The gigantic "which camera should I buy" thread!

Mark Nevnor · October 4th, 2007, 11:55 AM

I'm aggrevated. I bought the Sony PDX10 3CCD 16:9 almost 3 years ago to film the beginning of my family. After only a year it developed a hot pixel 1/2 way down & 1/3 across from the left side. It's annoying & costs as much as the camera to fix. With the recent birth of my 3rd & last child, I want to make sure I capture the precious moments growing up, but the hot spot is distracting in low light.

My brother got the HC7 and the picture was great in HD, but I never saw what it could do in SD. For now I can only handle SD material with both my computer editing and TV payback. I'm assuming I can record everything in HD for archiving and down-convert to SD for viewing & editing now.

My problem is that I don't have the extra money to spend and it will be quite some time till I do. I socked $2300 into the PDX10 and would be lucky to get $900 out of it if it was in perfect condition. I can try to sell it through an auction and see what I can get for it, and if it's enough turn around & buy the HC5, but I'm not sure.

What would you do? How is the HC5 in SD?

Boyd Ostroff · October 4th, 2007, 12:56 PM

Too bad about the PDX-10. I know that Sony recalled a lot of cameras (still and video from various manufacturers) for defective CCD's. Have you investigated to see if the PDX-10 might be part of that? If so, the repair would be free. Probably worth a call to their service center - see the info here: http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Broadcastan...eCenters.shtml

I gave my PDX-10 to a friend last winter, but never noticed any CCD problems in the years I used it heavily. I think you will give up a lot of manual control by going to the HC series, not to mention the pro audio and DVCAM features. But if you're just doing family stuff that may not be an issue for you. The HVR-A1 is the heir apparent to the PDX-10... is that beyond your price range? http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Broadcastan...p=141&id=80897

Mark Nevnor · October 4th, 2007, 01:46 PM

Unfortunately it does not fall under the recall. It's a flat rate $550 for a repair plus shipping cost. The only reason I got the PDX10 at the time was because it was the only 3CCD native 16:9 on the market and had excellent auto features and better sound recording. I never used any of the manual features nor the DVCAM b/c I didn't notice a difference. I'd rather put the $550 towards an HC5 if the colors are equivalent or very close. Can anyone comment on this? Oh, and yes the HVR-A1 is too much but it looks sweet!

Thanks!

Mariano L. Honrado Jr. · October 7th, 2007, 05:44 AM

Next week my old reliable DCR TRV110 has been called upon to serve as a 'live feed' camera connected to a projector and show a live band performing in a wedding reception.

How do I prevent the camera from shutting down after 3 minutes (or going into DEMO mode), unless it is actually recording to tape? I don't need to record in the TRV110 because another camera/man is doing that. The manual says the TRV110 powers down to save on battery. Since I'm connected to the wall outlets, battery power is not an issue.

Would really appreciate any help.

Thank you and Mabuhay!

Mariano L. Honrado, Jr.

Edward Carlson · October 7th, 2007, 08:09 AM

If there isn't a tape in the camera, and it is on wall power, it should stay on. You can probably turn off the demo mode in the setup menu.

Mariano L. Honrado Jr. · October 7th, 2007, 09:38 AM

Edward:

Following your advice, the TRV 110 is still on! For anyone on the same path, the reminders are:

a) No tape
b) Powered from wall juice
c) Demo mode set to OFF in menus

Many thanks!

Mariano L. Honrado, Jr.

Kevin Crockett · October 11th, 2007, 11:19 AM

Just wondering if anyone knows if JVC or another manufacturer is planning to release a shoulder mount camcorder at a price point similar to the EX.

The EX seems like it will be a really good piece of gear but I really want a shoulder mount camera as well as organic tapeless recording.

An HD110 that records onto flash media would be ideal.

Any thoughts?

David Heath · October 11th, 2007, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kevin Crockett

An HD110 that records onto flash media would be ideal.

Any thoughts?

Or ideally one that records onto flash media (cheap - CF or SD, not SxS or P2) *AND/OR* tape. DV or HDV tape for times when solid state workflows just aren't appropiate, flash media for times when they are, and then higher than 25Mbs rates can be used.

The ability to record DV/HDV to tape, and the same bitstream to card may also be useful. The former for the archive, the latter for immediate use.

Kenneth Michiels · October 16th, 2007, 04:55 PM

Hello,

i'm planning to buy a new camera any day soon but I'm a bit of a newbie in the digital camera world. I currently own a Samsung VP-D303. The image and sound quality are far from good enough and I feel like moving to my next camera.
I will use this camera mainly as a filmstudent (for shortfilms and short documentaries) but also for other small projects such as commercial spots or video clips.
My budget is around €2500 (~ $3500).

The camera's I have in mind are:

- Canon xm2
- Sony HDR-SR8
- VC GZ-HD7

I also have a friend who sells his Canon XL1 for a small price. (~€1200)

Which camera would you suggest me to buy and why? Should I spend a little more and get another camera? Should I wait for new releases? HD or SD? Is the quality of built-in microphones good? Or should I get an extern one?

Who can help?

Regards,

Kenneth

Karl Heiner · October 16th, 2007, 05:35 PM

here are my thoughts:

just purchased a sony dcr hc7. everywhere between $ 1200 -1300, at amazon
$ 1050
i also have a xl1-s and was is needed for studio/ theater recordings. my long therm plan is to go to a 1/2 or even 2/3 ship, but as you know there is the big change to high definition and the prices are prohibitive for me...lol. also i wanted to cut down on equipment weight, but make experience within the new hd system at the same time. (have two contracts for the football and basketball season)
i suggest a "small" sony, (they have a lanc out) and spend some money on the right tripod, lcd monitor, a good remote control, hard case, items you could use with a "bigger" camcorder when you're ready.
the step into hd is not just the camcorder, editing software, cable and so on.

on the other hand there are plenty of dv camcorders on the market, used.
have my set in the classified, but nobody is interested.
the canon is a great camera to learn everything about video/ settings etc.

good luck

Dale Stoltzfus · October 16th, 2007, 05:36 PM

Kenneth,

I won't address the issue of SD vs HD right now. See this thread for that: http://dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=105583. There are many other threads to - just do a search.

BUT, if you do decide to go SD, I would look at two cameras: the Panasonic DVX100a/b and the Canon XL2. Either one can be had used for under $3500, at least here in the US (forgive me if this is not so in Belgium). Both cameras overcome (to one degree or another) one of the biggest problems with SD cams - 16x9. Expecially the XL2, which produces native 16x9. And both cams will do progressive, as well as 24pA, which will be a great boon to you in working on short films. I have an XL2 and, pared with the 16x manual lens, it is a phenomenal camera. I got the cam and lens for about $2600, BTW, both used from members of this forum.

However, if you choose to go HD, that's a whole different animal. I don't have any personal recommendations, but I suspect that you will get a ton of proponents for the Canon XH A1.

The quality of built in microphones is not only marginal, but their placement is as well. In other words, you need your mic up by the talent, not back at the camera! Invest in a small, sturdy mixer (such as the Sound Devices MixPre or 302), a decent shotgun mic (sorry, I don't have any recommendations there - Ty?), and a boom pole. Your sound will thank you.

Oh, and do you have a good tripod? Definitely a must.

Now, going with any of the three cams I mentioned plus audio equipment will probably put you over your stated budget (unless you can find one heck of a deal on the cam), but hopefully not too far over. Say you spend ~ $2700 for the cam, $665 for the MixPre, $500 for the tripod, and $400 for the mic and other misc audio equipment, that puts your total at ~ $4265. And that's with not spending anything on lighting (although with $80-$175 you could probably outfit yourself nicely with some DIY/worklight solutions).

If that's just to much money, you'll want to scale back a little on the cam, in which case I would recommend the Sony VX2100 or the more professional Sony PD170 over the XM2. However, none of those have good widescreen or progressive, so if your looking to make movies, I would try to stretch my budget a bit and get a DVX, XL2, or a prosumer HDV cam

Dale Stoltzfus · October 16th, 2007, 05:37 PM

Accidental double post. Sorry.

Danny Gilbert · October 20th, 2007, 08:13 AM

Hi all, I'm just about to get into the world of HDV and I have a big decision to make, I've read loads of threads so far about each camera and just can't decide.

The HV20 is £602 and the HC7 is £764 so straight away by going with the HV20 I'll of saved £162. The HV20 seems to have the better image quality from all the reviews that I've read, but that's not much of a decider for me. Both camera's have mic in and headphone jacks which is really important to me.

The HC7 also has a LANC socket, whereas the HV20 doesn't, what the heck were canon thinking??? The biggest decider though is the fact that sooner or later I'm going to be getting a Sony V1 and I have a feeling that the HC7 will match up better in the edit then the HV20, what are people's thoughts on this?

Also. I already have a genuine sony extended battery for the HC7 so that's another £70 that I won't need to spend if I get the HC7.

So a few second opinions would be really appreciated.

Thanks
Danny

Tom Hardwick · October 20th, 2007, 08:33 AM

Sounds like you've sussed it Danny - the Canon's the better camera but the Sony seems to be aimed at you rather better (LANC and batteries and possible V1 matching).

Thing is you'll be delighted with either camera, I'm pretty sure of that. And you already know this ~ YOU have far more of an influence over the final 'quality' of the film than either camera has. Both cameras are just inanimate lumps of glass and plastic and metal, full of potential energy, waiting for your creative input.

I think the Canon's looks are naff, and that zoom rocker stinks, but boy, are the test results amazing. Some great shots from it in this thread:

http://forums.dvdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=42775

The HC7 is a pain. You want to lock the exposure? Of course you do, but what a palarva of menu digging it requires. And don't leave it on auto outdoors - it selects f/4.5 and simply varies the shutter speed up and down to silly levels. Talk about stuttering footage.

Why not go for the V1 right now and cut your losses?

tom.

Karl Heiner · October 20th, 2007, 09:29 AM

since i work only of a tripod, a lanc connection is one most important feature to me.
and @ tom your right, the menu on the hc7 is something. i need a training class on that one....lol
unfortunately the accessories shoe does not take standard stuff, but i have videotaped 2 football games and the results are great. what i am really fighting with, is the smaller and flimsy tripod, have to get used to it, but i like the weight.
the lens is barley enough in regards of zooming in, but my idea for the hc7 was the upcoming basketball season.

October 4th, 2007, 11:55 AM	#1396
Mark Nevnor New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: O'Fallon, MO (St. Louis) Posts: 12	To go from Sony PDX10 to HDR-HC5? I'm aggrevated. I bought the Sony PDX10 3CCD 16:9 almost 3 years ago to film the beginning of my family. After only a year it developed a hot pixel 1/2 way down & 1/3 across from the left side. It's annoying & costs as much as the camera to fix. With the recent birth of my 3rd & last child, I want to make sure I capture the precious moments growing up, but the hot spot is distracting in low light. My brother got the HC7 and the picture was great in HD, but I never saw what it could do in SD. For now I can only handle SD material with both my computer editing and TV payback. I'm assuming I can record everything in HD for archiving and down-convert to SD for viewing & editing now. My problem is that I don't have the extra money to spend and it will be quite some time till I do. I socked $2300 into the PDX10 and would be lucky to get $900 out of it if it was in perfect condition. I can try to sell it through an auction and see what I can get for it, and if it's enough turn around & buy the HC5, but I'm not sure. What would you do? How is the HC5 in SD?

October 7th, 2007, 05:44 AM	#1399
Mariano L. Honrado Jr. New Boot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Manila, Philippines Posts: 8	Using a Sony DCR TRV110 as 'live feed' camera Next week my old reliable DCR TRV110 has been called upon to serve as a 'live feed' camera connected to a projector and show a live band performing in a wedding reception. How do I prevent the camera from shutting down after 3 minutes (or going into DEMO mode), unless it is actually recording to tape? I don't need to record in the TRV110 because another camera/man is doing that. The manual says the TRV110 powers down to save on battery. Since I'm connected to the wall outlets, battery power is not an issue. Would really appreciate any help. Thank you and Mabuhay! Mariano L. Honrado, Jr.

October 11th, 2007, 11:19 AM	#1402
Kevin Crockett Regular Crew Join Date: May 2004 Location: FL. Posts: 71	JVC Response To XD Cam EX? Just wondering if anyone knows if JVC or another manufacturer is planning to release a shoulder mount camcorder at a price point similar to the EX. The EX seems like it will be a really good piece of gear but I really want a shoulder mount camera as well as organic tapeless recording. An HD110 that records onto flash media would be ideal. Any thoughts?

October 16th, 2007, 04:55 PM	#1404
Kenneth Michiels New Boot Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: NZ Posts: 9	Camera choice Hello, i'm planning to buy a new camera any day soon but I'm a bit of a newbie in the digital camera world. I currently own a Samsung VP-D303. The image and sound quality are far from good enough and I feel like moving to my next camera. I will use this camera mainly as a filmstudent (for shortfilms and short documentaries) but also for other small projects such as commercial spots or video clips. My budget is around €2500 (~ $3500). The camera's I have in mind are: - Canon xm2 - Sony HDR-SR8 - VC GZ-HD7 I also have a friend who sells his Canon XL1 for a small price. (~€1200) Which camera would you suggest me to buy and why? Should I spend a little more and get another camera? Should I wait for new releases? HD or SD? Is the quality of built-in microphones good? Or should I get an extern one? Who can help? Regards, Kenneth

October 16th, 2007, 05:36 PM	#1406
Dale Stoltzfus Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Ephrata, PA United States Posts: 257	Kenneth, I won't address the issue of SD vs HD right now. See this thread for that: http://dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?t=105583. There are many other threads to - just do a search. BUT, if you do decide to go SD, I would look at two cameras: the Panasonic DVX100a/b and the Canon XL2. Either one can be had used for under $3500, at least here in the US (forgive me if this is not so in Belgium). Both cameras overcome (to one degree or another) one of the biggest problems with SD cams - 16x9. Expecially the XL2, which produces native 16x9. And both cams will do progressive, as well as 24pA, which will be a great boon to you in working on short films. I have an XL2 and, pared with the 16x manual lens, it is a phenomenal camera. I got the cam and lens for about $2600, BTW, both used from members of this forum. However, if you choose to go HD, that's a whole different animal. I don't have any personal recommendations, but I suspect that you will get a ton of proponents for the Canon XH A1. The quality of built in microphones is not only marginal, but their placement is as well. In other words, you need your mic up by the talent, not back at the camera! Invest in a small, sturdy mixer (such as the Sound Devices MixPre or 302), a decent shotgun mic (sorry, I don't have any recommendations there - Ty?), and a boom pole. Your sound will thank you. Oh, and do you have a good tripod? Definitely a must. Now, going with any of the three cams I mentioned plus audio equipment will probably put you over your stated budget (unless you can find one heck of a deal on the cam), but hopefully not too far over. Say you spend ~ $2700 for the cam, $665 for the MixPre, $500 for the tripod, and $400 for the mic and other misc audio equipment, that puts your total at ~ $4265. And that's with not spending anything on lighting (although with $80-$175 you could probably outfit yourself nicely with some DIY/worklight solutions). If that's just to much money, you'll want to scale back a little on the cam, in which case I would recommend the Sony VX2100 or the more professional Sony PD170 over the XM2. However, none of those have good widescreen or progressive, so if your looking to make movies, I would try to stretch my budget a bit and get a DVX, XL2, or a prosumer HDV cam __________________ Mountjoy! Studios - Promotional Videography & Graphic Design MountjoyStudios.net

October 4th, 2007, 12:56 PM	#1397
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,787	Too bad about the PDX-10. I know that Sony recalled a lot of cameras (still and video from various manufacturers) for defective CCD's. Have you investigated to see if the PDX-10 might be part of that? If so, the repair would be free. Probably worth a call to their service center - see the info here: http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Broadcastan...eCenters.shtml I gave my PDX-10 to a friend last winter, but never noticed any CCD problems in the years I used it heavily. I think you will give up a lot of manual control by going to the HC series, not to mention the pro audio and DVCAM features. But if you're just doing family stuff that may not be an issue for you. The HVR-A1 is the heir apparent to the PDX-10... is that beyond your price range? http://bssc.sel.sony.com/Broadcastan...p=141&id=80897

October 4th, 2007, 01:46 PM	#1398
Mark Nevnor New Boot Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: O'Fallon, MO (St. Louis) Posts: 12	Unfortunately it does not fall under the recall. It's a flat rate $550 for a repair plus shipping cost. The only reason I got the PDX10 at the time was because it was the only 3CCD native 16:9 on the market and had excellent auto features and better sound recording. I never used any of the manual features nor the DVCAM b/c I didn't notice a difference. I'd rather put the $550 towards an HC5 if the colors are equivalent or very close. Can anyone comment on this? Oh, and yes the HVR-A1 is too much but it looks sweet! Thanks!

October 7th, 2007, 08:09 AM	#1400
Edward Carlson Major Player Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: North Hollywood, CA, United States Posts: 807	If there isn't a tape in the camera, and it is on wall power, it should stay on. You can probably turn off the demo mode in the setup menu.

October 7th, 2007, 09:38 AM	#1401
Mariano L. Honrado Jr. New Boot Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Manila, Philippines Posts: 8	Edward: Following your advice, the TRV 110 is still on! For anyone on the same path, the reminders are: a) No tape b) Powered from wall juice c) Demo mode set to OFF in menus Many thanks! Mariano L. Honrado, Jr.

October 16th, 2007, 05:35 PM	#1405
Karl Heiner Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: california Posts: 342	here are my thoughts: just purchased a sony dcr hc7. everywhere between $ 1200 -1300, at amazon $ 1050 i also have a xl1-s and was is needed for studio/ theater recordings. my long therm plan is to go to a 1/2 or even 2/3 ship, but as you know there is the big change to high definition and the prices are prohibitive for me...lol. also i wanted to cut down on equipment weight, but make experience within the new hd system at the same time. (have two contracts for the football and basketball season) i suggest a "small" sony, (they have a lanc out) and spend some money on the right tripod, lcd monitor, a good remote control, hard case, items you could use with a "bigger" camcorder when you're ready. the step into hd is not just the camcorder, editing software, cable and so on. on the other hand there are plenty of dv camcorders on the market, used. have my set in the classified, but nobody is interested. the canon is a great camera to learn everything about video/ settings etc. good luck

October 16th, 2007, 05:37 PM	#1407
Dale Stoltzfus Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Ephrata, PA United States Posts: 257	Accidental double post. Sorry. __________________ Mountjoy! Studios - Promotional Videography & Graphic Design MountjoyStudios.net

October 20th, 2007, 08:13 AM	#1408
Danny Gilbert New Boot Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: England UK Posts: 8	HC7 or HV20? Hi all, I'm just about to get into the world of HDV and I have a big decision to make, I've read loads of threads so far about each camera and just can't decide. The HV20 is £602 and the HC7 is £764 so straight away by going with the HV20 I'll of saved £162. The HV20 seems to have the better image quality from all the reviews that I've read, but that's not much of a decider for me. Both camera's have mic in and headphone jacks which is really important to me. The HC7 also has a LANC socket, whereas the HV20 doesn't, what the heck were canon thinking??? The biggest decider though is the fact that sooner or later I'm going to be getting a Sony V1 and I have a feeling that the HC7 will match up better in the edit then the HV20, what are people's thoughts on this? Also. I already have a genuine sony extended battery for the HC7 so that's another £70 that I won't need to spend if I get the HC7. So a few second opinions would be really appreciated. Thanks Danny

October 20th, 2007, 08:33 AM	#1409
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Sounds like you've sussed it Danny - the Canon's the better camera but the Sony seems to be aimed at you rather better (LANC and batteries and possible V1 matching). Thing is you'll be delighted with either camera, I'm pretty sure of that. And you already know this ~ YOU have far more of an influence over the final 'quality' of the film than either camera has. Both cameras are just inanimate lumps of glass and plastic and metal, full of potential energy, waiting for your creative input. I think the Canon's looks are naff, and that zoom rocker stinks, but boy, are the test results amazing. Some great shots from it in this thread: http://forums.dvdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=42775 The HC7 is a pain. You want to lock the exposure? Of course you do, but what a palarva of menu digging it requires. And don't leave it on auto outdoors - it selects f/4.5 and simply varies the shutter speed up and down to silly levels. Talk about stuttering footage. Why not go for the V1 right now and cut your losses? tom.

October 20th, 2007, 09:29 AM	#1410
Karl Heiner Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: california Posts: 342	since i work only of a tripod, a lanc connection is one most important feature to me. and @ tom your right, the menu on the hc7 is something. i need a training class on that one....lol unfortunately the accessories shoe does not take standard stuff, but i have videotaped 2 football games and the results are great. what i am really fighting with, is the smaller and flimsy tripod, have to get used to it, but i like the weight. the lens is barley enough in regards of zooming in, but my idea for the hc7 was the upcoming basketball season.