Is this to be expected? at DVinfo.net

Deke Ryland · April 13th, 2007, 06:59 PM

Hey guys...

I am doing some encoding using QuickTime 7 Pro and the H.264 codec on some video clips so I can put them on the web.

My source footage is 15 mins of HDV 1440x1080... but was exported as Quicktime Uncompressed, making the source file 128 GB.

I am taking that uncompressed HDV footage (128 GB) and using that in QT7Pro to export a 800x450 H.264 encoding with a bitrate of about 1200 kbs.

Is it normal for QT7Pro to take about 8-9+ hours to encode this single file?

I am really worried that it is taking so long, considering I purchased a Intel Quad-Core QX6700 (best on market) workstation, with 4 GB RAM, etc.

Are these super long encode times sound right to you? I am new to encoding so I really have no idea what is the norm with something like this. So I thought I would ask you guys. Thanks for any help on this. Take care.

Chris Harris · April 13th, 2007, 07:25 PM

I don't know, I use a combination of Compressor and MPEG Streamclip. I can't imagine ever waiting 8-9 hours to encode a 15 minute clip for my purposes. I'm curious, why don't you use Compressor to do a direct H.264 export? Or, if you're intent on exporting as uncompressed first, try MPEG Streamclip instead of QT Pro. It works a lot better, in my experience.

Deke Ryland · April 13th, 2007, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Harris

I'm curious, why don't you use Compressor to do a direct H.264 export? Or, if you're intent on exporting as uncompressed first, try MPEG Streamclip instead of QT Pro. It works a lot better, in my experience.

Hey Chris... Unfortunately I'm on a Windows XP machine. I'm not sure what to make of the encoding time. So you think it is suspect?

Chris Harris · April 13th, 2007, 09:59 PM

Oh I'm sorry, I assumed that since this is the Mac forum, and you mentioned an Intel Quad Core, that you were talking about a Mac Pro. Well, regardless, there's a version of MPEG Streamclip for the PC, and it's a free program, so I'd give it a try, I suspect you'll get better results. Those encoding times do seem pretty slow to me. I've done encoding similar to what you're talking about on my Mac Pro, substituting MPEG Streamclip instead of QT Pro, and it certainly doesn't take anywhere near that long. Give it a try and report back! I'm curious to see how it works out, and if the results are satisfactory.

Charles Hurley · April 13th, 2007, 11:28 PM

Yes, that is correct. In fact 8 hours seems quick. H264 render times tend to get longer as it goes so what starts out as 8 can easily turn into 16. May I ask what you hope to gain by blowing an HDV movie out to 128Gigs? That data rate is so huge I doubt you can even watch it on non raid systems, all you're doing is creating huge amounts of redundant data, and then to recompress it? Whatever your mad scheme is good luck with it.

Chris Harris · April 14th, 2007, 12:18 AM

8 hours seems quick for a 15 minute H.264 clip on his machine? I'm not sure I agree. Perhaps I'm not very picky over quality and I'm doing something wrong, but a 15 minute file would take my machine somewhere around 20 to 30 minutes on a single pass.

Charles Hurley · April 14th, 2007, 01:23 AM

I agree that mpeg streamclip is much faster than FCP or compressor. I just did this recently with a MBP and a 15 minute uncompressed DVCPROHD movie 13 GB took 11 hours using compressor@2000mbps 1920x1080. Dude is working with 128GB, again, 128GB. You can barely copy that much info in 30 minutes let alone compress it to h264. ffmegx and mpeg streamclip are both great alternatives, for some reason apple's transcoders are all really slow.

Deke Ryland · April 14th, 2007, 06:31 AM

Hey guys... I'm really new to video editing, but I thought since I am editing HDV natively that I would want to export to a lossless format so there wouldn't be any unnecessary generational loss by the time I get it to QT7Pro to export for the web.

Is this thinking sound? What would you guys suggest I do when I am done and finished with my final sequence in my editor?

Joff B. Rein · April 14th, 2007, 02:18 PM

put it in compessor (or qt) choose a standard qt7web stream-output around 1000kbits/sec (maybe too heavy for home users, standard is more around 500kbits/sec for web)

render time max. 1 hour?

Boyd Ostroff · April 14th, 2007, 02:23 PM

Moderator note: this has been moved from the Mac forum to the PC forum since Deke is actually using Quicktime on a PC.

Michael Y Wong · April 15th, 2007, 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deke Ryland

Is this thinking sound? What would you guys suggest I do when I am done and finished with my final sequence in my editor?

Export back to the same HDV format as your original capture. Provided you are not re-editing multiple generations of video clips (can not see why you would) the output will look fine. 15 MINs hdv 1080i should be about 3 gigs, NOT 128, that is just ridiculous. Even using cineform 'uncompressed' (i am using that term VERY loosely) @ its highest quality the clip is about 10 gigs.

How can it be 128 gigs? Are you exporting to some sort of raw format?

Deke Ryland · April 15th, 2007, 09:03 PM

Hey Michael,

The 128 GB is the result of exporting to Apple.None (uncompressed).

So you suggest exporting my final timeline to an HDV MPEG? Wouldn't that encoding an MPEG from the original MPEG? See, I thought this was not recommended because it would produce "generational loss" from the original footage captured from the camera. Or am I making to big a deal about this?

Because my projects are destined for the web only, and quality of picture and high resolution is of high importance for what I am doing, I am just trying to provide Sorenson Squeeze or QT7Pro the most pristine export possible from my editor. Of course, this uncompressed export files (like my 128 GB file), isn't optimal. So I am looking for the next best thing.

I have done so much research to try to find out what format people export their HDV MPEG projects to, with the intent of taking that exported file to QT7Pro/Sorenson for re-encoding for the web.

So you think MPEG is the way to go?

Michael Y Wong · April 15th, 2007, 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deke Ryland

Or am I making to big a deal about this?

So you think MPEG is the way to go?

Definately (2 both questions).

I archive back my edited HDV back to m2t tape. Looks great imo, and I'm sure many many other woudl think so too.

Furhtermore if you are encoding to the web, there is no way anyone will notice the difference with what you are doing as the resolution of your web output will be a fraction of it's original resolution.

I say encode it back to HDV, and or some other manageable file size, and work from there.

Chris Harris · April 15th, 2007, 09:18 PM

I export my HDV projects using the HDV codec for archiving. They look great.

Deke Ryland · April 15th, 2007, 10:02 PM

Wow... that would be great if there wasn't much quality loss in the picture exporting back to HDV MPEG.

So just to make sure I have this right... I capture my HDV from my camera, add it all to my timeline, finish my sequence and go to File->Export->Adobe Media Encoder, and then I choose MPEG-2.

Since I am using these exported files to make web encodings, do I set the pixel aspect ratio to 1.0 Square or do I keep it at the 1.333 HD Anamorphic? I never understood that. Thanks so much for your help and guidance guys.

April 13th, 2007, 06:59 PM	#1
Deke Ryland Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Washington, USA Posts: 213	Is this to be expected? Hey guys... I am doing some encoding using QuickTime 7 Pro and the H.264 codec on some video clips so I can put them on the web. My source footage is 15 mins of HDV 1440x1080... but was exported as Quicktime Uncompressed, making the source file 128 GB. I am taking that uncompressed HDV footage (128 GB) and using that in QT7Pro to export a 800x450 H.264 encoding with a bitrate of about 1200 kbs. Is it normal for QT7Pro to take about 8-9+ hours to encode this single file? I am really worried that it is taking so long, considering I purchased a Intel Quad-Core QX6700 (best on market) workstation, with 4 GB RAM, etc. Are these super long encode times sound right to you? I am new to encoding so I really have no idea what is the norm with something like this. So I thought I would ask you guys. Thanks for any help on this. Take care.

April 14th, 2007, 02:18 PM	#9
Joff B. Rein New Boot Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Amsterdam Holland Posts: 15	put it in compessor (or qt) choose a standard qt7web stream-output around 1000kbits/sec (maybe too heavy for home users, standard is more around 500kbits/sec for web) render time max. 1 hour? __________________ digit

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April 13th, 2007, 07:25 PM	#2
Chris Harris Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 487	I don't know, I use a combination of Compressor and MPEG Streamclip. I can't imagine ever waiting 8-9 hours to encode a 15 minute clip for my purposes. I'm curious, why don't you use Compressor to do a direct H.264 export? Or, if you're intent on exporting as uncompressed first, try MPEG Streamclip instead of QT Pro. It works a lot better, in my experience.

April 13th, 2007, 09:59 PM	#4
Chris Harris Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 487	Oh I'm sorry, I assumed that since this is the Mac forum, and you mentioned an Intel Quad Core, that you were talking about a Mac Pro. Well, regardless, there's a version of MPEG Streamclip for the PC, and it's a free program, so I'd give it a try, I suspect you'll get better results. Those encoding times do seem pretty slow to me. I've done encoding similar to what you're talking about on my Mac Pro, substituting MPEG Streamclip instead of QT Pro, and it certainly doesn't take anywhere near that long. Give it a try and report back! I'm curious to see how it works out, and if the results are satisfactory.

April 13th, 2007, 11:28 PM	#5
Charles Hurley Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Brooklyn NY Posts: 128	Yes, that is correct. In fact 8 hours seems quick. H264 render times tend to get longer as it goes so what starts out as 8 can easily turn into 16. May I ask what you hope to gain by blowing an HDV movie out to 128Gigs? That data rate is so huge I doubt you can even watch it on non raid systems, all you're doing is creating huge amounts of redundant data, and then to recompress it? Whatever your mad scheme is good luck with it.

April 14th, 2007, 12:18 AM	#6
Chris Harris Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 487	8 hours seems quick for a 15 minute H.264 clip on his machine? I'm not sure I agree. Perhaps I'm not very picky over quality and I'm doing something wrong, but a 15 minute file would take my machine somewhere around 20 to 30 minutes on a single pass.

April 14th, 2007, 01:23 AM	#7
Charles Hurley Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Brooklyn NY Posts: 128	I agree that mpeg streamclip is much faster than FCP or compressor. I just did this recently with a MBP and a 15 minute uncompressed DVCPROHD movie 13 GB took 11 hours using compressor@2000mbps 1920x1080. Dude is working with 128GB, again, 128GB. You can barely copy that much info in 30 minutes let alone compress it to h264. ffmegx and mpeg streamclip are both great alternatives, for some reason apple's transcoders are all really slow.

April 14th, 2007, 06:31 AM	#8
Deke Ryland Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Washington, USA Posts: 213	Hey guys... I'm really new to video editing, but I thought since I am editing HDV natively that I would want to export to a lossless format so there wouldn't be any unnecessary generational loss by the time I get it to QT7Pro to export for the web. Is this thinking sound? What would you guys suggest I do when I am done and finished with my final sequence in my editor?

April 14th, 2007, 02:23 PM	#10
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	Moderator note: this has been moved from the Mac forum to the PC forum since Deke is actually using Quicktime on a PC.

April 15th, 2007, 09:03 PM	#12
Deke Ryland Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Washington, USA Posts: 213	Hey Michael, The 128 GB is the result of exporting to Apple.None (uncompressed). So you suggest exporting my final timeline to an HDV MPEG? Wouldn't that encoding an MPEG from the original MPEG? See, I thought this was not recommended because it would produce "generational loss" from the original footage captured from the camera. Or am I making to big a deal about this? Because my projects are destined for the web only, and quality of picture and high resolution is of high importance for what I am doing, I am just trying to provide Sorenson Squeeze or QT7Pro the most pristine export possible from my editor. Of course, this uncompressed export files (like my 128 GB file), isn't optimal. So I am looking for the next best thing. I have done so much research to try to find out what format people export their HDV MPEG projects to, with the intent of taking that exported file to QT7Pro/Sorenson for re-encoding for the web. So you think MPEG is the way to go?

April 15th, 2007, 09:18 PM	#14
Chris Harris Major Player Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 487	I export my HDV projects using the HDV codec for archiving. They look great.

April 15th, 2007, 10:02 PM	#15
Deke Ryland Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Washington, USA Posts: 213	Wow... that would be great if there wasn't much quality loss in the picture exporting back to HDV MPEG. So just to make sure I have this right... I capture my HDV from my camera, add it all to my timeline, finish my sequence and go to File->Export->Adobe Media Encoder, and then I choose MPEG-2. Since I am using these exported files to make web encodings, do I set the pixel aspect ratio to 1.0 Square or do I keep it at the 1.333 HD Anamorphic? I never understood that. Thanks so much for your help and guidance guys.