Is there a new cheap updated switcher like the Atem Television Studio?

[Chris Harding]

Hi Donald

Just for interest have you tried your system on a run of the mill i7 laptop? Can it handle a 1280x720 video stream coming from the HDMI to USB convertors? All the ones I have tried fail miserably and I really cannot see any point in having a laptop that dies if you put a 720 stream thru it at around 2.6mbps ..unless of course you are just needing a 480P stream at a very low bitrate ...Are you running your system on a desktop or laptop? With me, even a 2gb i5 struggles with a 480P broadcast and most laptops are a lot slower ..We tried an Asus i7 and it was hopeless even at 480P and 1 mbps bitrate ... Unless you pay big money for a gaming laptop of course ..which I don't have!!

[Oren Arieli]

Josh, have you looked into cheap (sub $100) game capture boxes like this one https://amzn.com/B017UZW79E

I use a different model and have been satisfied with the results, especially with Powerpoint Slides that look as good as the original. You end up with an easy-to-overlay video file that is accurate to your recording (assuming you're not starting/stopping the camera or recorder). Great for long sessions, but I still recommend rolling a 2nd camera for sync confirmation, or when the presenter is using a laser pointer on the screen.

[Josh Hayes]

Hi Oren. I did think of that in the beginning. What made me nervous is I think I couldn't find one of those boxes that had visual confirmation of what screen it was recording. Like a little LCD screen that shows it's capturing the screen correctly (as opposed to just a green light or a flashing light or something). Maybe it's silly but it made me nervous. I also wondered something you might have an answer for. If the HDMI box like the link you listed is actually screen capturing, and a lot of presenters use applications where you can see your presentation screen but also your notes for the presentation, you might have a shot of the presentation you can't use then right?

[Donald McPherson]

Unfortunately my laptop suffered blue screens and is back to the shop for repair. But in my test I could take two hdmi > usb converters into the laptop. Uploaded to youtube ok. But i deleted it soon after. (Who wants to see my ugly test.) I also have a Sony pxw x70 and tried to add this to the mix it can stream wifi to VLC then screen grab that into Xsplit broadcast. But that proved to much. Maybe a third converter might work. I should say that was 720p as it's still the free Xsplit at the moment.

[Josh Hayes]

Chris: So do you folks have more than one Broadcaster? And if so, can the computer handle 2 or 3 camrera's?

Originally Posted by Chris Harding

Hi Josh

As a remote camera the broadcaster can stream out a maximum of HD+ (5.2mbps) direct to the Studio Software and Studio can stream a little higher ... If you stream out at this rate on the broadcaster it handles it with ease direct to the CDN but my i72600 CPU works rather hard when given video at this rate and now and again the CPU will get to 95% but I have never lost a stream ...Unless you have something like an Alienware gaming laptop and are prepared to fork over $4000+ then a standard (even i7 laptop) simply cannot handle the incoming video ...We have tried a Toshiba with an i7 2.4 - 3.1 GHz processor and it struggles!!!!

AFAIK the studio software will accept projects right up to UHD inputs but the DVR is an MP4 at 1280x720 but still quite watchable if you download it.

[Oren Arieli]

Originally Posted by Josh Hayes

Hi Oren. I did think of that in the beginning. What made me nervous is I think I couldn't find one of those boxes that had visual confirmation of what screen it was recording. Like a little LCD screen that shows it's capturing the screen correctly (as opposed to just a green light or a flashing light or something). Maybe it's silly but it made me nervous. I also wondered something you might have an answer for. If the HDMI box like the link you listed is actually screen capturing, and a lot of presenters use applications where you can see your presentation screen but also your notes for the presentation, you might have a shot of the presentation you can't use then right?

Legitimate concerns. My first choice would be to get a copy of the slidedeck (not always possible), but if there are animations, it makes my work much harder. That is where the HDMI recorder comes in, which is my new go-to option. But I still train a cheap HD camera on the screen just in case something goes wrong. Having an LCD confirmation would be nice, but typically I set them up close to the laptop. That's not the ideal location to monitor when you're at a camera position (often furthest from the presenter's laptop). It's a leap of faith, so having a backup is essential. If you're lucky, then the entire recorded presentation can simply be overlaid on the main camera's image and it all just lines up neatly.

[Josh Hayes]

Got it. There so inexpensive they are absolutely worth trying. Do you ever run into a situation where the screen capture shows presenter's notes and you can't use it?

Also is using the device as simple as just plugging it into the computer, and just pushing a few buttons?

[Chris Harding]

Hi Josh

The software can handle 10 remote cameras and 25 SDI inputs so it's not the incomings that tax the CPU but the outgoing stream ..We can have multiple cameras running into the software and the CPU can idle and quite a reasonable rate ...As soon as you do the broadcast, that's where the CPU usage sky rockets and when it has to work hard!! I can (for example) drop a pre-rendered video in the media section of the software that's 1920x1080 and been rendered previously at 8000 kbps and if I stream that online the CPU % climbs dramatically compared to the live camera which is coming thru the broadcaster at 2.3mbs .. Livestream suggest an i7 SixCore processor for best performance.

[Oren Arieli]

Originally Posted by Josh Hayes

Got it. There so inexpensive they are absolutely worth trying. Do you ever run into a situation where the screen capture shows presenter's notes and you can't use it?

Also is using the device as simple as just plugging it into the computer, and just pushing a few buttons?

The one I have really is a one-push recorder, and the only issue I had was when I forgot to format the usb drive and ran out of space....so chalk it up to a user error. Only put it through 4 or 5 shoots though...so I can't speak to the longevity or future issues that arise.
As for setup, you plug in the power, put in your USB drive (formatted, duh!), and take an HDMI in and supply an HDMI out back to the monitor or projector.
I would love a display that shows time/space remaining and some confidence inspiring notifications that it's recording at 1080 (or 720).

[Josh Hayes]

Chris, awesome. That's good to know and super interesting to understand that's where the potential bottleneck is.

[Chris Harding]

Hi Josh

If you need to see how a computer or laptop will perform as a vision switcher you can open a free Livestream account (the public cannot watch it unless they are also account holders and the Studio software also has a free version for download (it does have limitations but you have full streaming facilities plus it's limited in the number of cameras) That way it's something to play with and see what your current gear can do without costing you anything. I used both the free account and free switcher options to test a bunch of laptops and desktop to see which would cope with an HD video stream ....one can even use a web cam as a temporary video source and even my action cams plug into the software via USB ..Definitely worth a play!!!

[Josh Hayes]

Hi Chris. Yeah I Livestreamed something for a client last week using my GH4 and the Black Magic Mini-Recorder. My laptop did fine, the stream said "Perfect Streaming" but it was still a little glitchy an skipped quite often. I tested the ethernet connection before and after and it was screaming fast so not sure what it was. I'm going to ping Livestream and ask them. I do like the idea of renting a Broadcaster or two though and using them to push multiple HD streams and then see if/how bad my computer chokes. Luckily I'm not asked to livestream often, but I really like that the Broadcaster can basically be used as a less expensive TeraDek. While it's may only be with Livestream servers, that's historically been the only livestream company as client as asked me to use (if they were specific at all).

[Josh Hayes]

Oren: Couple quick question.

1. If AV at the conference isn't using HDMI to connect from computer to projector (before we put this box in between the two to capture the video contents) and using something else like Thunderboldt or something older, will the box still capture if it has it's HDMI in but doesn't have an HDMI out to pass through?

2. If the laptop doesn't have an HDMI port will using a USB to HDMI convertor and then feeding that into the recording box work?

Have you tried either? I'm obviously going to test the box extensively when I get it, but trying to determine it's possible capabilities before doing so. Especially because for the gig I'll be doing if one works, we'll be buying 4 more.

[Jeff Pulera]

I saw mentioned a few times earlier in the thread that the cameras would be shooting 1080p. Wanted to point out that many camcorders default to putting out 1080i over the HDMI port even if the camera is set internally to record 24p or 30p. Possibly 60p as well, haven't worked with many late-model camcorders. Point being that cameras do this because most/all displays are built to accept 1080i, but not all accept 1080p sources. So just wanted to bring it up that the assumption that the cameras will be outputting 1080p may not be completely correct and that needs to be considered as part of the workflow.

Thanks

Jeff

[Josh Hayes]

hey Jeff, thanks for making that clarification, I appreciate it!