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Old July 1st, 2009, 10:17 AM   #1
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Best P2 card combo? 64GB + 16GB?

Hey friends,

I just ordered a bunch of film gear, HPX170 included but I have held out on a P2 card because I wanted to get your input first.

Obviously the camera comes with a 16GB, but you need 2 cards to shoot uninterrupted. My question is, is there DOWNSIDE to combining a 16GB with a 64GB? (I will be getting E-series obviously) Money is not an issue here, although I would prefer to only purchase 1 extra card so as to have 2 (unless someone highly recommends, say, (3) 32GB cards for instance)

Also, my camera should arrive any day, and I am currently freelancing (with no jobs lined up at the very moment) so I seem to be okay waiting until august for the P2 card, but what if something comes up? I would be stuck with ONLY a 16GB... keep this in mind.

I will be using my powerbook G4 as a transfer device. It's a few years old and thus has the PCMCIA slot on the left side. I have 2 laptop batteries (though one is slowly dying) so I should have enough for a hypothetical all day shoot in the field (especially if I put my monitor display on the lowest brightness)

So, how long does it take to transfer data via PCMCIA? I know that P2 is so much better than tape because it doesn't have to play in real time, but what about transfer time? If I fill up a hypothetical 64GB, and am shooting on a 16GB, is there potential to fill up the 16GB while the 64GB is still transferring, thus leaving me without a card to shoot on?

Also, one last question, I see Fuji released new e-series cards too, but I can't find them online anywhere. When are these available, and are they different at all besides the name? I just feel slightly skeptical using Fuji on Panasonic.

Thanks so much for your help,
David Aviv Nussbaum

Last edited by David Aviv Nussbaum; July 1st, 2009 at 10:18 AM. Reason: forgot to mention e-series
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 02:52 AM   #2
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Hi David,

Others may have varying opinions, may I suggest---
-get the P2 cards that suit your shooting situation/s (Short or long runs)and your selected output , SD/HD.
-Use your 16gig to do some tests and that will tell you what extra cards to buy.
-Powerbook is good, but do transfer tests to know your transfer times.
-Fuji cards are exactly the same as Pana cards, (I have a 32G Fuji, it is identical to the Pana 32g's I also have) but cheaper if you barter with the supplier. if you can wait you may get better value..
Your powerbook may need the older P2 driver if your on Tiger OS, If your on Leopard you may not be able to use the PCMCIA slot..maybe some one else can chime in here ?...

Cheers
Tom K
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Last edited by Tom Klein; July 2nd, 2009 at 03:41 AM. Reason: more info
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 09:52 AM   #3
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uh oh. I'm on Leopard OSX 10.5.7

also, where can you buy the fuji cards? I can't find them ANYWHERE online.

Furthermore, let's say I CAN'T use my powerbook, what's the alternative to transfer P2 cards in the field?
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Old July 2nd, 2009, 09:40 PM   #4
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hmmm... It seems the 32GB are already sold out, and the 64GB are so far off. Now I'm considering just a 16GB... I'm just thinking, even if I have 2 cards, if I'm the only one in the field I would have to stop filming anyway for a minute, but 16 minutes of footage just seems so little.
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 03:53 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by David Aviv Nussbaum View Post
uh oh. I'm on Leopard OSX 10.5.7

also, where can you buy the fuji cards? I can't find them ANYWHERE online.

Furthermore, let's say I CAN'T use my powerbook, what's the alternative to transfer P2 cards in the field?
Hi David,

You could downgrade to Tiger 10.4.8, I found that great with PCMCIA or you could just get a Windows lappy and do it that way. P2 is supported better on windows than Mac (in my experience)
Have a read of this thread you may want to go that way Later-
P2 offload Lenovo S10 with addonics adapter - DVXuser.com -- The online community for filmmaking
Fuji Cards, look about your area for a Fuji Pro re-seller, they can get them, they just don't know of them.
cheers
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 09:32 AM   #6
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can someone explain why the P2 drivers wouldn't work with an older mac with a PCMCIA? One would think as long as the OS is up to date it doesn't matter.
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 10:27 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by David Aviv Nussbaum View Post
Furthermore, let's say I CAN'T use my powerbook, what's the alternative to transfer P2 cards in the field?
Lots of ways, including connecting the camera directly to a computer, or connecting the camera directly to an external hard disk without a computer even being involved.
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 10:28 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by David Aviv Nussbaum View Post
can someone explain why the P2 drivers wouldn't work with an older mac with a PCMCIA? One would think as long as the OS is up to date it doesn't matter.
They do work. Lots of people use G4 PowerBooks with P2 every day.
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 11:24 AM   #9
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I'm just thinking, even if I have 2 cards, if I'm the only one in the field I would have to stop filming anyway for a minute, but 16 minutes of footage just seems so little.
If you shoot 720/24p or 30p, I would recommend Native mode. A 16Gb card would give you over 40 minutes of record time. Transfer time will also be considerably faster than non-Native mode.

I use a G4 with Leopard and the PCMCIA slot with P2 drivers works great. Shotput Pro is a great way to ingest the clips to multiple external drives simultaneously.

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Old July 3rd, 2009, 01:35 PM   #10
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so if you can just go directly to a computer, why are people spending thousands on P2 readers? im assuming for ENG in the field?
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 11:27 PM   #11
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so if you can just go directly to a computer, why are people spending thousands on P2 readers? im assuming for ENG in the field?
How do you spend "thousands" on a P2 reader? I mean, yes, you can buy the $2,000 Panasonic, but there are many other ways to get the footage from the card into a computer. A laptop with a PCMCIA slot is the most convenient; a laptop with an ExpressCard slot can be utilized with a $50 Addonics adapter or a $119 DuelAdapter. You can build a P2 offload station for less than $350 by getting a Lenovo S10e from Radio Shack and an Addonics adapter. If you're a Mac user, you can even use that laptop as a slot reader for your desktop Mac, by using the 100-megabit Ethernet connection or, if that's too slow, get a $39 gigabit ethernet USB adapter.

Or you can just use the camera itself to offload cards, connecting to the computer via USB or firewire, as a reader. That's free, but it ties up the camera during the offload process.

Or you can use another P2 device, like the P2 Store, P2 Gear, or P2 Portable.

Or you can connect the camera directly to a hard disk and offload to the hard disk. That is also free, but ties up the camera during the offload process.

Or, for a desktop, you can get a $75 PCI slot reader.

Or you can get one of the Panasonic readers, the five-slot PCD20 for USB/FW800, or, for desktop use, the PCD35 with a PCI Express slot.

Or you can get the forthcoming Sonnet QIO reader, which is two slots of P2, two slots of ExpressCard, and also CompactFlash, for about half the cost of the Panasonics.

There may be other ways; these are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
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Old July 3rd, 2009, 11:48 PM   #12
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There may be other ways; these are just the ones I can think of off the top of my head.
Actually your list has just about everything except hackintosh which has a PCI 32 bit bus / supports P2.
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Old July 4th, 2009, 03:18 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Regan;
I use a G4 with Leopard and the PCMCIA slot with P2 drivers works great.
Jeff Regan
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Hi Jeff,

My tests have revealed no success with Leopard and PCMCIA on the MacPro, I never went to Leopard on my old G4 as it was happy with Tiger 10.4.8 OS.
Can you advise of your specs on your G4 ...ie hardware / OS 10.5.7 ? / PC slot reader / G4 desktop or Powerbook.

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Old July 4th, 2009, 05:41 PM   #14
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Hi Tom,

I use a PowerBook G4 15" with 1.67GHz processor, 1Gb memory 15", Mac OS X 10.5.6 with PCMCIA slot. These can be bought used for $500 or less USD these days. I thought it wouldn't work well with XDCAM EX, but it does, although AVC Intra hasn't been a success so far due to not being an Intel machine, but Leopard works great with DVCPRO HD on P2 via PCMCIA.

Jeff Regan
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Old July 4th, 2009, 07:31 PM   #15
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Hi Jeff,

That's great to know, (must be the "chipset" Apple has used for the PC slot) Pity that the old powerbooks are just that, Old, good to know this info though, May I put that info on my site ?, I have lots of enquiries about P2 readers for all platforms, But as you may apprecciate I can't test them all.
My main efforts have been with the PCIe Macpro (desktop) and before that the PCI G5 and prior to that the PCI G4, The G4 Mac's are well into to that Redundant phase and begining to "expire" in the hardware components, lots are blowing Power supplies, and with new a PS being "not cost effective" to replace, users are forced into the later hardware boxes.

I'm looking forward to the up coming Sonnet QIO reader.

PS, are you using the old P2 Mac driver (V-1.33)in your PB, or the latest one (V-1.50)from Panasonic.

cheers for your info, that's what these boards are all about.
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