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Old April 14th, 2005, 11:31 AM   #16
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Re: HVX-200 info, might be new

<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Pappas :

One is a shipping weight ( Shipping Weight: 8lbs US/ 36.2kg ) .

-->>>

36.2Kg? Damn, that's a heavy camera! ;)
They really do mean 3.6kg
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Old April 14th, 2005, 11:50 AM   #17
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I can see Obin's point.
While the varicam is fantastic in my opinion...it is essentially the DV of the HD world.

The compression is actually higher than DV (6 point something to 1).

So, I suspect we can expect the same amount of artifacting that we get in DV. Now when it comes to color correction, while there is higher compression, there is also more color information (4:2:2 vs. 4:1:1). So, there may be a bit more
room to maneurver there.


Either way, for my applications DVCProHD footage is more than good enough.

I could see where it could be a problem if you are doing heavy compositing, but I think for most people it will do just fine.
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Old April 14th, 2005, 11:10 PM   #18
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444 12bit?

444 12bit? Uhhh, excuse me.... Just exactly where are you delivering this format?

no broadcasters will accept that...
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Old April 14th, 2005, 11:23 PM   #19
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Re: 444 12bit?

<<<-- Originally posted by Stephen L. Noe : 444 12bit? Uhhh, excuse me.... Just exactly where are you delivering this format?

no broadcasters will accept that... -->>>

Hello Stephen,

Besides output to film via Cineon files, the prime application for 4:4:4 12-bit images is during the compositing process. From years of practical experience I know first hand that those extra bits are a life saver when it comes to color correction, keying, integrating cg with live action, and other post-production processes.
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Old April 14th, 2005, 11:28 PM   #20
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OK, we're in different arena's

What app are you using to process that timeline? Nothing that would normally send content up to a satellite.
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Old April 14th, 2005, 11:51 PM   #21
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<<<-- Originally posted by Stephen L. Noe : OK, we're in different arena's

What app are you using to process that timeline? Nothing that would normally send content up to a satellite. -->>>

I use both Digital Fusion and Combustion for most of my post-processing. They have great tools for dealing with higher bit depths.
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Old April 15th, 2005, 12:24 AM   #22
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Combustion. hmmnn. OK. I don't mean what compositing and effect program. I'm asking what editing software has that kind of timeline that can accomodate a native 444 12 bit source file. Do you work on Smoke????
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Old April 15th, 2005, 07:05 AM   #23
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The workflow with 4:4:4 12-bit calls for an offline format for the editing process.
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Old April 15th, 2005, 10:04 AM   #24
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Doesn't Final Cut Pro support 10, 12, and 16 bit video?
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Old April 15th, 2005, 10:10 AM   #25
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<<<-- Originally posted by Thomas Smet : Doesn't Final Cut Pro support 10, 12, and 16 bit video? -->>>

You'd need one hell of a RAID array to edit uncompressed 4:4:4 12-bit HD in realtime.
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Old April 15th, 2005, 01:37 PM   #26
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<<<-- Originally posted by Thomas Smet : Doesn't Final Cut Pro support 10, 12, and 16 bit video? -->>>
Actually, I think it supports up to 32-bit floating-point.
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Old April 15th, 2005, 05:05 PM   #27
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Re: Re: 444 12bit?

Brad hit the nail on the head here:

Hello Stephen,

Besides output to film via Cineon files, the prime application for 4:4:4 12-bit images is during the compositing process. From years of practical experience I know first hand that those extra bits are a life saver when it comes to color correction, keying, integrating cg with live action, and other post-production processes. -->>>

What brad says is what I am saying
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Old April 15th, 2005, 05:22 PM   #28
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Brad and Obin,

(damn this thread got off on a tangent)

I was talking to a friend recently who was hoping to use 'the drake' or 'kinetta' or something along those lines. Point is, he wants to capture log files.

Could you walk me through your work flow.
What do you convert those log files to for editing?
I realize you need to do an offline... what do you use for your offline, and how do you then do your online? Do the log files contain timecode just like linear files do?

I know very little about log files, and haven't had a chance to work with them. Just trying to get a handle on it, as hopefully someday that's what we'll all be dealing with.
:)

Thanks,

-Luis
If we should start a new thread, just let me know.
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Old April 16th, 2005, 01:18 AM   #29
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10-bit log files work in Final Cut Pro using either an AJA Kona 2 or a Blackmagic HD Pro with the dual-link option.

AJA also now supports DPX file sequences.

For higher-end editing beyond Final Cut Pro, you options are AVID/DS, Smoke, Quantel, Assimilate, Nucoda, etc.

Also you can edit 10-bit (but only in 4:2:2 YUV) using Cineform's Prospect HD and Premiere Pro system and/or an AVID Adrenaline with the 10-bit DNxHD codec. The files would have to be ingested from somewhere else though, because both Cineform and DNxHD do not support 4:4:4 RGB right now unlike the Blackmagic and AJA codecs.

A final option that doesn't require a huge hard-drive array (just a two-drive SATA RAID) is to use Bitjazz's SheerVideo 10-bit RGB format in Final Cut Pro.

So as you can see, there are a number of options available to you.

The main difficulty is ingesting the source of these RGB files. Typically they're on a film-scanner, or a HDCAM-SR deck. In the case of the Kinetta, Drake, Obin's camera, etc., though, the files are already digitized on the hard-drive of these cameras, so you don't have to worry about that. The only issue is to have them in a Quicktime or AVI file format that can support 10-bit or greater RGB 4:4:4.

Working in this manner isn't so pie-in-the-sky as one might believe.
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Old April 16th, 2005, 02:07 AM   #30
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You forgot Chrome HD
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