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Panasonic P2HD / DVCPRO HD Camcorders
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Old January 20th, 2006, 10:15 PM   #16
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Hi Peter Jefferson,

Thanks for the answer.

Regards
Leigh
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Old January 22nd, 2006, 02:25 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Grant
I work for a hire company in Sydney.
Thing is for any hire company getting kit repaired reliably is the deal breaker and so far Sony's service from their pro division is what keeps us with Sony. We and our clients have been badly burnt by JVC and I doubt we'll ever touch their products again. Rexel at least could fix something so it kept working. Canon were only slightly better than JVC in the past but then again the XL1 had so many inherent problems it was hard to know if it was broken or that was just how it was. That's also a big issue when you're in the hire business.

A large percentage of clients simply expect to pull the camera out of the box, put tape in and shoot half decent pictures. If you're the type who knows enough to tweak a zillion settings you're more likely to buy than hire. That's what's made the PD150 and Z1 such a popular camera with our clients.

Problem for the HVX is going to be firstly the amount of ancillary kit and secondly so far there's not a lot of NLE support for it. You wouldn't believe the number of people shooting HDV and THEN realising they had no way to edit the footage, I've even fielded a frantic call from a DOP who shot a whole production on a HD100 at 25p and then found no one knew how to handle the footage, so it isn't just the weekend shooters with this problem. The Varicam seems to trip up a few local productions as well.
Hey Bob good to hear from someone else from the rental frontline.
Your experiences reflect ours with Canon and JVC.

I won't be going anywhere near a XLH1. Canon simply don't have the broadcast professional support we need. The amount of horror stories we have heard from XL2 owners and Canon service.

The JVC GY-HD101 is simply frustrating without the NLE 25p support. At the moment I have a very nice SD DV 25p camera for hire.

If you rent Varicams you will need to carry the HVX200 regardless of what you think of p2 and workflow.

What do you think of the 1/2" XDCAM's?. Not a road I'm keen to go down. With zoom, wide and a VTR you'll be looking at a 100K system.
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Old January 22nd, 2006, 02:38 PM   #18
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Hi Scott,

I saw your company ads on free NZ cameraman magazine. Maybe I can find out where you were in that photo in the ads. ;-)

By the way, do you know how many professional cameramen in New Zealand? 400?

TIA

Regards
Leigh
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Old January 22nd, 2006, 04:26 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leigh Wanstead
Hi Scott,

I saw your company ads on free NZ cameraman magazine. Maybe I can find out where you were in that photo in the ads. ;-)

By the way, do you know how many professional cameramen in New Zealand? 400?

TIA

Regards
Leigh
Depending on whether your version and my version of professional are the same, I would say less than 100.
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Old January 22nd, 2006, 04:38 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Scott Webster
Depending on whether your version and my version of professional are the same, I would say less than 100.
Hi Scott,

Thanks

My version of professional cameraman is make a living by shooting videos. Shoot videos as a full time job. Is that the same version as yours?

Regards
Leigh
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Old January 22nd, 2006, 06:19 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Leigh Wanstead
Hi Scott,

Thanks

My version of professional cameraman is make a living by shooting videos. Shoot videos as a full time job. Is that the same version as yours?

Regards
Leigh
Yes if that's what your putting on your tax return! But within the mix you have Film DOP, Film Camera Op, Lighting Cameraman Video, Camera Op Video, OB Cameraman, DV op, Owner Operator 2/3" Cam, Freelancer no gear, Steadicam Op, Network News cameraman, Network production cameraman and so on...

Still I'd be suprised if we hit 150...
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Old January 23rd, 2006, 07:14 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Webster
Hey Bob good to hear from someone else from the rental frontline.

What do you think of the 1/2" XDCAM's?. Not a road I'm keen to go down. With zoom, wide and a VTR you'll be looking at a 100K system.
The F350 looks VERY promising but as you've noted a bit rich for our client base, for ENG justifiable, probably we're figuring on an all up cost a bit under what you're talking about but even so to get a ROI the daily rate would have to be pretty high and then you have to find the clients who'd know how to get the most out of it. DB cameras down here are rediculously cheap compared to say PD170s to hire, lots of guys that have bought into that market segment doing their dough cold.

So the camera we're keen on is the Grass Valley InfinitiCam, the decks are small change as are the disks and the J2K codec is the way of the future, think much the same as everyone is using as a DI being recorded in the camera.

However we've not giving up on the XL H1, just hoping Canon have got their act together and made something solid.
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Old January 23rd, 2006, 01:46 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Bob Grant
The F350 looks VERY promising but as you've noted a bit rich for our client base, for ENG justifiable, probably we're figuring on an all up cost a bit under what you're talking about but even so to get a ROI the daily rate would have to be pretty high and then you have to find the clients who'd know how to get the most out of it.
Based on our the NZ exchange rate and US list price and a probable cost of NZ20K per 1/2" HD lens that puts us in the 70K+ region with deck to come.
That is an expensive 1/2" solution


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Grant
DB cameras down here are rediculously cheap compared to say PD170s to hire, lots of guys that have bought into that market segment doing their dough cold.
Yes from what I've heard Australia is infamous for there DB rates. Hence the reason the DVCAM DSR500/570/450 series never took off there like it did here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Grant
So the camera we're keen on is the Grass Valley InfinitiCam, the decks are small change as are the disks and the J2K codec is the way of the future, think much the same as everyone is using as a DI being recorded in the camera.
If they could gaurantee the upgrade to progressive for 24/25p capability,I'd be a bit more interested. Will they have a camera ready for NAB?
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Old January 23rd, 2006, 09:20 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Scott Webster

If they could gaurantee the upgrade to progressive for 24/25p capability,I'd be a bit more interested. Will they have a camera ready for NAB?
They'd better have it ready for NAB, I think the boss wants to sneak one back in his luggage :)

Actually I thought it did 24p/25p now but I could be wrong.
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Old January 25th, 2006, 05:35 AM   #25
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bit of a heads up for skippys

lol

OK, numbers jsut in...

HXV200 RRP $9700 inc GST with NO P2 Cards... (not bad.. i was advise this would be 15k as a start price.. glad to see its not.. waiting for preorders to come through.. but i honestly dont see this happeinng until PremPro2 and Vegas can confrm DVCPROHD support. Lets face it, here in aus, about 80% of independant studios working for broadcast output are using Premiere with Digisuite..
Alot of studios using Avid are looking at these as the P2 format works well for their kinda work.. bout 6 studios that i know of so far are looking at multiple units.. who knows maybe demand will force a lower price sooner than we thought..


Canon XLH1 - $14000 inc GST (already sold/preordered 2 for the Aus Army.. oops did i say that.. lol...nah theyre cool)

JVC HD101e - $9000 (ish) in GST still bloody cheap for HD progressive scan...
Z1- $7k when u consider 18 month ago this baby sold for $9300.... go firgure..

Sony XDCam F330 Body only no lense... hitting about the 20k mark, BUT no glass no battery. Upwards to $30k for a basic setup with a Fujinin HD lens
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Old January 25th, 2006, 05:49 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson
HXV200 RRP $9700 inc GST with NO P2 Cards... (not bad..

I agree, not bad at all... considering the NTSC model is US$6000, when you convert it & add GST etc it works out to about AU$9200.

Now the only thing I hope for is being able to do a mod or update so it can switch between NTSC & PAL like the Canon XL-H1 & Sony Z1.... I'm really hoping we can push for this feature....
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Old January 25th, 2006, 06:21 AM   #27
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why though??
i mean lets say u deliver to SD DVD... do the edit in PAL DV and youve got a higher resolution with a cleaner colour space, make the dvd regon free and itll play on anything..
as for the 60hz model i can only see the benefit for 720p, then i can only see the additional framerate as a benefit for overcranking.. considering this camera also records to DV tape, i realy dont see this 50/60hz switch happening... its just something Pana dont do...
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Old January 25th, 2006, 06:36 AM   #28
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It's not just about 50/60hertz its about the extra frame rates so there's much less work in post.... 720p 60fps is also another reason for even slower slo-mo...

To be able to shoot 24/25p, 50/60i, 50/60p in 720 mode would be beneficial....

I dont see the reason "Panasonic just doesn't make their cameras switchable" as being valid. Why can Sony & Canon give us the option? Paying for it is no problem like you have to on the XL-H1... just give us the option please Panasonic....
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Old January 25th, 2006, 07:25 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tung Bui
Who knows how it will turn out. I called up John Barry's to get a price on the dvx100 and they told me to just order on the internet because it was cheaper! They told me they had no choice on the pricing which was set by panasonic australia. Panasonic australia really killed the dvx100 in this country with their pricing and lack of advertising for this camera.
Isn't dictating a set price illegal? I know they can have a "recommended" a retail price at least.
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Old January 25th, 2006, 08:18 AM   #30
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As far as I can see all Camera manufacturers suck when it comes to after sales or warranty service.Once they get your hard earned $$$ its almost inpossible to get in contact with a person who can help.They expect you to spend hours looking at their Q&A on their web sites.If that doe't solve your problem then tuff shit,you'r on your own.
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