Using a secondary camera to save wear on tape transports?

Ray Echevers · June 30th, 2004, 01:28 PM

What's mossaic noise anyway, and i'm assuming it's bad? Does it affect the quality or image in the transfer/capture?

What would you guys recommend?
Save up to eventually get a deck (which one is the best bang for buck) or go with a minidv camera? (which one would work great along side the VX-2100)

Mike Rehmus · June 30th, 2004, 02:00 PM

the mosaic noise is the block-like structures you see in the image. Yes, it makes the image unusable.

The choice of an input deck is a matter of work volume. If I were an amateur, I'd just use my camera and forget about it.

As a professional user, I elected to get a deck from the get-go. I have both large and small cameras and some record in DV and others in DVCam mode.

And I process a LOT of tapes in a year. So the DSR-20 was my choice (the 11 didn't exist then) and it has been great. The DSR-25 with the little LCD panel would be even greater but that's not enough reason to switch.

AT $2000 to $3000, the Sony deck approach is a serious committment.

I've purchased the JVC DV/S-VHS decks for use in the local community college cinema program. AFAIK, they've never given a second's problem and they do make killer dubs. Furthermore, they will convert VHS and S-VHS to DV on the way in or DV to VHS and S-VHS on the way back out if you want.

Not a feature that was even documented in the manual or literature but it works very well. You just have to set the buttons correctly. At $1300 each they were, I think, good buys since we couldn't afford 4 of the Sonys.

Matt Stahley · June 30th, 2004, 03:59 PM

I Use a Canon ZR80 for transfer deck for my VX2k recorded tapes all works well. This is more of a convenience factor for me as I always have it hooked up to my mac and tv so its just a matter of loading the tapes and not having to hook and un hook up my cams each time i need to capture something. If I could afford a Sony deck at this time and my workload required it I would be all over it but such is not the case at the moment.

Steve McDonald · June 30th, 2004, 04:34 PM

I picked up the consumer version of the JVC DV/S-VHS dual-deck and the Sony GV-D1000 mini-DV VTR for about the same total price as one DSR11. They both run flawlessly so far. The JVC doesn't display timecode frames or datacode, but it does record them and they can be displayed if the tape is played in the Sony VTR. The 4-inch viewscreen is very handy on the Sony for displaying the timecode and eliminates the need for a 2nd monitor with VCR editing. It's very nice to not have to drag out a camcorder and set it up to do editing, copying or still-picture capturing.

Steve McDonald

Peter Jefferson · July 1st, 2004, 04:32 AM

hmm..
u know, i used to get drop outs until i started wnding my tapes PRIOR to recording.. basically just FF and RWD them.

This allows for a tensioning of the tape to be set by the camera.. not the tape manufacturers winding machines (which is usualy VERY tight anyways)...

Since i started doing this i have zero drop outs on my DVX usng MQ tapes. (knock on wood it stays that way)

I also use an MX500 which never has problems but also doubles as a capture deck. I also have a small DS88 when doing multiple captures at once, with intermittent drop outs.. i think its the 1394 connection though..

Matthew Eastwood · July 1st, 2004, 11:06 PM

good point.
unless you have FireWire 800 inputs, dropouts are always possible. FireWire 400 is not perfect, not by a long shot.

BTW, i use a Sony DCR-TRV19 miniDV camera as my "deck" and have had no problems. it was like $300 at Circuit City. Plays tapes from my XL1s just fine, as well as miniDV tapes recorded as DVCAM.

June 30th, 2004, 01:28 PM	#16
Ray Echevers Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: Somerville, MA Posts: 148	What's mossaic noise anyway, and i'm assuming it's bad? Does it affect the quality or image in the transfer/capture? What would you guys recommend? Save up to eventually get a deck (which one is the best bang for buck) or go with a minidv camera? (which one would work great along side the VX-2100) __________________ Sony VX-1000 G5 1.8 dual 91 Turbo MR2

June 30th, 2004, 02:00 PM	#17
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	the mosaic noise is the block-like structures you see in the image. Yes, it makes the image unusable. The choice of an input deck is a matter of work volume. If I were an amateur, I'd just use my camera and forget about it. As a professional user, I elected to get a deck from the get-go. I have both large and small cameras and some record in DV and others in DVCam mode. And I process a LOT of tapes in a year. So the DSR-20 was my choice (the 11 didn't exist then) and it has been great. The DSR-25 with the little LCD panel would be even greater but that's not enough reason to switch. AT $2000 to $3000, the Sony deck approach is a serious committment. I've purchased the JVC DV/S-VHS decks for use in the local community college cinema program. AFAIK, they've never given a second's problem and they do make killer dubs. Furthermore, they will convert VHS and S-VHS to DV on the way in or DV to VHS and S-VHS on the way back out if you want. Not a feature that was even documented in the manual or literature but it works very well. You just have to set the buttons correctly. At $1300 each they were, I think, good buys since we couldn't afford 4 of the Sonys. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

June 30th, 2004, 03:59 PM	#18
Matt Stahley Major Player Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Waynesboro, PA Posts: 648	I Use a Canon ZR80 for transfer deck for my VX2k recorded tapes all works well. This is more of a convenience factor for me as I always have it hooked up to my mac and tv so its just a matter of loading the tapes and not having to hook and un hook up my cams each time i need to capture something. If I could afford a Sony deck at this time and my workload required it I would be all over it but such is not the case at the moment.

June 30th, 2004, 04:34 PM	#19
Steve McDonald Major Player Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Eugene, Oregon Posts: 366	I picked up the consumer version of the JVC DV/S-VHS dual-deck and the Sony GV-D1000 mini-DV VTR for about the same total price as one DSR11. They both run flawlessly so far. The JVC doesn't display timecode frames or datacode, but it does record them and they can be displayed if the tape is played in the Sony VTR. The 4-inch viewscreen is very handy on the Sony for displaying the timecode and eliminates the need for a 2nd monitor with VCR editing. It's very nice to not have to drag out a camcorder and set it up to do editing, copying or still-picture capturing. Steve McDonald

July 1st, 2004, 04:32 AM	#20
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	hmm.. u know, i used to get drop outs until i started wnding my tapes PRIOR to recording.. basically just FF and RWD them. This allows for a tensioning of the tape to be set by the camera.. not the tape manufacturers winding machines (which is usualy VERY tight anyways)... Since i started doing this i have zero drop outs on my DVX usng MQ tapes. (knock on wood it stays that way) I also use an MX500 which never has problems but also doubles as a capture deck. I also have a small DS88 when doing multiple captures at once, with intermittent drop outs.. i think its the 1394 connection though..

July 1st, 2004, 11:06 PM	#21
Matthew Eastwood Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Lawrence, Kansas Posts: 40	good point. unless you have FireWire 800 inputs, dropouts are always possible. FireWire 400 is not perfect, not by a long shot. BTW, i use a Sony DCR-TRV19 miniDV camera as my "deck" and have had no problems. it was like $300 at Circuit City. Plays tapes from my XL1s just fine, as well as miniDV tapes recorded as DVCAM.