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Old June 24th, 2013, 12:33 PM   #31
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

WOW AGAIN: Slo-mo can be made to look less soft. Compare this 120fps with the previous sample.



Also see:



========================================

Video gain -- AGC vs AUTO:

AGC > shutter-speed can go to 1/60th. (If already set to 1/60th, no change.) Gain is auto-added to +18dB.

AUTO > shutter-speed to 1/30th. Gain, if needed, is auto-added to +18dB.

=========================================

WHIP PAN -- None, or very little Rolling Shutter in frame grab.
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Old June 25th, 2013, 02:39 AM   #32
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

After my outdoor tests, the PX100 is a keeper -- especially now that I know how to coax much better slo-mo from it.

Will now do indoor and low-light.

And, more slo-mo and time-lapse.

==========================================

Then WIFI: DOUBLE WOW.







FANTASTIC TEK:

WIFI XFER OF SD CARD CONTENTS:



Could A/V port -- video out pin -- be LANC during recording? Bet not. But, on some JVC cameras it controls a Pan&Tilt base. Probably using audio tones.

Sent my first video mail -- anyone traveling needs this camcorder. See pix below.


Steve
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Old July 3rd, 2013, 11:20 PM   #33
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

I've checked out all the WiFi modes and work as they should.

Very much the same technology of the pro HM150. The only thing missing in the PX100 is live streaming--which from my experience with the 650 requires a solid LTE connection.

Switched to iMovie for PX100 editing from FCP X because the clarity of the slo-mo seems much better.

Slo-mo isn't just for sports! Here's how slmo-mo can be used with birds that simply have some fast movements:




Here's a link to the new pro 2160p camcorder with the Nikon F-mount.

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Old July 10th, 2013, 11:09 AM   #34
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

By accident I found iMovie to produce better quality slo-mo (image upscaled to 720p) than FCP X. This got me to using iMovie again after a year with FCP X. Surprise -- with the "pro" functions added to FCP X it has gotten more complicated and it doesn't play H.264 as well (unless you background render a proxy) as does iMovie (which is always realtime). Specifically, iMovie plays 1080p60 fine on a MBP AIR!

Once again I found iMovie simpler, faster, and easier editing. But, I missed the precision Mark IN/OUT trimming and the JKL functionality of FCP X. And, from the Media Composer, I missed EZ 3-point editing.

After much research I was able to document ALL these functions for iMovie. Therefore, I added this material to my "iMovie 11 Editing Guide."

If you use iMovie -- and especially if you have become less enchanted with FCP X -- try the new version of my eBook. Then, please send email with your feedback to me.

PS 1: iMovie supports placing the Viewer on an HDTV via HDMI which provides much more editing real-estate on a laptop.

PS 2: With the PX100 be sure to shoot H.264 video with ACC audio -- not 96kHz LPCM for use in iMovie.

Thank you, Steve
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Old July 12th, 2013, 12:43 AM   #35
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Finally my "low light" tests:

ALL SHOT AT 1/60th Second.

0dB gain, +6dB gain, +12dB gain, +18dB gain,and AGC which I assume is +24dB when at max gain.

The remaining 5 shots are AGC with 200W of light:

1) Pan in kitchen at wide.

2) CU of bottle as noise & chroma check since AGC would be at maximum.

3) Zoom out showing light gain at full Wide.

4) Zoom in showing light loss at full Tele.

5) Final kitty shot at wide.

LESSONS:

A) Do not shoot with low gain in low light.

B) Underexposed shadows have horrible noise.

C) Add light to dark shadows -- letting them go to black as one might with other cameras is not a good idea with the PX100.

D) Strangely, noise becomes lower as gain is increased to be adequate for the light level.

E) Simply always have AGC enabled. The camera will set gain to appropriate level -- nice feature.

F) Noise at +24dB is not too bad.

G) Shoot FULL wide in low-light.


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Old July 15th, 2013, 12:51 AM   #36
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

CORRECTIONS:

1) Using FCP X I can't remember what I did to get bad results and better results. :-(

2) I'm now not sure iMovie yields better slo-mo quality. But, it got me to rediscover iMovie!

3) iMovie cannot accept 96kHz audio. Shoot MP4.


ADDITIONS:

1) Because one can't set Project resolution when using iMovie, the first video clip of a project with slo-motion must be 1280x720.

2) The "noise" in my video at low light levels and at low gain is not "video" noise. I've seen this type of black crud noise when I mess with a gamma curve. I don't know what JVC was trying to accomplish. Maybe force dark shadows to full black to minimize noise and blocking. It certainly didn't work for me.

AGC, on the other hand, seems to actually control gain in proportion to the need to generate a signal that meets a MIN & MAX standard. By using what I assume is +24dB gain, shadows generally do not go dark and so they aren't converted to black crud. BUT, if you watch closely, using AGC as the lens zooms in, video noise and blocking does increase. (The darkest areas become crud.) Likewise, panning to a darker area in the kitchen causes video noise and blocking to increase.

Thus, the overall scene must be evenly illuminated for AGC to work. And not only must you stay Wide you must remember never to zoom in. The former I suspect limits creative lighting, i.e. mood lighting. OK -- it doesn't really! You must light the "dark" areas like film so noise and crud are never introduced. This becomes the shadow tone. The highlight tone must be about 6 stops brighter.

3) There is an instant Menu that works while shooting. Gain, however, is NOT on it!


TO DO:

1) AVCHD 1080i60 to YouTube and to both 1080i and 720p60 BD.

2) Time-lapse.

3) 240fps triggered by hummingbird coming to feed. Will the tiny bird be able to trigger the PX100?

4) I will take the camera up in a light plane to test the two stabilization modes: OIS and OIS+EIS. Can I fly and shoot?
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Old July 22nd, 2013, 04:58 PM   #37
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Only have had time to shoot additional 240fps video. Putting it in an iMovie PIP works nicely as does panning with moving subject. Still soft, however, as one would expect. TIP: increase contrast and saturation of slo-mo video.

Share as 720p:

Share as 1080p:


Back to 1080p60 -- An out of tune band and my `84 Bertone X1/9:

Fairly accurate, for those who live in MN, AWB skin tone.

VERY little rolling-shutter on speeding car:
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Old August 3rd, 2013, 11:00 AM   #38
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Steve, it sounds like you are satisfied with the camera's performance. My experience has been the opposite, unfortunately.

First off, my ONLY reason for getting this camera was for the high speed, and specifically for the ability to zoom while recording. I couldn't care less about any of the other modes of this camera.

Now, I have shot some comparisons, literally side-by-side on a special tripod adapter, with my Casio EX-FH25 and also the Panasonic DMC-FZ200. In short, it's crap. The footage is just so muddy looking. Like you said, it could be acceptable for PIP, but that's not my intended use. So I have absolutely no use for this thing. I hoped to get something comparable to the Casio, but this really comes up short.

I have fiddled with the settings and have even tried different rendering settings to see if there was hidden quality in the footage. No joy - made no difference overall. I have not one single clip I wouldn't be embarrased to release on the public from this camera.

I think I paid $1,200 for it in Japan. It's the version without WiFi (model number GC-P100B), but identical in all other ways. It appears to me that the reported resolution in HS mode is not what I'm getting.

Not too happy with the Panasonic either. It is supposed to have higher than SD resolution at 100fps (I got PAL version). It doesn't look as good as the Casio (640x480) either, but I need to test a little more to see if I can squeeze out some more quality or not. I think it's pretty much all locked in settings once you go to a HS recording mode. The Panny looks better than the JVC, but that ain't saying much. How the JVC can get a 4.5 star rating out of 5 is a mystery to me.

One thing I have yet to test, is the JVC is supposed to do HD quality at 1080-60P. If I drop that on a 30fps timeline, I should get decent -2X slow-mo. Need to check that before I put it up for sale.

So, once again, I'm back to searching for the next step up in high-speed cameras. Casio had something going there but sales weren't high enough and they dropped the EX-FH20 and EX-FH25 models.

What I'm seeing from Sony is the NEX-FS700, the PMW-F5, and then the dedicated HS cameras like the ones from Fastec. But we're talking $20,000 - 25,000 now.
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Old August 3rd, 2013, 03:10 PM   #39
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

From the footage I've seen of the Pana at 120fps, it is far better and more useable for creative work.


The JVC seems best only for sports shooting. Which is its market.


But the real problem for the JVC is pricing. At $999, without the necessary $200 VF, it is more expensive than a BMPC. Of course, they don't meet the same needs -- the BMPC is low frame rate while the PX100 is high frame rate (which I prefer), but the image quality of the PC plus native ProRes 422HQ is substantially better.

And, with the BMCC now only $1999 -- there is yet another camera to choose from. Plus, the FZ200 at only $500.

All the Japanese companies may see the prosumers who bought their $1000 to $2000 high-end consumer camcorders move to other products.

The BMPC, which I'll soon review for Broadcast Engineering, can shoot 1080p24 and 1080p30 -- both of which YouTube supports as does BD. (60p distribution remains a problem -- so 60p typically becomes 30p anyway.) The BMPC offers 13-stops of DR via log into ProRes -- and DR is where most consumer/prosumer camcorders fail. Of course, you'll need to buy an M43 zoom lens, but that need not be too expensive.
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Old August 5th, 2013, 02:59 PM   #40
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

"Steve, it sounds like you are satisfied with the camera's performance."

Generally, yes. But, when there are dark shadows the camera fills them with what looks like black mold. In the photo below, the person's face has has a "beard" of this artifact. (He doesn't have a beard at all.)

It doesn't seem like simple noise. To me it looks like the gamma curve at the low-end is too low forcing dark shadows to black. "Dark" is in relation to "bright." So the artifact is not only present in low-light situations -- it can be seen in the very dark shadows of bright outdoor scenes. Thankfully, I've only seen it in bright light a few times. Note, this may not show-up when the camera is directly connected by HDMI to an HDTV. But, it does once in an NLE.

In all other image aspects, the camera is great -- unless, you really need slo-mo. The FZ200 has 120fps nailed. (You can use 1080p60 as slo-mo in a 30fps track -- if your NLE will support this.)

PS: Until distribution supports 1080p60 if you want to work with progressive video, you either work with lower spatial resolution (720p60) or lower temporal resolution (1080p60 that becomes 1080p30). With the PX100 it might be better to shoot 720p60. Smaller files and easier streaming from YouTube.
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Old September 1st, 2013, 01:53 AM   #41
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

I shot some more comparisons with the JVC GC-P100B. I went out to a baseball park and shot some high speed clips with the JVC, Panasonic DMC-FZ200, Casio EX-FH25 and the Nikon Coolpix P510.

I found a few good things to say about the JVC.
The HDMI outputs clean video in record mode. Besides being able to zoom during record mode, you can also adjust the exposure level; over a range of +2.0 to -2.0. It shoots 1080-60P (but no 24P or 30P modes).

The DMC-FZ200 and the Nikon have an HDMI port but don't output during record. The Casio only has an A/V port, which I didn't test. The Nikon does not have a cold shoe or hot shoe. There's a GPS antenna on top where a cold shoe would be. So, mounting a sound recorder, monitor, etc is not possible.

I have reviewed the footage and can see where it might be possible to squeeze a little more image quality out of the JVC, but I feel like the resolution at 240fps is what's hurting it the most (640x360, 1Mbps bit rate). My better shots were possibly due to having the camera locked down on a tripod and not relying on any image stabilizing (which seems a bit weak in this camera), fine tuning the exposure level (use the dang zebra stripes and not the LCD), and make sure the subject is well lit.

NOTE: for some reason I don't get yet, the JVC has to shoot at 240fps to get 4x speed, while the other cameras get 4x at 120fps. Another JVC quirk or something with a technical explanation?

I wonder if it's possible to get anything better out of that HDMI output. I don't have a recorder, but if someone else can give some input here, please do.

I would think the Nikon, with its 1280x720 resolution @ 120fps would clearly outshine the others but I'm not getting any wow factor yet. Can't rule out operator error. (that white-tailed eagle looks very good) I might upload some test footage from this last slow-mo round-up if I can get something put together in the next week or so. I'm busy doing a non-paying project but it came with a nagging deadline.

That new release from JVC, the GY-HM70 had my interest. It does high speed at a set 300fps (so for JVC cameras I guess that's about 5x). Now, unless I go back up to the JVC Kenwood showroom in Tokyo and get a good play with one and can use my own memory card. I think I'll pass. The search for affordable (under $2,000) 4x slow-mo continues....


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Old September 19th, 2013, 10:51 PM   #42
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Mullen View Post
Here's a link to the new pro 2160p camcorder with the Nikon F-mount.

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That is a very strange decision by JVC - to use a nikon F mount that is..

You will not be able to use many other lenses on this camera as Nikon has one of the longest flange distances. Meaning any other adapter is going to place the lens to far away to achieve infinity focus. eg canon EF uses 44mm, Nikon F 46.5mm - you physically can't get the canon lens close enough to the sensor to achieve infinity focus.Moreover they made it a dumb mount so what's the advantage over something like an e-mount where there are a ton of adapters out there? Maybe I'm missing something through the translation - maybe it's a removable mount?
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Old September 21st, 2013, 07:53 AM   #43
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Watson View Post
...The search for affordable (under $2,000) 4x slow-mo continues...
Mark - have you thought about renting the FS700 when you need slow-mo? It's $429.95 for 3 days from Borrowlenses.

Cheers,

Bill
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Old September 21st, 2013, 10:09 AM   #44
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Bill,

No, I have never considered renting camera gear. I am on international travel several months out of the year and just didn't think it feasible. I sent BorrowLenses an e-mail to see what they say. If they will ship it to me in one country and let me keep it for a few weeks, then ship back from a different country, that would be great. I offered to give a deposit for purchase value, so I hope they can accomodate me. Three weeks rental of the camera plus the E-mount 18-200mm lens is about $1,500. Now I have to look at the manual and see what I can do in 120fps mode. I know there's a time limit (8 seconds?) on the high-speed recordings but not sure about whether the camera automatically adjusts to maintain proper exposure, etc.

Also, there was no mention of a shoulder strap. I kind of need that shoulder strap....

Thanks for the suggestion, Bill.

Mark
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Old November 2nd, 2013, 02:25 PM   #45
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Re: Information on the new JVC GC-PX100

Thanks for the detailed info! I was looking at this camera from the opposite view. a 35mbs knock about to import to 24p timeline in FCPX. The real knobs and switches with ND filter to bring to 1/48th or 1/50th in manual or at least shutter priority mode. How easy is it? Results? 1080 or720p makes little difference to me. I wanted this as a good fun B camera to my JVC HD110 with my 17x lens (breaths new life into my old JVC by the way) Dropped edge enhancment to almost nothing and looks sharper at it's fuzziest as the old 16x was at it's sharpest. This PX100 or top of the consumer line Canon might be a fun knock about B camera without going to a Blackmagic Pocet camera with lens for twice as much.

So questions.

1. ND filter to get 1/48th or 1/50th shutter? (manaul/shutter priority etc) possible with what ND?
2. 35mbs at 1080/720 60fps to drop into a 24p (23.98) FCPX timeline. best method?
3. For a 24p person how is this say vs a top end Canon consumer with 24p Native knee jerk reaction?

thanks

a
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