HMC150 HD question

Denny Lajeunesse · January 4th, 2010, 09:34 AM

Barry has some info somewhere on this and I go by what he says.

Erich Gabbe · January 4th, 2010, 09:35 AM

... checking the ISO rating of both cameras @0 dB using an old fashioned light meter would give an impression of the respective sensitivities of both cameras. Anyone has the means to do it?

Erich

Barry Green · January 4th, 2010, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robert M Wright

You know, if that were true, you would think an HMC150 should be roughly as sensitive to light as an EX1, which it clearly isn't.

Except that it is. HMC150 is 500 ISO, the EX1 is 400 in 1080p, 500 in 720p. The only area where the EX1 clearly excels in sensitivity is in 1080i, they use actual interlaced scanning and gain a stop of performance, so 1080i performance is 800 ISO.

Barry Green · January 4th, 2010, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erich Gabbe

... checking the ISO rating of both cameras @0 dB using an old fashioned light meter would give an impression of the respective sensitivities of both cameras. Anyone has the means to do it?

Of the HMC40 against the HMC150, or the HMC150 against the EX1, or ?

HMC40 clocks in at about 64 ISO. HMC150 is 500 ISO at the same settings, making it about 3 stops more sensitive.

HMC150 is about the same as the EX1 in most modes, but in 1080i mode the EX1 is about 2/3 stop more sensitive.

Jeff Kellam · January 4th, 2010, 12:04 PM

Ben, IMO, when you take all the info provided in this thread and others into account, it's apparent that all the cameras have compromises, and like some of us already agreed, the HMC-150 is the best compromise out there for the time being. As soon as it is bested, I will be the first to move on, but we are not there yet.

I just shot some reallly low light footage on the HMC-150 over the weekend. With a year and a half of HMC-150 shooting and PP experience, I am getting just outstanding results. So in low light, the HMC-150 can really perform.

Happy shooting.

Robert M Wright · January 4th, 2010, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Kellam

the HMC-150 is the best compromise out there for the time being...

It's all relative. When looking at getting either an HMC150 or an HMC40, opting for the 150 compromises over a grand (in greenbacks) and up to as much as about 200 lines of resolution. If you shoot entirely in controlled lighting environments, and deliver projects on Blu-Ray, that's a notable compromise.

On the other hand, if you opt for the 40, you compromise light sensitivity, on the order of about 3 stops. If you make your living shooting weddings, and deliver projects on DVD, that's a whale of a compromise.

There is no single, best compromise.

Jeff Kellam · January 4th, 2010, 02:28 PM

Robert, I totally agree.

The game is not completely about cost, but that is a huge driving factor. In my case I need 2 to 4 of whatever camera Im using, so the purchase and depreciation (and media) costs are multiplied and affect my decisions in a big way.

Andy Tejral · January 4th, 2010, 02:43 PM

Another important area to consider is ergonomics. The 40 wasn't out (or was just out) when I bought the 150 so I can't comment there.

But I went from a PD170 to an HV20 and just couldn't deal. The thing is so small, just breathing makes the image shake! The zoom is pretty much worthless while recording.

So I felt I needed to go back to the larger form factor. I see the 40 looks pretty much like a smaller 150 but something's got to give to get that size (and $) difference.

Robert M Wright · January 4th, 2010, 03:32 PM

The HMC40 is small, but not HV20 like small. Btw, one of the slickest things I like about the HV20, is being able to lock down that zoom speed to super-slow - a feature I would love to see with the bigger cams! I prefer having that consistant and slow speed, to having a variable speed zoom. I never zip-zoom - hate it. I find that constant slow zoom speed on the HV20 is almost perfect for my purposes. (I've never changed it, or even been tempted to, since first setting it when I got the cam).

Anyway, about the HMC40, it's well designed. I find it quite nice for control. It's got a focus/zoom ring (selectable with a real button) and aperture/gain combined on a wheel (which I actually like better than having separate controls for each - it's easy and fast to set). WB is on a button too (works decent - pretty quick and easy to use too). So you do have the stuff you really need the most often, right there handy on a ring and real buttons and wheels, even though most the rest of the stuff is in menus, using a touch screen. I don't like touch screens, but as touch screens go, I've got to say this is pretty well thought out (for the most part). It's a bigger cam than the little dinky consumer cams, but of course there isn't enough real estate there to put as many buttons and switches on it as an HMC150 (or similar), so obviously more things have to be in menus. On the whole, they clearly did think it out well though, so it's not nearly as awful as it certainly could be (and is with some consumer cams). The HMC40 is also well balanced in the hand, and quite comfortable to hold - and way less tiring to shot with for awhile, than a bigger, heavier cam.

January 4th, 2010, 12:04 PM	#20
Jeff Kellam Major Player Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 656	Ben, IMO, when you take all the info provided in this thread and others into account, it's apparent that all the cameras have compromises, and like some of us already agreed, the HMC-150 is the best compromise out there for the time being. As soon as it is bested, I will be the first to move on, but we are not there yet. I just shot some reallly low light footage on the HMC-150 over the weekend. With a year and a half of HMC-150 shooting and PP experience, I am getting just outstanding results. So in low light, the HMC-150 can really perform. Happy shooting. __________________ Panasonic HMC150/Canon A1/JVC HD1/Sony Vegas 8.0c

January 4th, 2010, 02:28 PM	#22
Jeff Kellam Major Player Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 656	Robert, I totally agree. The game is not completely about cost, but that is a huge driving factor. In my case I need 2 to 4 of whatever camera Im using, so the purchase and depreciation (and media) costs are multiplied and affect my decisions in a big way. __________________ Panasonic HMC150/Canon A1/JVC HD1/Sony Vegas 8.0c

January 4th, 2010, 02:43 PM	#23
Andy Tejral Major Player Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: New York City Posts: 523	Another important area to consider is ergonomics. The 40 wasn't out (or was just out) when I bought the 150 so I can't comment there. But I went from a PD170 to an HV20 and just couldn't deal. The thing is so small, just breathing makes the image shake! The zoom is pretty much worthless while recording. So I felt I needed to go back to the larger form factor. I see the 40 looks pretty much like a smaller 150 but something's got to give to get that size (and $) difference. __________________ Andy Tejral Railroad Videographer

January 4th, 2010, 09:34 AM	#16
Denny Lajeunesse Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Kelowna, BC [Canada, Eh!] Posts: 257	Barry has some info somewhere on this and I go by what he says.

January 4th, 2010, 09:35 AM	#17
Erich Gabbe New Boot Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Hamburg Germany Posts: 10	... checking the ISO rating of both cameras @0 dB using an old fashioned light meter would give an impression of the respective sensitivities of both cameras. Anyone has the means to do it? Erich

January 4th, 2010, 03:32 PM	#24
Robert M Wright Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Minnesota (USA) Posts: 2,171	The HMC40 is small, but not HV20 like small. Btw, one of the slickest things I like about the HV20, is being able to lock down that zoom speed to super-slow - a feature I would love to see with the bigger cams! I prefer having that consistant and slow speed, to having a variable speed zoom. I never zip-zoom - hate it. I find that constant slow zoom speed on the HV20 is almost perfect for my purposes. (I've never changed it, or even been tempted to, since first setting it when I got the cam). Anyway, about the HMC40, it's well designed. I find it quite nice for control. It's got a focus/zoom ring (selectable with a real button) and aperture/gain combined on a wheel (which I actually like better than having separate controls for each - it's easy and fast to set). WB is on a button too (works decent - pretty quick and easy to use too). So you do have the stuff you really need the most often, right there handy on a ring and real buttons and wheels, even though most the rest of the stuff is in menus, using a touch screen. I don't like touch screens, but as touch screens go, I've got to say this is pretty well thought out (for the most part). It's a bigger cam than the little dinky consumer cams, but of course there isn't enough real estate there to put as many buttons and switches on it as an HMC150 (or similar), so obviously more things have to be in menus. On the whole, they clearly did think it out well though, so it's not nearly as awful as it certainly could be (and is with some consumer cams). The HMC40 is also well balanced in the hand, and quite comfortable to hold - and way less tiring to shot with for awhile, than a bigger, heavier cam.