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Old June 16th, 2007, 12:21 PM   #91
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Tape brands

I think one key thing is that once you've settled on a brand of tape, stick with it. I've found that mixing brands can often lead to a battle between the dry lubricants used and subsequent head clogging issues. Personally, I'm using the Panasonic AMQ tapes with excellent results.
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Old June 19th, 2007, 06:47 PM   #92
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Canon HDV 63 min

Canon gave me a HDV 63 min tape with the camera which I used right away. I read many articles about using different brands and all of them said you should stick to one type.. so the only tape my camera will have inside is the Canon HDV 63 min. I don't mind though coz everything I use is Canon made anyway.

-John
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Old June 20th, 2007, 12:58 AM   #93
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1)
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Originally Posted by John B. Nelson View Post
so the only tape my camera will have inside is the Canon HDV 63 min.-- -John
Found any good place to buy them?

2) What do you (others) think about re-recording tapes?

3) Thanks, Scooter, for the thread. Very helpful.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 03:25 AM   #94
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In Europe, my experience is that you don't find HDV tapes easily in the shops, brands like Panasonic & JVC are really nowhere on the shelf. Forget Canon completely.

Sony and TDK are the only obvious ones, as I see. And to be honest: for 99% consumer ranges only.

If you find real HDV tapes, mostly in a very, very specialized (and expensive) pro-video shops: they wear excessive price tags.

I'm very interested in any test/review/report that proves on a hard scientific basis that the use of type of tapes is really worth this money. Never found anything on the internet... which is strange.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 03:35 AM   #95
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In Europe, my experience is that you don't find HDV tapes easily in the shops---
No, only in specialized photo web shops and local video rental companies. Maybe we can help each other find good 'discount' web shops in Europe, avoiding customs (the trade union really works, eh?)

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I'm very interested in any test/review/report---
I am too.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 08:08 AM   #96
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As with optical media, only a few companies manufacture tape. A lot of companies put their name on tape made for them by others. At one time Canon labeled tape was from Panasonic. Not sure who makes it today.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 08:19 AM   #97
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A known fact... for which I would like to see the 'scientific based' comparison, as stated.

(in Europe): I compared the Canon tape that came with the XH A1 with a Sony premium tape: tape cases are COMPLETELY IDENTICAL in every detail the same. If it should really be the same tape inside... price difference of factor 5 - 6X ?

I also discovered that the TDK tape sold over here is nearly identical with some (extremely bad) EMTEC DV tapes I bought a few years ago. While a german website has done comparisons between Sony/TDK & Fuji, and discovered that the cases were exactly the same between Sony & TDK.

The tapes I had were clearly different. Potentialy: the real manufacturer is even different per country and/or region.

But... even if the manufacturer is the same, it still doesn't tell anything about the tape inside. There might still be a huge difference in basic param's & quality control.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 08:27 AM   #98
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even if the manufacturer is the same... there might still be a huge difference in basic param's & quality control.
Absolutely yes there is. Tape is manufactured in rolls of big wide sheets, like aluminum foil or plastic wrap. Then it's thinly sliced, like pieces of sandwich meat. Slices coming from the middle of the roll are higher quality than the slices coming from the ends of the roll. Those middle slices are packaged, branded and sold as higher-grade, more expensive tape relative to the rest of the roll.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 01:51 PM   #99
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sony dvc tapes and canon A1

just wondering if anyone had used sony's standard bottom of the line mini-dvc tapes, the ones that come in the blue package (DVM60PRL), with the A1. I've got a few day shoot where the footage is going to be sped up for a time lapse effect so I will be using a lot of tapes. Anyone have problems with these?
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Old June 20th, 2007, 02:17 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by Chris Hurd View Post
Absolutely yes there is. Tape is manufactured in rolls of big wide sheets, like aluminum foil or plastic wrap. Then it's thinly sliced, like pieces of sandwich meat. Slices coming from the middle of the roll are higher quality than the slices coming from the ends of the roll. Those middle slices are packaged, branded and sold as higher-grade, more expensive tape relative to the rest of the roll.
Is there or is there not an actually difference in the tape itself between lower and higher grades. For example, are the recording particles different and is the substrate stronger or weaker?

Also, is there by chance a chart somewhere someone has created that compares the different qualities and brands of tape and the lubricants used (and perhaps groups them by similarity or compatability)?

I am going to buy and XH-A1 this week and have the dilemma about which tape to use.

I narrowed it down to the following three:
Panasonic DVM63AMQ ($6.95 each)
Sony DVM-63HD ($9.35 each)
JVC ProHD ($9.05 each)

How do I know what the differences are? How do I know which is most suitable to my purpose -- which is documentary, in regular weather as well as snow, with plane travel?

Why is the Panasonic tape cheaper?

Why is there another group of tapes from Sony and Pansonic that is 1-1/2 to 2 times the cost of these?

I am leaning toward the Pansonic for cost, since I will use quite a bit of tape. Currently I use Sony Premium in a PD150 and the JVC ProHD in a JVC HD110.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 09:31 PM   #101
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Canon XH-A1 recomended Tape

Canon recommends the Panasonic AY-DVM63AMQ tapes for the XH-A1. I asked them point blank and they immediately suggested the Panasonic AY-DVM63AMQ for the best results. I am not aware of any problems using this tape and I know many users.
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Old June 20th, 2007, 09:43 PM   #102
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Why are some HDV Tapes Cheaper?

Sony and JVC own the HDV format. They can use the HDV Logo freely. Maxell, Fuji and Panasonic have tapes suitable for HDV in plain plastic boxes with HDV on the label, but not the HDV logo. This saves them money as they are not paying for the official logo use to JVC and Sony.

Some tapes have more uniform metal evaporated particles and some have more particle density. Some tapes have double coating and some are center cuts to avoid tape curl. Some tapes use ABS Anti-Static Plastic Housings to avoid drop out caused from static charges built up by internal friction and so on. Tapes are not all the same at all. They should not be selected by high or low price, but rather based on quality and reliability. In HDV a good tape is more essential to prevent trouble than with DV. This makes sense as more information is being coded on to the tape.
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Old June 21st, 2007, 01:03 AM   #103
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1) Just to be sure: the A1 can't play tapes recorded with DVCAM, right?

2) I think I'll go for the Pan AMQ tapes for my A1, but I have about 10 tapes recorded with a Z1-E (HDV), and if I would have to recapture them to the computer with my A1 (they do play) and then go back to the Pan tapes, should I use a cleaning tape in between, and in that case, a wet or a dry cleaning tape?
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Old June 21st, 2007, 08:02 AM   #104
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Ahhhhh, the good old days of white-box reel-to-reel blank tape. Companies would buy bulk tape, spool it on reels and put it in a box. VHS tape is sold to video service houses on 17,500 ft long pancakes, 5 to a box for respooling.

The package we buy is comprise of three major components, the tape, a cassette, and a case, all could come from different manufacturers. Spell it outsourcing.

FWIW, Panasonic and JVC are both units of Matsushita. So they have a unique ability to share technology, etc. when it suites their parent corporation's purposes.

Back a number of years ago (maybe 12-14 or so) there was a trade magazine that published detailed technical reviews of analog video tape (VHS and 8-mm) over two issues. Have not seen anything like that since.

From a Mar 2000 web site referenced on Wikipedia: "Generally speaking, Panasonic Digital Media manufactures about 70% of DV media, Sony manufactures 25% and TDK manufactures 5%. These figures are approximate and of course subject to change. I know Maxell and Fuji have DV and DVCPRO tape brands, I would expect these manufacturers to enter the game very soon if they are not already as both have a history of providing media."
"What I can find from direct experience of these OEM arrangements is that Panasonic makes Canon and JVC tape. Sony makes its own tape. TDK makes its own. I do not know who makes Fuji, Maxell or other tape brands." Again, that is older info, so thing have no doubt changed somewhat.

And who knows what is coming from China these days. They seem to make everything.
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Old June 21st, 2007, 08:47 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Urban Skargren View Post
1) Just to be sure: the A1 can't play tapes recorded with DVCAM, right?
I had to capture some material supplied on DVCAM tapes recently and assumed they wouldn't work in my A1. The last thing I wanted to do was put somebody elses tapes in my A1 anyway but unfortunately I didn't have the time to mess around trying to hire a DVCAM deck so gave it a shot anyway - they played back perfectly. I wondered if they might just contain DV footage on DVCAM tapes so tried to play them in a JVC MiniDV cam and they wouldn't play back at all so they must have been in a format other than standard DV.

I wouldn't like to say DVCAM definately plays in the A1, but it certainly looked that way.
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