VHS camera with pro features?

Josh Bass · March 19th, 2006, 07:36 AM

Oh, that was me, daddy.

Jeff McElroy · March 19th, 2006, 08:23 AM

That was probably the most entertaining thing I have seen in months. :)

Before they demo'd my neighbor’s house, which was one of the first places built here in PGI, we were allowed to go in and take whatever we wanted. I found two 8mm film cameras from the early 60's, and also a shoulder-mount tube VHS camcorder. The battery is dead, and I couldn’t find the charger cables or anything… but an interesting, if extremely ugly relic none the less.

Steve House · March 19th, 2006, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Bass

...

No, guys, they will have an entire movie they audience will see, that needs to look VHS-y. Not just a cutaway. Sincc the XL1s I should the intro to this whole thing is supposed to be the "good" looking footage, their movie should look substantially different. I can actually have it have less vertical resolution, like the real thing, that'd be ideal.

Check this out, it's the "prequel" (I use quotes 'cause it's not quite a prequel) to the short I'm going to do. Same idea, same setup, different type of film they end up making. You'll see what I mean about "nice" looking vs. VHS.

...

It will be a long cutaway but none the less ...<grin> What I mean is there is no reason the camera the audience sees them using has to be the camera that actually shoots the footage that becomes their movie. There's no way for the audience to know where the footage they "shot" actually originated so the camera the audience sees them using on the screen can actually be a non-functioning prop as long as the image it supposedly is producing is dirtied up to look authentic. If you want the authentic look of VHS, use a bi-directional capture card like a Canopus 110 and in post take your DV footage, make an analog dub to a VHS recorder then capture it back again to DV.

Nice job on the prequel <g>.

Robert M Wright · March 19th, 2006, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Bass

Well, there's no hurry. I mean, a camera should be dirt cheap on ebay, right? As long as it works correctly and does what I want, that should do. If I have to pay 500 or more for an SVHS cam, then I'll just degrade in post.

I know everything SHOULD be in auto, but I might (read--probably will) take certain liberties. I dont want someone's face in silhouette 'cause I'm shooting outside and the autoiris tries to expose for the sky. That kinda stuff. Also, super artsy framing is a good (albeit, subtle for non film/movie/video people) joke about indies.

There's no need to degrade in post, if you shoot VHS with an SVHS camera (it will be a true VHS recording, with approx 240 lines of resolution - it will look plenty awful! - you could always play it back 40 or 50 times before capturing too, just to give it a really vintage look.)

Josh Bass · March 19th, 2006, 10:18 AM

Regarding real cam vs prop cam--that's a good point, but I was still going to try to use a VHS cam to shoot it to get the look. I will likely by a prop cam just to show, however, no matter what I use.

I guess if I can find something that works that's cheap enough I'll buy it ( I don't wanna rent 'cause I want time to play with it at my leisure and make sure audio, etc. works right.

If it ends up being to expensive, I might as well just use the XL1s and degrade by copying back and forth. It works fine. I'd also be more confident in the quality I was getting during the shoot. I don't wanna take chances with the audio.

So, thanks.

And thanks for the compliments too.

Jonathan Jones · March 19th, 2006, 02:23 PM

I would recommend shooting as you normally do in your cam, and then transfer it to a vhs tape using analog output, like the composite out. Then you can re-record it back into your NLE from the vhs tape using the composite input of the cam in AV>DV mode. This would probably be a pretty effective and quick way of achieving the limited scope of the vhs look without having to process it over and over again to degrade the signal - my thinking would be that the more you try to 'fake' it by processing/degrading it in post the more it will begin to look 'animated' as opposed to just low-quality.
-Jon

Josh Bass · March 19th, 2006, 03:28 PM

Yeah, that's what I did last time.

Philip Gioja · March 21st, 2006, 08:33 AM

I have an old cvl325 magnavox vhs camera that I bought on a lark just as a relic, it works fine except for the dead battery, but I looked up batteries online and they are only 20-25 dollars. It looks fairly 'pro' for an old camcorder -- it's a big shoulder-mount style, and you can run it in manual if you want to. My wife about died when I brought it home, so she'd probably love me if I sold it! Let me know -- philip@centerstreetproductions.com.

March 19th, 2006, 07:36 AM	#16
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Oh, that was me, daddy. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

March 19th, 2006, 10:18 AM	#20
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Regarding real cam vs prop cam--that's a good point, but I was still going to try to use a VHS cam to shoot it to get the look. I will likely by a prop cam just to show, however, no matter what I use. I guess if I can find something that works that's cheap enough I'll buy it ( I don't wanna rent 'cause I want time to play with it at my leisure and make sure audio, etc. works right. If it ends up being to expensive, I might as well just use the XL1s and degrade by copying back and forth. It works fine. I'd also be more confident in the quality I was getting during the shoot. I don't wanna take chances with the audio. So, thanks. And thanks for the compliments too. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

March 19th, 2006, 02:23 PM	#21
Jonathan Jones Trustee Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Healdsburg, California Posts: 1,138	I would recommend shooting as you normally do in your cam, and then transfer it to a vhs tape using analog output, like the composite out. Then you can re-record it back into your NLE from the vhs tape using the composite input of the cam in AV>DV mode. This would probably be a pretty effective and quick way of achieving the limited scope of the vhs look without having to process it over and over again to degrade the signal - my thinking would be that the more you try to 'fake' it by processing/degrading it in post the more it will begin to look 'animated' as opposed to just low-quality. -Jon __________________ "Are we to go on record, sir, with our assertion that the 'pink hearts, yellow moons, orange stars, and green clovers' are, in point of fact', magically delicious?" - Walter Hollarhan before the House Subcommittee on Integrity in Advertising - May, 1974

March 19th, 2006, 03:28 PM	#22
Josh Bass Slash Rules! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 5,472	Yeah, that's what I did last time. __________________ The Bass' camerawork The Bass on IMDB

March 19th, 2006, 08:23 AM	#17
Jeff McElroy Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 91	That was probably the most entertaining thing I have seen in months. :) Before they demo'd my neighbor’s house, which was one of the first places built here in PGI, we were allowed to go in and take whatever we wanted. I found two 8mm film cameras from the early 60's, and also a shoulder-mount tube VHS camcorder. The battery is dead, and I couldn’t find the charger cables or anything… but an interesting, if extremely ugly relic none the less.

March 21st, 2006, 08:33 AM	#23
Philip Gioja Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Piper City, IL Posts: 350	I have an old cvl325 magnavox vhs camera that I bought on a lark just as a relic, it works fine except for the dead battery, but I looked up batteries online and they are only 20-25 dollars. It looks fairly 'pro' for an old camcorder -- it's a big shoulder-mount style, and you can run it in manual if you want to. My wife about died when I brought it home, so she'd probably love me if I sold it! Let me know -- philip@centerstreetproductions.com.