are indeed compressed. The codec used (in the high-quality modes) is Sony's XDCAM-EX format.

If you want uncompressed, the HM700 can output an uncompressed signal out its SDI connector, but you'd have to rent some kind of portable hard drive recorder.

But you may want to find out just what your client means by "uncompressed" -- If they're being sticklers for the quality of each and every little pixel, they probably shouldn't be messing around with a camera like the HM700 which uses 1/3" image sensors and can be a bit noisy in some situations.

Furthermore, a lot of high-end recording devices save the files in Apple's ProRes format, which is very high quality, but still employs compression techniques.

So you really need to know what the client is hoping to do with the footage. It could be that they simply mean they don't want you to deliver some file scaled down to go on YouTube and want the original files out of the camera (even though those are compressed!). But it could also mean they want to do serious compositing, layering, or animation work, such as green screen work, and don't want the compression algorithm introducing artifacts into the raw footage.

Calvin Bellows · July 27th, 2010, 09:53 PM

The client doesn't know what they would like the footage for. The client is the government of Canada and they just want to start building an archive incase anyone wants to use their footage for any project.

Bob Richardson · July 27th, 2010, 09:58 PM

Then I suspect that your client doesn't know what they're saying when they ask for "uncompressed". What they probably mean is "original files from the camera, not web video" ... but you can't work based on assumptions, so you'll have to do some conversing and hand-holding and see what you can come up with.

If they intend to gather a whole bunch of "uncompressed" b-roll, they may be shocked at how much data they're going to have to archive and maintain.

Tell them your camera consumes over 16GB per hour of footage, and see if that sounds uncompressed-enough for their purposes. :-)

Bob Richardson · July 27th, 2010, 09:59 PM

And another thing... compressed recording in a pro camera is not unique to the JVC. In fact, most HD cameras record some form of compressed video, usually HDV. For "uncompressed" as a standard application you're either working with a Red One or some kind of external recording device.

Calvin Bellows · July 27th, 2010, 11:38 PM

Thanks for this Bob. This is an area I need to study up on a little more. Almost all of my clients use the video on the web. The odd SD TV spot

Perrone Ford · July 27th, 2010, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Richardson

And another thing... compressed recording in a pro camera is not unique to the JVC. In fact, most HD cameras record some form of compressed video, usually HDV. For "uncompressed" as a standard application you're either working with a Red One or some kind of external recording device.

I am not aware of ANY cameras that shoot "uncompressed". At least none that are commercially available. In order to do it you MUST use and external recorder.

So let's talk about that. Uncompressed HD at 24p 10bit is going to be about 445GB/hr. You'll need something like a Codex to record it. - Codex Digital

Retail on the portable is $US44,500, rental prices are about $1k/day

A cheaper option is the S.Two recorder and some of them rent at $300 a day. It records to DPX files. Both systems can be rented here if needed:

::The Camera House::

So let's move back to the world of reality. Find out what their REAL spec is, because not even Hollywood is using uncompressed capture unless it's for visual effects or other demanding scenes. It's too cumbersome and expensive. Once you find out the REAL specifications, come back and let us know and we'll try to help.

Calvin Bellows · July 28th, 2010, 10:06 AM

Just to let you two know their meaning of uncompressed is whatever format the camera records. Thanks for the help!

Bob Richardson · July 28th, 2010, 12:00 PM

You're welcome. Glad the final result is simple and not costly to deliver!

July 27th, 2010, 06:40 PM	#1
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	Uncompressed HD Hello everyone. I know the HM 700 shoots native to HD but is that uncompressed. I have been approached by a company to shoot some stock footage for them but the final version has to be uncompressed Quick Time files. So would I have to run everything through compressor with the uncompressed setting or can I just transfer the files? __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

July 27th, 2010, 09:53 PM	#3
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	The client doesn't know what they would like the footage for. The client is the government of Canada and they just want to start building an archive incase anyone wants to use their footage for any project. __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

July 27th, 2010, 11:38 PM	#6
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	Thanks for this Bob. This is an area I need to study up on a little more. Almost all of my clients use the video on the web. The odd SD TV spot __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

July 28th, 2010, 10:06 AM	#8
Calvin Bellows Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Red Deer, Alberta Posts: 215	An update Just to let you two know their meaning of uncompressed is whatever format the camera records. Thanks for the help! __________________ Calvin Bellows www.exposureproductions.ca

July 27th, 2010, 09:32 PM	#2
Bob Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 178	The files that the HM700 makes are indeed compressed. The codec used (in the high-quality modes) is Sony's XDCAM-EX format. If you want uncompressed, the HM700 can output an uncompressed signal out its SDI connector, but you'd have to rent some kind of portable hard drive recorder. But you may want to find out just what your client means by "uncompressed" -- If they're being sticklers for the quality of each and every little pixel, they probably shouldn't be messing around with a camera like the HM700 which uses 1/3" image sensors and can be a bit noisy in some situations. Furthermore, a lot of high-end recording devices save the files in Apple's ProRes format, which is very high quality, but still employs compression techniques. So you really need to know what the client is hoping to do with the footage. It could be that they simply mean they don't want you to deliver some file scaled down to go on YouTube and want the original files out of the camera (even though those are compressed!). But it could also mean they want to do serious compositing, layering, or animation work, such as green screen work, and don't want the compression algorithm introducing artifacts into the raw footage.

July 27th, 2010, 09:58 PM	#4
Bob Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 178	Then I suspect that your client doesn't know what they're saying when they ask for "uncompressed". What they probably mean is "original files from the camera, not web video" ... but you can't work based on assumptions, so you'll have to do some conversing and hand-holding and see what you can come up with. If they intend to gather a whole bunch of "uncompressed" b-roll, they may be shocked at how much data they're going to have to archive and maintain. Tell them your camera consumes over 16GB per hour of footage, and see if that sounds uncompressed-enough for their purposes. :-)

July 27th, 2010, 09:59 PM	#5
Bob Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 178	And another thing... compressed recording in a pro camera is not unique to the JVC. In fact, most HD cameras record some form of compressed video, usually HDV. For "uncompressed" as a standard application you're either working with a Red One or some kind of external recording device.

July 28th, 2010, 12:00 PM	#9
Bob Richardson Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 178	You're welcome. Glad the final result is simple and not costly to deliver!