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Old March 9th, 2014, 06:20 PM   #1
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Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

Hello all... just a curious survey... how many of us are still shooting on tape? I am still shooting DVCAM for my SD events, and HDV on my XH-A1s for HD events.... Every time I think about a tapeless workflow, I get hung up on the archive aspect... I like to keep my footage basically indefinately... ie if I took the time to shoot it then its worth something to save it...

Sure I can shoot tapeless , copy it to hard drives ,but for REAL long term storage , then I would need to roll it out to LTO or SDLT backup, and then I ask... why not just start with tape in the first place? :)

thanks all
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Old March 10th, 2014, 08:54 AM   #2
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

David,
I don't shoot any tape these days but agree with your understanding of long term storage. LTO seems to be the answer but no one really wants to pay for it very often. I think Sony also has something going on with Blu Laser disks but still costly when shooting terabytes of material for a project.
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Old March 10th, 2014, 09:15 AM   #3
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

Hi Dave,

Still using 2 HDV cameras, but have rented and borrowed AVCHD cameras on several occasions, and also have access to an Atomos Ninja 2 unit sometimes that can be used for recording longer stage events.

I agree, digital tape is great for archiving! I recently started capturing all of my old family miniDV tapes going back 15 years, all playing perfectly. Can't imagine having only the hard drive files this entire time, and trying to keep them SAFELY backed up to multiple drives and moving to NEW drives every few years since we all know that drives just don't last indefinitely. Ugh.

At least with my weddings and events, once the edit is delivered and approved, I don't need to keep the originals and those tapes gets re-purposed. But certainly there is a lot of footage that I do want/need to keep and when I move to tapeless cameras, that will be a challenge requiring some discipline and a change of workflow. I've been moving my hundreds of DV tapes from box to box and room to room around the house for years, knowing they are always there if and when I need them. Can't say the same for my old data files.

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Old March 10th, 2014, 12:53 PM   #4
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

I still shoot on DV and HDV tape, though I can and do go tapeless via FireWire and HDMI (different cameras).

Archiving is also the main reason I haven't gone over, much as I liked the Canon XF-305. I feel I have enough problem with archiving audio files on hard drives (I like to have several copies on different drives just in case) but at least the file sizes for 16 and 24 bit audio are manageable.

I have also shot to hard drive, then archived to DV or HDV tape. :-)
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Old March 10th, 2014, 06:41 PM   #5
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

I have an HDV camera but shoot to a recorder rather than tape. I made the decision to go away from tape. I only archive the finished product, not the cutting room floor.
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Old March 10th, 2014, 09:05 PM   #6
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

More than I would have guessed... :) yeah I considered the new 100gb BD writer that Lacie has... But again at (last time I checked)!$70 per disc it's not very enticing....

I am guessing my next move would be some sort of flash recorder that I can use with my XHA1S, etc.

Thanks all for the replies

I wonder how much longer DVCAM and dv tapes will be manufactured...?
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Old March 10th, 2014, 09:06 PM   #7
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

Colin...I agree with you and I can say that IF I go tapeless it will be the Canon XF300 ....
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Old March 11th, 2014, 02:35 AM   #8
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

I still use my tape based cameras but hardly ever use tape now. I've got an unwieldy pile of cards which require me opening a spreadsheet to find out what's on them and the pile of hard drives is growing. I suppose we just have to get used to losing the convenience - but - I do have some old tapes that won't play, I note! Something that will get worse. The time it would take to copy these before they die is scary!
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Old March 11th, 2014, 06:45 AM   #9
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

I use a Canon HV40 as a backup camera, but have moved to all digital.

I shoot with a Sony NX5 and Canon XA20 and also a GoPro sometimes. They all use SD media cards which are relatively affordable and I have about 20 of them in my drawer here.

I buy new ones as they fill up, and then also keep the files I need on a 2TB drive in my computer, which is backed up nightly to a 4TB Seagate that I got on sale for $150.

I should add, I've been tapeless more or less since Feb 2011 and my 2TB HD has about 500 GB space left. Eventually I'll have to add another one or clean out some folders and files... I'll probably do that first actually.
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Old March 12th, 2014, 06:21 PM   #10
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

Still shoot on tape using my old trusty Z1 when I can. For any HD job I'll hire a cam to suit.
Tapes from 20 odd years ago still play with no problems, always used new tapes and keep them in a dry environment.
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Old March 13th, 2014, 03:54 AM   #11
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

Even though my main camera is the XF305, the HV30 still gets pressed into service frequently, especially if I'm out with my 7D kit. It's such a small camera with excellent looking video. I have the XL-H1A also. I will keep it until I can get something better with interchangeable lenses. With the 6X wide angle HD lens the image is really nice. For long distance work, the 1.4x extender + 100-400mm EF lens can get me there. I also have an older Panasonic AG-DVC30 (1/4" CCD sensor(s?). It only shoots SD, but is great quality gear, and has the IR modes too.

I had trouble with dropped frames when capturing HDV at first, but once I upgraded to a Sager laptop, I've never had another dropped frame. For a little future-proofing, I got a CF-based recorder with the firewire input (Focus FS-CF). Works good, but don't intend to use it much until I really need to.

I only shoot on new Sony HDV tapes. They're still available around here, but never see a price drop.

I need to recapture all my tapes and do a proper indexing.

It's been over a year since I got the XF305 and I have to admit, I don't like the workflow for transferring the files off the CF cards using Canon's XF Utility program. I don't like to be interrupted when transferring a card. Afraid I'll mix up my cards and format the one I haven't downloaded yet. Hasn't happened yet, but came close once or twice. Unnerving man.

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Old March 13th, 2014, 04:13 AM   #12
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

After many years of using various tape formats , miniDV for the last 15 years or so , I experimented with file based acquisition and found it to be a PITA .

Hence , I have gone over to HDV tape and have my familiar and reliable workflow back , without needing an expensive computer upgrade .
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Old March 13th, 2014, 07:08 AM   #13
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

I'm still using my two HDV cameras, an XH-A1S and the older XH-A1, but haven't used a tape in several months. Now I just use two DataVideo DN-60 recorders with CF cards.

My workflow HDV workflow is the same as it was with tapes, except I now copy files from the cards instead of capturing tapes. Copying 2 hours 24 minutes of footage from a 32 gig CF card takes 20 minutes.

I handle the clip naming in Avid, and all the bins etc. the same as I did with tape. I treat clips from a single CF card the same as I did from a single tape.

For example 20140313A1001 would be clip 1, card 1, from camera A, recorded today. Old method was exactly the same, just substitute tape for card.

As for shooting, I've experienced far fewer glitches (nearly zero!) with the cards than with tape. No dropouts whatsoever. No missed shots from waiting for tape to come up to speed or from being in the middle of changing tapes etc. The rare glitches from the card are sort of operator error or quirks of not exactly using the system the way it was designed to be used.
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Old March 13th, 2014, 01:24 PM   #14
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Derek Heeps View Post
After many years of using various tape formats , miniDV for the last 15 years or so , I experimented with file based acquisition and found it to be a PITA .

Hence , I have gone over to HDV tape and have my familiar and reliable workflow back , without needing an expensive computer upgrade .
Hoots mon, another McLuddite on DVinfo! "Ye'll have used yir tape, Dougal!"

(Actually, I use new ones - still have a good supply).
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Old March 15th, 2014, 09:59 AM   #15
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Re: Survey - how many of us still shooting on tape?

I still use my VX2000 for the archival videos I shoot for a local theater group. So I buy Panasonic PQ tapes as I always have. I also have an EX1 and I have to say, the VX2000 is more user friendly. I also like that I can store the tapes unlike the EX1 where I have to store the footage on hard drives. Then if I need them again I have to convert the raw footage first before I can edit it.

John
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